Boat in build pics (Squadron 78)

[burgundyben]

(by the way, the little blue box above it in the pic is the worm drive electric actuator for one of the seacocks)

Fab new bateau JFM.

So the blue box allows you to remotely control the sea cock. Are they all going to be like it?Why? Poor Access?

Lots of gear on the boat, vast opportunity for gear failures, heading away from pleasure boat kit into the realms of kit built to a higher standard for commercial purposes I suppose.

 

[jfm]

First pic of the damaged leg also...

Is the 78 heading 'down under' the first to come here? Did they say where abouts? Love to see aboard one. The progress on yours appears quite quick.

Yup that's the leg - nearly mended!

They have sold a few 78s down under, especially recently due to very strong AUD versus £. I don't know for sure but I think they've sold 3 or 4 approx, and at least a couple already delivered. Ditto sunseeker and Princess afaik in terms of bigger boat sales due to the currency. The Sq78 currently in build is for someone famous in Aus, I'll PM you in case you know him

 

[jfm]

"fuel polishing"

I did think about this Ian but I gotta say a big part of me thinks it's a solution to a problem I don't have. In 8 years of med boating I've never had problem fuel - the fuel supply chain is much better than UK. My regular fuel supplier is so fastidious that they fill the tanks plus 2 sealed sample bottles of which I and they keep one to prove fault if ever there was a prob.

My fuel doesn't get stale cos I use it fairly fast

I have a customs extras list of about 70 items on the boat and it's not a cheap project so I thought several thousand £'s more on fuel polishing could be left off. You do have to draw some lines somewhere! Hope I made the right choice. Most of all, there are enough take off points in the plumbing that it can be retrofitted anyway if the need arises

BTW the three tanks are fully valved. They can be isolated or joined. Literally any of the engines and gensets can draw from any tank and return to the same or any other tank. So if awkward fuel were suspected but had to be bought, it could be taken on in just one tank till I am happy it is good fuel

Cheers

 

[jfm]

So the blue box allows you to remotely control the sea cock. Are they all going to be like it?Why? Poor Access?

No, the access is fine. I'm only having electrics on the three back tank discharge seacocks, as part of a custom set up for black tank that Fairlinea re doing to my spec. It's a copy of what was in my Sq58, only x 3 on this boat. It's nothing special, just short discharge pipes with no above-waterline swan necks, electric seacocks, microswitches to dash lights to tell me seacocks open/shut, and simple electrical interfacres so the dump pumps only runs when seacock open (to stop someone inverting my duckbill valves - been there done that), and Sealand Tank Managers so I can select discharge and go and do something else, and it will all empty the tank and then turn itself off when the tank empty light comes on

Lots of gear on the boat, vast opportunity for gear failures, heading away from pleasure boat kit into the realms of kit built to a higher standard for commercial purposes I suppose.

Yup. I'll buy plenty of spares to manage gear failures, which are bound to happen. At least I can store them in racks that I can reach, not lost in bilges. I'm very comfortable that the risk of failure due to builder error is as small as it gets: the build team on the 78 are very careful, fussy and skilled, and proud of what they build. I am seeing the workmanship close up and it's reassuring.

 

[Whitelighter]

Posts like these are never boring John, thanks for taking the time to post everything so far.

She is certainly taking shape and looks great. I like what you are doing with the dash mod and really looking forward to seeing some more of the detail - so please keep posting pics when you can.

Jez

 

[Lozzer]

JFM

Just thought of a couple of things that are missing on the 78 I am on.

Firstly trim tab indicators, always a nice to have save you huniting around for the right level. I can gain upto a knot extra by trimming the boat properly. I was told that there would be no need to use them unless going into a head sea!!

Secondly, the service hatch at the bottom of the stairs where the Aircon chillers are. This is great storage space but getting in and out is a pain as you have to remove the hatch. See if they can put a hinge on it and it will save you a lot of effort.

Dont forget to move the camera on the aft deck, ours gives a poor view of the world as you saw.

I am still very impressed with the 78, handling is a treat.

Lozzer

 

[benjenbav]

Fascinating pictures, thanks again for sharing them. Out of nothing but simple curiosity, is it possible for the factory to start working on the boat as soon as the hull comes out of the mould or is there a curing period beyond the point when the mould is removed?

 

[Hurricane]

No, the access is fine. I'm only having electrics on the three back tank discharge seacocks, as part of a custom set up for black tank that Fairlinea re doing to my spec. It's a copy of what was in my Sq58, only x 3 on this boat. It's nothing special, just short discharge pipes with no above-waterline swan necks, electric seacocks, microswitches to dash lights to tell me seacocks open/shut, and simple electrical interfacres so the dump pumps only runs when seacock open (to stop someone inverting my duckbill valves - been there done that), and Sealand Tank Managers so I can select discharge and go and do something else, and it will all empty the tank and then turn itself off when the tank empty light comes on



Yup. I'll buy plenty of spares to manage gear failures, which are bound to happen. At least I can store them in racks that I can reach, not lost in bilges. I'm very comfortable that the risk of failure due to builder error is as small as it gets: the build team on the 78 are very careful, fussy and skilled, and proud of what they build. I am seeing the workmanship close up and it's reassuring.

We had a failure on our Sealand (I think it made by Sealand) Tank Manager system. Princess provided a complete set of parts and it turned out to be the control box so If I were you, I'd make sure that at least one of those goes on your spares list - also a set of wiring looms helps diagnose things.

 

[Mr Googler]

Love It

We Want More....We Want More

Keep it coming John. Extremely Impressive stuff. Shame they havent intevented clear GRP so you can admire all this top work all the time!!

 

[iangrant]

Trim tab indicators

JFM

Just thought of a couple of things that are missing on the 78 I am on.

Firstly trim tab indicators, always a nice to have save you huniting around for the right level. I can gain upto a knot extra by trimming the boat properly. I was told that there would be no need to use them unless going into a head sea!!

Secondly, the service hatch at the bottom of the stairs where the Aircon chillers are. This is great storage space but getting in and out is a pain as you have to remove the hatch. See if they can put a hinge on it and it will save you a lot of effort.

Dont forget to move the camera on the aft deck, ours gives a poor view of the world as you saw.

I am still very impressed with the 78, handling is a treat.

Lozzer

The Garmin kit we're told being installed will display the trim tabs 0-100 and can be configured to "pop up" on any working function of the GM10, or/and it can be scrolled to.

The rudder angle indicator can also interface and display on the helm controller display.

Camera - also interface onto GPS map.

DON't forget the cooling fans if the displays are housed!

Ian

 

[Hurricane]

jfm

Just a thought - brought on by cameras mentioned by iangrant above.

Someone once said to me that a reall good use for a camera is just under the bow - above the anchor.
I'm sure you will understand the point.
A camera to see the anchor (particularly during recovery) would be a good thing.
In our case, its SWMBO's job to run the foredeck and that includes setting and recovering the anchor.
However, I always wish I could also see how it is progressing - do I move off - do I wait - is it all going to plan etc.... would be really useful input to the helm.

For those who set and recover the anchor from the helm position - and I know most people do - wouldnt it be helpful to see the anchor as it breaks the water.

It took me about six months to get the hang of using our rear facing docking cameras - I wouldnt want to be without them now. I would definately consider fitting a bow camera if I were specifying another boat.

Just a little "food for thought"

Mike

 

[MapisM]

Various pics follow – hope not too dull

Not dull at all, rather the opposite, very interesting.
Many thanks for sharing your pics and comments with us!

Just a few thoughts, fwiw:
Is the tabs arrangement due to the space required by the platform movements? Because I can't see any advantage in that recessed placement. Actually, from a functional viewpoint, the good old position attached to the transom is better, I reckon. Besides, tell me that those aren't the plastic Bennet things, urgh!
By chilled water piping, you mean chilled or heated I guess. Or are you fitting a separate heating?
Assuming that the main tanks are near the COG, the third one seems what, 10' or so in front of them? It might as well work as a dynamic ballast for different sea conditions, if there's a way to move the fuel back and forth between the mains and the third tank (when they're not all full, of course). Just a thought.
The cut in the lift strip where the stab fins will be placed doesn't seem as long as the fins. Will they be placed in such way that the upper part of the fin will remain below the lift strip? And if so, doesn't the distance from the rest of the hull create any problem from an hydrodinamic viewpoint?

 

[aquapower]

Is the tabs arrangement due to the space required by the platform movements? Because I can't see any advantage in that recessed placement. Actually, from a functional viewpoint, the good old position attached to the transom is better, I reckon. Besides, tell me that those aren't the plastic Bennet things, urgh!

Whats wrong with the Bennett trim tabs? they are one of th emost reliable although I cant belive they dont fit the indicators as standard, from memory its less than £200 extra when ordering the kit.

They will work just as well being recessed and probrably wont be needed much on a boat of this length.

The big cutter being used to fit stabilisers is almost the same as the one I have for fitting bow thrusters and yes I also find Sleipner very helpfull and nothings ever a problem, I usually speak to Bryn who I also remember from his days with Barrus

 

[jfm]

JFM

Just thought of a couple of things that are missing on the 78 I am on.

Firstly trim tab indicators, always a nice to have save you huniting around for the right level. I can gain upto a knot extra by trimming the boat properly. I was told that there would be no need to use them unless going into a head sea!!

Secondly, the service hatch at the bottom of the stairs where the Aircon chillers are. This is great storage space but getting in and out is a pain as you have to remove the hatch. See if they can put a hinge on it and it will save you a lot of effort.

Dont forget to move the camera on the aft deck, ours gives a poor view of the world as you saw.

I am still very impressed with the 78, handling is a treat.

Lozzer

Hi Lozzer
I didn't bother speccing indicators on the tabs as I've never had them and don't miss them. I just pull the tabs fully up to start with, then lower them till I feel they're ok. In fact I drive 95% of the time with no tabs. They're already installed and I have lots of other things keeping Fairline busy, so I'll leave as is and retrofit the indicators if I need them

Yup I know what you mean about service hatch. Thing is, I wouldn't want hinge pins right on the edge where you can feel them as you walk over them. So the hinges would need to be "curved arm" type, like on a car boot. That's quite a mission, engineeringwise, on a one off, and I wouldn't ask them to do it. I'll do this myself next Spring while the boat is hanging around in Essex/Solent awaiting delivery

They're now putting the aft camera on the mast following our discussion. I sent them the pic below. The red lines represent (approx) the viewing angle on yours - you can't see a person waiting at the end of the passerelle, on the dock, as you know. The yellow line shows the camera on the mast and this looks good - can see the whole platform for docking, and people on the dock. The green lines are my side docking cameras and they are pointing too low but I asked Fairline to leave these as is and I will make little wedge shaped polo mints out of white plastic to angle the camera back, ie more horizontal, so I can see to the aft corners of the swim plaform

 

[jfm]

Fascinating pictures, thanks again for sharing them. Out of nothing but simple curiosity, is it possible for the factory to start working on the boat as soon as the hull comes out of the mould or is there a curing period beyond the point when the mould is removed?

They don't wait, though mine was out of the mould a couple of weeks before much happened with it, due to the boat in front being not ready to move along the line. They cure fully during the build process, but are cured enough to start building on as soon as the come out of the mould

There is a fast cure for most polyesters (see eg the Scott Bader data sheets) but it involves initial cure at 20deg then a blast at 70deg. Unfortunately Fairline dont have an autoclave big enough for this hull

 

[jfm]

We had a failure on our Sealand (I think it made by Sealand) Tank Manager system. Princess provided a complete set of parts and it turned out to be the control box so If I were you, I'd make sure that at least one of those goes on your spares list - also a set of wiring looms helps diagnose things.

Thanks Hurric. TBH, I find Sealand stuff modstly ok but a bit plasticky on occasions. I'm more familiar with it than I want to be, in the rubber gloves sense. I could have had Sealand Vacuflush heads on this boat but deliberately didn't and chose Tecmas. With the tank manager system there is a little control box actually on the black tank and another on the dash with the indicator lights. Which one failed?

I have redundancy with three tanks and three tank managers, anyway

 

[jfm]

The Garmin kit we're told being installed will display the trim tabs 0-100 and can be configured to "pop up" on any working function of the GM10, or/and it can be scrolled to.

I'd need NMEA2000 transducers on the hydraulic cylinders for that. Do you know of a source of those?

Just to be fair to Raymarine, everything you say works on their nmea2000 (STNG as they call it) system and displays too!

 

[jfm]

camera is just under the bow - above the anchor.

That would be very handy Mike. i never hought of it - usually I have someone at the bow when weighing anchor, and painted chain so I know when it breaks the surface, but a camera would be handy

BTW, the boat will have those Lewmar anchor control panels with chain counter display etc.

 

[wakeup]

Great boat JFM but when do we get to hear about the above and below water lighting and latest OB feature developments.

 

[jfm]

Not dull at all, rather the opposite, very interesting.
Many thanks for sharing your pics and comments with us!

Just a few thoughts, fwiw:
Is the tabs arrangement due to the space required by the platform movements? Because I can't see any advantage in that recessed placement. Actually, from a functional viewpoint, the good old position attached to the transom is better, I reckon. Besides, tell me that those aren't the plastic Bennet things, urgh!
By chilled water piping, you mean chilled or heated I guess. Or are you fitting a separate heating?
Assuming that the main tanks are near the COG, the third one seems what, 10' or so in front of them? It might as well work as a dynamic ballast for different sea conditions, if there's a way to move the fuel back and forth between the mains and the third tank (when they're not all full, of course). Just a thought.
The cut in the lift strip where the stab fins will be placed doesn't seem as long as the fins. Will they be placed in such way that the upper part of the fin will remain below the lift strip? And if so, doesn't the distance from the rest of the hull create any problem from an hydrodinamic viewpoint?

On all previous 78s, the tabs have been fully recessed. Ie trialing edge of tab level with transom. From now on, mine being the first, they have moved the tabs aft so the hydraulics are only slightly recessed and the tab is mainly sticking out. Reason is just to give another square metre of lift, which they say is becoming necessary with owners speccing heavier boats. My boat is heavy amidships if I fill it with fuel but i hope it will be light aft due to no jetski, but there agian I have laundry mahinery aft, etc. Anyway, seems a good idea. I prefer the hydrualics slightly recessed like this, rahter than fully stuck out. Protection from debris etc

Yes they're Bennett cylinders. In 7 seasons they have never let me down. I like em! Though I agree with you they feel like you got them in a christmas cracker

Yes, the a/c is reverse cycle, so heated or chilled water in the pipes

Yes pumping fuel can be done to dynamically ballast the boat. I doubt I'll do it in practice. Fwiw here are the fuel tank positions in red, but remember it's 6000 litres (=~5tonnes) in the aft tanks and 1270litres (= #1 tonne) in the forward tank, with not much fore-aft distance, so it might be easier just to trim the boat with the tabs! Also there is a 1140 litres of water (=1.14tonnes) in the tank marked yellow below and I can dump that if I want bow down (and use the watermaker to re-make it when I get to my destination)

Ha, I KNEW when I posted that you would spot the spray rail/lift strip thing! On this first stabiliser boat, Fairline didn't know the exact fin positions so they moulded the lift strips in (with a few layers of glass mat) but then filled the V groove in the mould and laid up the main hull GRP striaght across, so bridging across the groove in the mould for the strip. Then they have cut the strip off on the outside to match the stab fins, and they will hand-repair the gelcoat. By doing so, the integrity of the hull is protected because the glass roving/matt is bridged straight across the strip groove. The stab fins will therefore be within a few mm of the hull, which is necessary as you know to avoid vortexes. They stab fins have winglets at the bottom to reduce vortexes

At the point of that photo, they had cut off some of the lift strip but they haven't finished and will cut more off, to match the 1500mm length of the fin. One nice coincidence is that the stab fin will be perfectly in line with the lift strip

On later builds I expect they will just fill the groove in the mould with a plugging piece, if future buyers order stabs