boat brands - prejudice or reality

[barca nova]

I've been sailing since the likes of Westerly and Moody were in their pomp so my 5 boats so far have all been British. I have looked down on BeJenBav as I still do on the likes of Renault cars. But I am now about to buy a new ( to me) boat, the classic Swedish and decent british ( Vancouver) are expensive in the second hand market and not very numerous at that. The Vancouver is a pretty old design.

In the age range ( post 2000) I am considering there is a huge difference in price between say Beneteau and the swedes or to put it another way I can buy a much newer French boats for the same money.

So my question is this : is the reputational difference really justified. Can I get a French ( or German) boat that will sail as well and handle weather as well as the "Swedes". Is the difference just the MFI interiors of the likes of say Hanse compared to the solid wood of the Swedes. After all, engines , masts , sails etc will all be the same - its only hulls , interiors and construction standards where there might be a difference

Apart from the fanboys that there will be for any brand, are there any surveyors on here who might be more dispassionate?

 

[RunAgroundHard]

No, the reputational differences are not justified, they are just biases, maintain an open mind.

I think we have to be very careful of prejudices as they can ill serve personal needs and wants. We also need to be honest with what needs and wants are i.e. always sail in fair weather, short coastal jaunts or is it realistic to expect heavy weather frequently, or will most of the time be with friends and family entertaining on the boat rather than deep sea voyaging.

There is no doubt that all the boat manufacturers you state sell models that will do all of the above. Put your prejudices aside, work out what you really need based on desired usage and look across the brands. For the same money there are outstanding vessels, well appointed, well maintained and when compared to other models, the other models are left wanting.

So do your research, plan well, then look about and buy the best boat for your cash that suits your needs and don't let brand bias interfere with that process.

I don't think MFI makes interiors for yachts, but the right MFD is an excellent material for interior furniture carcasses.

 

[paulbrown22]

What do you plan to do with the boat?

Clearly there is a difference in quality of construction, hull strength, weight, level of interior fit out, design, layout, systems installation, tankage, etc., but that's not the be all and end all. The masts may both be Selden items, but the way it's secured, diameter (and potentially number) of stays, etc. is likely to be different on e.g. an HR vs. a Bavaria, which may or may not matter depending on your intended usage.

Depending on your use case, a more modern BeJenBav might be a good/better option for you and in many cases will probably offer better interior volume and flow for the same length, but I don't think anyone can argue they are built to the same quality as e.g. an HR.

 

[ylop]

Your car analogy is probably fair. Would you rather have a 10 yr old volvo or a 6yr old renault/citroen/peugot. [the volvo comparison might be better if I used BMW/Audi - but they aren't swedish!]. There isn't a clear cut one/other question here. One might be more comfortable, one might be more likely to still be in good shape when its 20 yrs old, one might sell for more money in 5 yrs time, a 6yr old engine well maintained might be better nick than a 10 yr old thats had minimal maintenance or vice versa, and the 10 yr old interior might be missing some of the modern "tools" you would expect, or you might personally not to have them or want to update them all anyway.

Ultimately though you might way up all the pro's and con's and still make an irrational decision on paper because you've always wanted to own X or Y just looks better or your wife preferred it. Like cars though you'll hear a lot of people with strong opinions, many of whom have never owned the brand they are critiquing.

 

[flaming]

What do you plan to do with the boat?

Clearly there is a difference in quality of construction, hull strength, weight, level of interior fit out, design, layout, systems installation, tankage, etc., but that's not the be all and end all. The masts may both be Selden items, but the way it's secured, diameter (and potentially number) of stays, etc. is likely to be different on e.g. an HR vs. a Bavaria, which may or may not matter depending on your intended usage.

Depending on your use case, a more modern BeJenBav might be a good/better option for you and in many cases will probably offer better interior volume and flow for the same length, but I don't think anyone can argue they are built to the same quality as e.g. an HR.

Often it's not advisable to look too closely at the displacement figures if you're attempting to make the argument that Sweedish etc are "stronger built" than the equivalent Jen/Ben/Bav. Especially if you're also arguing that the interior fit out is heavier and more durable on the "quality" model.

Where I see the difference between brands is in 2 things - 1 the attention to detail in the fit out. I.e if you open a locker is it rough fiberglass inside or has it been finished. Little clues like that.
And 2 the quality of the gear fitted. Very often you can look at the deck gear on the Jen/Ben/Bav and see underspecced, plain bearing blocks. And winches that are a size down from what you'd really like.

But... The reality of how the vast majority of people use their boats is that any well maintained production boat from the early 2000s is perfectly capable of cruising UK waters and crossing to the continent. Honestly if I was looking at that sector I'd be more swayed by layout that I liked and evidence that it had been well cared for than I would by what brand was written on the side. And if all else was equal I'd buy the one that had an instrument upgrade - that can get expensive....

 

[SaltyC]

I agree with flaming resize and quality of deck fittings having a single line reefing pennant fail so 'lost' the 1st reef in main and original (10 yr old) genoa was badly stretched - going to windward was difficult on that delivery.

However, if buying a pre loved boat I would lije to see maintenance and gear records and check accessibility for future replacements - is access acailable os tge boat built around the heads / engine etc