Boat buying nerves

j24jam said:
I am, but happy to be proven otherwise.

You may get an unsecured loan, but not one where the lender has a charge against the boat, as it must be p1 registered in order to place the secured loan on it.

I should add some lenders will lend small amounts against a boat if they keep possession of the Title documents (rather than registering a charge on the p1 registry), so you couldn't sell the boat on without them (unless buyer was stupid enough to buy a boat with no documents).

(I suppose someone may lend money against the boat, if they took possession of it until it is paid back, but then the owner couldn't sell it on anyway)
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This is way out of my depth, but I'm not convinced a boat must be part 1 registered in order to have a loan against it.
A quick search found this thread: Boat finance
 
In fact this post: Boat finance is exactly the sort of thing I'm talking about.

If a boat owner signs a piece of paper with a finance company saying they have a right to sell his boat if he defaults on payments, presumably that agreement still stands if he dishonestly sells the boat, part 1 registered or not.
 
With the loans not reg on Part 1 and thus invisible to normal broker due diligence.

Could a heads of terms , the contract or even a BoS have words to the effect of “ I sell this boat with no liens , debt , loans etc and if such were to appear after the sale accept full responsibility for them .Obviously professionally legal worded to reflect the seller still had liability for these .


In the Med and i guess to a smaller extent in the U.K. , although this is quite a geographical shift seller to buyer ….
The advised wisdom is to sail away ideally to another country and immediately change the name .
Ok the HIN s still riveted on in almost illegible font from 6 ft away .But what iam saying a quick name change adds a shield to repossession as does with Med boats re flagging and moving geographically esp across a border .

Sort of sum of many small actions .
 
Portofino said:
With the loans not reg on Part 1 and thus invisible to normal broker due diligence.

Could a heads of terms , the contract or even a BoS have words to the effect of “ I sell this boat with no liens , debt , loans etc and if such were to appear after the sale accept full responsibility for them .Obviously professionally legal worded to reflect the seller still had liability for these .


In the Med and i guess to a smaller extent in the U.K. , although this is quite a geographical shift seller to buyer ….
The advised wisdom is to sail away ideally to another country and immediately change the name .
Ok the HIN s still riveted on in almost illegible font from 6 ft away .But what iam saying a quick name change adds a shield to repossession as does with Med boats re flagging and moving geographically esp across a border .

Sort of sum of many small actions .
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The problem is a dishonest seller will have no problem signing that piece of paper saying it has no debts.

However, he has no legal right to discharge those debts without the agreement of the other party (the lender) who clearly wouldn’t agree to it!

So the piece of paper effectively means nothing at all.

Yes you could sue the seller but if he’s in debt that’s a straw man argument.

Agree about ‘re register the boat pdq’.
 
jakew009 said:
The problem is a dishonest seller will have no problem signing that piece of paper saying it has no debts.

However, he has no legal right to discharge those debts without the agreement of the other party (the lender) who clearly wouldn’t agree to it!

So the piece of paper effectively means nothing at all.

Yes you could sue the seller but if he’s in debt that’s a straw man argument.

Agree about ‘re register the boat pdq’.
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Yes thats correct, the BOS has a declaration on it that states there are no liens, encumbrances etc however if the seller fraudulently signs this knowing there is a debt against the boat, the only option is to sue them. Plus report it to the police, as it is fraud.
 
Post 31 is just anecdote - not evidence that a good faith buyer is liable for debts of the seller even if "secured" against the boat. You need to know all the details of the case before deciding whether it is relevant to your situation.

The reality is that lending against boats, particularly lower value, is rare these days for all the reasons I explained in the 2015 post linked to above. It is not profitable business for banks unless the sum is large, the LTV ratio low and security sound both in terms of the borrower and the nature of the security offered. Registered mortgage is preferred, but holding documents is an alternative. Both these will show up quickly in a broker's search.

However there is always the chance of other ad hoc arrangements, for example private lending agreements, or third parties able to show they have an interest in the boat, for example a spouse who contributed to the purchase of the boat but title was only in one name. By their nature these are difficult to discover, but in the event of a dispute courts would generally side with the good faith buyer. As noted earlier signing a BoS declaration is a legal statement and it is fraud if it turns out not to be true.

Thousands of boats change hands every year without difficulty because most people are honest. The value of using a third party is in both doing the legwork and ensuring the security of the money exchanges using a well tried system. If you are confident with doing this yourself (as the OP seems to be) then no need for the third party. All about your attitude to risk in the circumstances.
 
Good luck Jake, sounds like you've taken a view as many of us have in the past.

I look forward to hearing it arrived safely later today. Please post some snaps.
 
I’m glad I went through with this purchase, in hindsight the seller was a complete gentleman to deal with.

Now I’ve got it safely back in my local yacht club (currently sat in the crane waiting for tides next week) I’ve had a chance to have a good rummage through it whilst I give it a polish and re antifoul.

It’s in much better condition than I remember it being in when I looked through it and the seller has left everything on board which makes a nice change. And when I turned on the chartplotter I realised it has a Raymarine AIS700 transceiver tucked away somewhere 😁 that’s worth a grand.

Compared to the last boat where a small part of me died inside when I realised quite how awful condition it was in, this one is great.
 
This was day 2 of my last boat premiership :LOL:

Miles of crappy old cable covered in the most disgusting black substance known to man

516EC14D-ADC6-48E9-8E6E-987ABCF5D989.jpeg
 
Obviously the previous owner never cut a cable because he always assumed he was getting a bigger boat...a man after my own heart
 
j24jam said:
We (Hamble based brokerage) offer conveyancing only for 3% (plus VAT if applicable) - half our normal brokerage fee.

It is quite common place for brokers to offer this when a client comes with a deal all agreed.
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So on a £100,000 boat. What services in detail would you do for £3,000. Just read the whole thread a see you answered this
 
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