Big y insurance increase

markc said:
Mine is roughly double the cost per 1000 than you're paying!
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High risk these south of france folk !

Mine was inflated by cruising range. They also seem to use the boat detail more than anyone else. My squadron 58 was more per thousand than a friends princess 61. Same age same marina. They did not know why so discounted it !

email him and ask / tell him what you are willing to pay
 
Just renewed and its turned out 10 pound cheaper.

No real deviation of terms, although our insured value is nothing like some on here. So we don't get wrapped round the axle too much of the minor detail.

The important note for us [@27ft] was the previously mentioned unattended clause. It is now 17ft:

'Unless agreed by us, cover for sinking or swamping whilst the vessel is unattended is excluded if the vessel is less than 17 feet and the maximum designed speed is in excess of 17 knots'

(y)
 
LBRodders said:
Just renewed and its turned out 10 pound cheaper.

No real deviation of terms, although our insured value is nothing like some on here. So we don't get wrapped round the axle too much of the minor detail.

The important note for us [@27ft] was the previously mentioned unattended clause. It is now 17ft:

'Unless agreed by us, cover for sinking or swamping whilst the vessel is unattended is excluded if the vessel is less than 17 feet and the maximum designed speed is in excess of 17 knots'

(y)
Click to expand...
I take your design speed is on a trailer as it does not see water much .
 
seastoke said:
I take your design speed is on a trailer as it does not see water much .
Click to expand...

Yeah yeah stokes..

You'll do well this year to get more distance in than us. You'll need the head start and a lot of trips to the black water pump out pontoon in the marina ?
 
LBRodders said:
Yeah yeah stokes..

You'll do well this year to get more distance in than us. You'll need the head start and a lot of trips to the black water pump out pontoon in the marina ?
Click to expand...
Well surely one does not empty in the where your children dip their toes while sitting g on the trailer.
 
Just had mine through from Navigators & General. 8% increase. Part of that (2%) due to increase in Spanish tax. £4.42 per £1k (£716k agreed value inc tender)
 
I just got my Topsail - Y insurance renewal quote. It is now double what it was two years ago and at nearly 2% of hull value plus IPT (Max NCD and Caribbean). So by my reckoning to make this a profitable business the actuaries reckon that a little less than the value of one in 50 boats must be damaged or destroyed every year. The main hurricane risks are excluded. Something is amiss here.
 
I have just spent the last couple of weeks looking at my insurance.
My old policy expires at the beginning of May so I asked Topsail for their proposals at the beginning of this month.
In fact, they were already on the case so it didn't actually need chasing.

I then picked a few brokers to see what was available.
Thanks to jrudge and others on here, I was able to "narrow down" the criteria (cruising areas and excesses etc).
After a few quotes, it was clear that there were no "special offers" from Topsail on the table.
Out of those brokers that I contacted, I then chose a "short list" to work on.

Apart from a few oddballs, my choice narrowed down to two underwriters:-

1 - Our old Y underwriter (MS Amlin) now available through Haven Knox Johnston
2 - Navigators and General - who Topsail were recommending

When you read through these two policies, you will see that 95% of the wording is identical.
But there are some small differences in the detail.
Now - have I heard that before - "The Devil is in the Detail"
An example - the N&G policy has this statement -
Vessels less than 8.5 metres (28 feet) in length and RIBs (rigid inflatable boat) of any length, being stolen, swamped, stranded, sunk, or breaking adrift whilst moored or anchored unattended off an exposed beach or shore.
So, If I go to lunch and my tender gets stolen, it isn't covered.
I'm sure if you asked Topsail, they would woffle around this - but that is what it says.
So after a lot of reading, and IMHO, policies underwritten by Navigators and General have a few nasties that don't appear in the Haven Knox Johnston alternative.
I haven't compared to last year's Y policy documents because that option isn't available anymore but I suspect that last year's policy is very similar the Haven Knox Johnston because MS Amlin (that Y used) is still there behind the scenes.

Whilst we are on the subject of nasties.
Both the N&G and the HKJ wording have a few twists in the "betterment clause"
This is where items are 5 years or more old and they don't provide new for old.
Items like covers are understandable but they both include the tender in their list of items.
I have a particularly high value tender so these "betterment" clauses are a bit of a problem to me.
The N&G policy says that they WILL reduce a claim by 25% whereas the HKJ one says that they will reduce the amount by NO MORE than 30%.
However, the important bit for me was that HKJ exclude Total Loss or Total Constructive Loss from this clause.
I see the tender being stolen as a likely event so that "betterment" clause should't be applied in that case.

Another nasty - Claims as a result of the Vessel striking a submerged object or grounding will be subject to double the excess shown in the Certificate of Insurance
I have a particularly high excess in my N&G proposal so doubling it really concerned me.
On the other hand HKJ doesn't double its excesses.

So, to recap, it was those small things that led me to the decision to renew under a HKJ rather that under N&G

Now to the interesting point.
Whilst phoning round brokers, I came across "Curtis Marine" - Curtis Marine Insurance | Compare Boat Insurance Quote & Buy Online
Which seems to be a family run business.
All these brokers know each other but Aidan Mepsted who runs Curtis knows Barrie and the Topsail team.
Although not important, Curtis Marine are based in Plymouth - just a stones through from where Barrie was based.
Without any pressure Aidan provided me with the cheapest quotation.
I guess I could have gone back to Topsail and said that they were more expensive and maybe they would have matched Aidan's price - but why should I?
When I ask for a competitive quotation - thats what I want - just that - their best price.
Aidan automatically gave me a discount and it was this discount that made the difference between the quotes.

I mentioned that I post on this forum and I suggested that he might like to extend my discount to others who post on here.
After all, there are a lot of us on here that are/were insured by Y.
So, yes, he has agreed to offer up to 7.5% discount depending upon the value of the policy.
Just say you are on the YBW forum and he will see if he can offer a discount.
He also gave me free Legal Protection but that might be because I am a new customers.
I've only spoken to him on the phone but I have a good feeling about Curtis Marine and I hope that I have now found my solution to the big Y change.

So, if your insurance is up for renewal, why not give Curtis Marine Insurance a call?
 
Hurricane said:
I guess I could have gone back to Topsail and said that they were more expensive and maybe they would have matched Aidan's price - but why should I?
When I ask for a competitive quotation - thats what I want - just that - their best price.
Click to expand...
I couldn't agree more, M.
That's in fact the main thing which I found VERY annoying in the last couple of years, upon renewal with Y.
I mean, I've been in the Marrakech Souk many years ago, and I enjoyed (sort of) the haggling process, which is part of the attraction.
BUT, that's NOT what I expect from an insurance broker.

I had a quick look at the Curtis Marine website, but I neither understood who the underwriters are, nor I found a copy of their policy.
Do you possibly have a more specific link, or if not, could you maybe email me the policy?
TIA!
 
MapisM said:
I mean, I've been in the Marrakech Souk many years ago, and I enjoyed (sort of) the haggling process, which is part of the attraction.
BUT, that's NOT what I expect from an insurance broker.
Click to expand...
Nor me but that's just how it was this time
 
Hurricane said:
I have just spent the last couple of weeks looking at my insurance.
My old policy expires at the beginning of May so I asked Topsail for their proposals at the beginning of this month.
In fact, they were already on the case so it didn't actually need chasing.

I then picked a few brokers to see what was available.
Thanks to jrudge and others on here, I was able to "narrow down" the criteria (cruising areas and excesses etc).
After a few quotes, it was clear that there were no "special offers" from Topsail on the table.
Out of those brokers that I contacted, I then chose a "short list" to work on.

Apart from a few oddballs, my choice narrowed down to two underwriters:-

1 - Our old Y underwriter (MS Amlin) now available through Haven Knox Johnston
2 - Navigators and General - who Topsail were recommending

When you read through these two policies, you will see that 95% of the wording is identical.
But there are some small differences in the detail.
Now - have I heard that before - "The Devil is in the Detail"
An example - the N&G policy has this statement -
Vessels less than 8.5 metres (28 feet) in length and RIBs (rigid inflatable boat) of any length, being stolen, swamped, stranded, sunk, or breaking adrift whilst moored or anchored unattended off an exposed beach or shore.
So, If I go to lunch and my tender gets stolen, it isn't covered.
I'm sure if you asked Topsail, they would woffle around this - but that is what it says.
So after a lot of reading, and IMHO, policies underwritten by Navigators and General have a few nasties that don't appear in the Haven Knox Johnston alternative.
I haven't compared to last year's Y policy documents because that option isn't available anymore but I suspect that last year's policy is very similar the Haven Knox Johnston because MS Amlin (that Y used) is still there behind the scenes.

Whilst we are on the subject of nasties.
Both the N&G and the HKJ wording have a few twists in the "betterment clause"
This is where items are 5 years or more old and they don't provide new for old.
Items like covers are understandable but they both include the tender in their list of items.
I have a particularly high value tender so these "betterment" clauses are a bit of a problem to me.
The N&G policy says that they WILL reduce a claim by 25% whereas the HKJ one says that they will reduce the amount by NO MORE than 30%.
However, the important bit for me was that HKJ exclude Total Loss or Total Constructive Loss from this clause.
I see the tender being stolen as a likely event so that "betterment" clause should't be applied in that case.

Another nasty - Claims as a result of the Vessel striking a submerged object or grounding will be subject to double the excess shown in the Certificate of Insurance
I have a particularly high excess in my N&G proposal so doubling it really concerned me.
On the other hand HKJ doesn't double its excesses.

So, to recap, it was those small things that led me to the decision to renew under a HKJ rather that under N&G

Now to the interesting point.
Whilst phoning round brokers, I came across "Curtis Marine" - Curtis Marine Insurance | Compare Boat Insurance Quote & Buy Online
Which seems to be a family run business.
All these brokers know each other but Aidan Mepsted who runs Curtis knows Barrie and the Topsail team.
Although not important, Curtis Marine are based in Plymouth - just a stones through from where Barrie was based.
Without any pressure Aidan provided me with the cheapest quotation.
I guess I could have gone back to Topsail and said that they were more expensive and maybe they would have matched Aidan's price - but why should I?
When I ask for a competitive quotation - thats what I want - just that - their best price.
Aidan automatically gave me a discount and it was this discount that made the difference between the quotes.

I mentioned that I post on this forum and I suggested that he might like to extend my discount to others who post on here.
After all, there are a lot of us on here that are/were insured by Y.
So, yes, he has agreed to offer up to 7.5% discount depending upon the value of the policy.
Just say you are on the YBW forum and he will see if he can offer a discount.
He also gave me free Legal Protection but that might be because I am a new customers.
I've only spoken to him on the phone but I have a good feeling about Curtis Marine and I hope that I have now found my solution to the big Y change.

So, if your insurance is up for renewal, why not give Curtis Marine Insurance a call?
Click to expand...
Thanks Mike, very informative. I moved to Y before it became Topsail so lets see where we get to on renewal. I have found N&G to be ok wording wise and one thing you have highlighted is that terms change year to year. I questioned them very specifically re leaving the boat, line of sight etc when I moved and have emails clarifying the issue, all to my satisfaction. On a side note, I had a very large claim 5 years ago and ran across the issue of betterment. I had to have the boat fully retired and we had a brief “discussion” with the underwriter re cost of new wiring versus old wiring which was some years old. In the end my loss adjuster actually called the underwriter and said that they were being silly and it was resolved. Lesson here is that on any big claim, your best mate in the world becomes the LA!!
 
MapisM said:
I couldn't agree more, M.
That's in fact the main thing which I found VERY annoying in the last couple of years, upon renewal with Y.
I mean, I've been in the Marrakech Souk many years ago, and I enjoyed (sort of) the haggling process, which is part of the attraction.
BUT, that's NOT what I expect from an insurance broker.

I had a quick look at the Curtis Marine website, but I neither understood who the underwriters are, nor I found a copy of their policy.
Do you possibly have a more specific link, or if not, could you maybe email me the policy?
TIA!
Click to expand...
Like Topsail and others, Curtis are just a broker.
They just resell the main underwriter's policy.
It seems that Topsail "top and tail" the N&G with their own branding.
The Curtis offer to me was the Haven Knox Johnson branding.
 
Just closing the loop on my renewal. Topsail quoted a renewal cost 62% higher than my current year's insurance, with no changes to cover etc. I went back to them but at the time of writing have not received an updated quote. In the meantime Hurricane suggested I speak to Curtis Marine, and they have been very helpful. I have now taken out a policy underwritten with N&G, which is virtually identical to the Y policy and not only substantially less than the renewal quote from Topsail, but a little less that I paid for the current year. Based on the experience I have had so far, it's certainly worth speaking to Curtis Marine on renewal - thanks Hurricane for the recommendation.
 
Many thanks for the update. I renewed with Topsail as I left it late and didn't want, for a second, to be un-insured.

However, i'll make note of the above for next year. And next year, i'll start shopping well in advance of renewal!

Do Curtis Marine insure outside the UK? I'm in Ireland but the quotes i'm getting from local brokers are a bit bonkers.
 
alt said:
Do Curtis Marine insure outside the UK? I'm in Ireland but the quotes i'm getting from local brokers are a bit bonkers.
Click to expand...
My boat is in the Med and they are covering her there.
But the first question they asked me was I resident in the UK and was the boat on the British Register.
My answer is yes to both questions.
So, probably worth a call and ask those questions first.
 
Just for the records, my boat is also in the Med, but she isn't UK flagged, and neither her owner (i.e. truly yours) is a UK resident.
This wasn't a problem with Y, and I know for sure it isn't with Topsail either.

Not sure (yet) if this would be fine also for Curtis Marine.
I'll ask them in due course (still far from renewal ATM), but if anyone else should find out earlier, I'd be interested to hear the result.
 
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