Boat Ownership Overseas

[neilky]

Hi,

I'm not looking for VAT or length of stay advice, that has been well discussed.

I am considering buying a boat in the canary islands as a bolt hole which you can sail. I'd plan to be there 6-8 weeks of the year, mostly in the 7 months of winter (October to April). Rubicon in Lanzarote seems to be a great sheltered option. Tell me what is wrong with this idea and why more people don't do it ? Also, what to do with the boat the rest of the time? Do I just put it on the hard or perhaps air b&b with help of a local?

Thoughts and critique welcome.

Thanks

 

[Graham376]

An increasing number of folks are dry sailing from yards since Brexit, just have the boat launched for every visit rather than paying a marina for 12 months.
Air B & B is a different ball gamer and from what I hear has to be registered/licensed and of course will have the complication of taxes to be paid. Doubt whether most marinas or yards will be too keen on strangers turning up to use a boat.

 

[neilky]

An increasing number of folks are dry sailing from yards since Brexit, just have the boat launched for every visit rather than paying a marina for 12 months.
Air B & B is a different ball gamer and from what I hear has to be registered/licensed and of course will have the complication of taxes to be paid. Doubt whether most marinas or yards will be too keen on strangers turning up to use a boat.

Thanks Graham, I'll look into that. I would have thought 3 lifts in and out plus hard standing fees would be more expensive than leaving it in the water but will definately check it out.

 

[Tranona]

Hi,

I'm not looking for VAT or length of stay advice, that has been well discussed.

I am considering buying a boat in the canary islands as a bolt hole which you can sail. I'd plan to be there 6-8 weeks of the year, mostly in the 7 months of winter (October to April). Rubicon in Lanzarote seems to be a great sheltered option. Tell me what is wrong with this idea and why more people don't do it ? Also, what to do with the boat the rest of the time? Do I just put it on the hard or perhaps air b&b with help of a local?

Thoughts and critique welcome.

Thanks

Why don't more people do it? - you have really answered your own question. It is not easy and tying up the money required to keep and run a boat 2000 miles away for only 6-8 weeks a year simply does not make sense for most people. You cannot earn money from it as you can't charter it out (and even if you could difficult to even cover costs let alone make a profit) nor B&B so you have to cover all the costs your self. One could argue that keeping a boat in the UK is similar because few get 8 weeks of use a year but at least it close to home.

As Graham says dry sailing is one way of doing it, assuming yards/marinas offer that service - that is what I did when I had my boat in Corfu, but best to have somebody local to look after the boat and launch it ready for you to go as soon as you arrive otherwise you can spend too much of your time organising things, doing maintenance etc rather than sailing. Worth thinking about what you do if your circumstances change or you fall out of love with it - may not be easy to sell and having a boat stuck out there running up costs can hurt.

So, not for everybody, but it has obvious attractions and only you can decide whether it is likely to work for you.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

For Lanzarote Captain Sensible is your man give him a PM he will be able to tell you the pros and cons about marinas, berths and dry sailing.

 

[Graham376]

Thanks Graham, I'll look into that. I would have thought 3 lifts in and out plus hard standing fees would be more expensive than leaving it in the water but will definately check it out.

Have you ever owned a boat? If not, there are many things to think about - cost of insurance, annual maintenance such as engine servicing, hull cleaning, antifouling, etc. if done professionally as many yards won't allow owners to work on boats. I think out of season charter when costs are lower would be a better bet.

 

[Irish Rover]

I live full time in Türkiye on the mid Aegean coast. I probably use my boat 300 days in the year including a 2 month cruise most years and a number of other trips away of a week or so duration. There are many boats in our marina which rarely go out, and others owned by foreigners, or Turks from the big cities, which are only used 4/6 weeks in the summer. The costs of keeping a boat are enormous and I console myself by dividing the cost by 300 and saying it's not that much per day's use. If I was dividing by 40 or 50 instead of 300 I'm not sure the stingy Paddy in me could live with it. Chartering would probably be cheaper.

 

[neilky]

Have you ever owned a boat? If not, there are many things to think about - cost of insurance, annual maintenance such as engine servicing, hull cleaning, antifouling, etc. if done professionally as many yards won't allow owners to work on boats. I think out of season charter when costs are lower would be a better bet.

Never owned a boat, was going to buy here but been held back by a lack of berthing locally. After experiencing the last 2 summers it seems like it would be hard to get the use out of it here. I currently spend 5 weeks a year in the Canaries in winter regardless and hotel costs are going through the roof hence my cunning plan. We are dropping about £3500 every winter on accomodation, berthing seems about £4000 plus maintenance costs. However, I don't know what I don't know with regards to executing that plan and have a poor understanding as to what I am in for in terms of boat ownership.

 

[neilky]

For Lanzarote Captain Sensible is your man give him a PM he will be able to tell you the pros and cons about marinas, berths and dry sailing.

Cheers, will do.

 

[neilky]

I live full time in Türkiye on the mid Aegean coast. I probably use my boat 300 days in the year including a 2 month cruise most years and a number of other trips away of a week or so duration. There are many boats in our marina which rarely go out, and others owned by foreigners, or Turks from the big cities, which are only used 4/6 weeks in the summer. The costs of keeping a boat are enormous and I console myself by dividing the cost by 300 and saying it's not that much per day's use. If I was dividing by 40 or 50 instead of 300 I'm not sure the stingy Paddy in me could live with it. Chartering would probably be cheaper.

Very nice! I'm chartering at Christmas from Tenerife and after hunting around, the best deal I coud get was £3750 for 2 weeks. If chartering was cheaper it would be a no brainer.

 

[Graham376]

Never owned a boat, was going to buy here but been held back by a lack of berthing locally. After experiencing the last 2 summers it seems like it would be hard to get the use out of it here. I currently spend 5 weeks a year in the Canaries in winter regardless and hotel costs are going through the roof hence my cunning plan. We are dropping about £3500 every winter on accomodation, berthing seems about £4000 plus maintenance costs. However, I don't know what I don't know with regards to executing that plan and have a poor understanding as to what I am in for in terms of boat ownership.

Do you have any sailing qualifications? You will need to find out which are needed to own say a Spanish registered boat in the canaries. Unfortunately, I doubt your plans will work out.

 

[Irish Rover]

Very nice! I'm chartering at Christmas from Tenerife and after hunting around, the best deal I coud get was £3750 for 2 weeks. If chartering was cheaper it would be a no brainer.

You could have 4 x 2 weeks at that price for less than I pay per year for marina fees, insurance, antifouling, and routine maintenance .

 

[neilky]

You could have 4 x 2 weeks at that price for less than I pay per year for marina fees, insurance, antifouling, and routine maintenance .

Do you have any sailing qualifications? You will need to find out which are needed to own say a Spanish registered boat in the canaries. Unfortunately, I doubt your plans will work out.

Do you have any sailing qualifications? You will need to find out which are needed to own say a Spanish registered boat in the canaries. Unfortunately, I doubt your plans will work out.

Yes, day Skipper.

 

[neilky]

You could have 4 x 2 weeks at that price for less than I pay per year for marina fees, insurance, antifouling, and routine maintenance .

Ouch, what size is your cat?

 

[Metalicmike]

I bought a boat in the Tenerife. Buying the boat is the easy bit, the hardest is finding a suitable mooring and moorings in the Canaries can be hard to find and the months that you are targeting coincide with the congregation of cruisers for the ARC of which there are now two. The best time to find moorings is when the second Arc has departed. In Lanzarote some marinas do not offer moorings around this time as they reserve moorings especially for these cruisers. Secondly you need to think about access to the marina from the airport, so basically buying the boat is easy but don't assume that the mooring is transferable. Lastly Registration, the Spanish expect all vessels sailing in their waters to be Spanish flagged however I think there are exceptions to EU flagged boats and mine is Polish flagged and so far I haven't had a problem but the rules are unclear so if i am stopped by the Guardia civil i don't know what would happen. Lastly if you rent it out illegally it could be impounded, if you leave it in a Marina they will have a copy of your insurance, registration document and passport and you will be flagged as soon as you arrive at the airport.

 

[Zing]

Never owned a boat, was going to buy here but been held back by a lack of berthing locally. After experiencing the last 2 summers it seems like it would be hard to get the use out of it here. I currently spend 5 weeks a year in the Canaries in winter regardless and hotel costs are going through the roof hence my cunning plan. We are dropping about £3500 every winter on accomodation, berthing seems about £4000 plus maintenance costs. However, I don't know what I don't know with regards to executing that plan and have a poor understanding as to what I am in for in terms of boat ownership.

Your budget is not huge I suspect. You have checked marina costs for the size of boat you would buy - it’s a lot, but only the start. Consider you boat’s price and reckon maybe 10% to 20% of that cost for just maintenance if it’s an old one. Plus a bit or maybe nothing if lucky for depreciation in our inflationary world now. If it’s newish then depreciation is massively more so as to totally eclypse maintenance. Don’t forget lost interest or the opportunity cost of the capital, say 6%. Then insurance, say 2.5% of hull value. Add it all up - it’s not a pretty picture. My marina costs are a small percentage of the total budget.

 

[neilky]

Your budget is not huge I suspect. You have checked marina costs for the size of boat you would buy - it’s a lot, but only the start. Consider you boat’s price and reckon maybe 10% to 20% of that cost for just maintenance if it’s an old one. Plus a bit or maybe nothing if lucky for depreciation in our inflationary world now. If it’s newish then depreciation is massively more so as to totally eclypse maintenance. Don’t forget lost interest or the opportunity cost of the capital, say 6%. Then insurance, say 2.5% of hull value. Add it all up - it’s not a pretty picture. My marina costs are a small percentage of the total budget.

That's a good point re the capital interest lost, hadn't factored that.

 

[Irish Rover]

Ouch, what size is your cat?

13M but the costs relative to size are probably higher for smaller boats.

 

[greeny]

And to get to basics, most people on airbb will not have any boat experience. Prepare yourself for lots of blocked bogs and other such incidentals.

 

[neilky]

I bought a boat in the Tenerife. Buying the boat is the easy bit, the hardest is finding a suitable mooring and moorings in the Canaries can be hard to find and the months that you are targeting coincide with the congregation of cruisers for the ARC of which there are now two. The best time to find moorings is when the second Arc has departed. In Lanzarote some marinas do not offer moorings around this time as they reserve moorings especially for these cruisers. Secondly you need to think about access to the marina from the airport, so basically buying the boat is easy but don't assume that the mooring is transferable. Lastly Registration, the Spanish expect all vessels sailing in their waters to be Spanish flagged however I think there are exceptions to EU flagged boats and mine is Polish flagged and so far I haven't had a problem but the rules are unclear so if i am stopped by the Guardia civil i don't know what would happen. Lastly if you rent it out illegally it could be impounded, if you leave it in a Marina they will have a copy of your insurance, registration document and passport and you will be flagged as soon as you arrive at the airport.

I was going to rent legally! I assume these are legal ? https://www.booking.com/searchresul...children=0&nflt=price=GBP-min-100-1;ht_id=215