Beta, Yanmar or something else ..... this just isn't an easy task.

OGITD

OGITD

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Firstly may I thank everyone for their advice as to my choice of boats in the 29' range ..... but I think I'll have to extend my options from 27' - 30' .... because finding one considering price, location & condition isn't an easy task.

Also .... is any one engine better (more reliable etc) than any of the others, yes, the BUKH is excellent ... but ... all I tend to find are 30+ year old units which are looking like a rebuild or replacement.

+ one of the Beta units seems to like destroying alternator belts (why!) .... & Yanmar seem to of changed (upgraded?) their units recently-ish.

Anyone selling a Sadler 29 (twin keel) in good condition ... I promise you will have a reserved berth anytime I'm taking her out ...... :encouragement:
 
Beta engines are based upon Kuboto industrial engines, so spares are cheap and plentiful. Volvo by comparison have very expensive spares. Buhk and Volve MD series are purpose designed and built marine engines, so if looked after will run and run but spares are expensive.

The Beta destroying alternator belts is due a misalignment and I believe a kit is available to correct it.

All modern engines are higher running speed than old marine designs. As to reliability it really comes down to servicing and general maintenance of the fuel system. I had the dilema of only running 30 hours since the last service and after chatting on the Beta stand at the LBC, they said really a service was not yet required. At the end of this season I shall be servicing the engine regardless of hours as moisture can be absorbed into the oil.

What you want to avoid is a boat that has no service records of any kind.

It should not matter whether the engine has been self serviced or engineer serviced as long as it has been looked after.
 
Concerto said:
The Beta destroying alternator belts is due a misalignment and I believe a kit is available to correct it.
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I'd not heard that, but do know that well over a decade ago, some Betas had issues with V-belt failures. They investigated and learned that overriding the issue was engine room temperature. Obviously they couldn't do aything but advise re idividual installations, but I think they subsequently supplied notched belts, which inherently run cooler, as standard.

That's a long time ago. Most Betas have for some years run polyvee belts as standard: bullet-proof.
 
prv said:
True of the Bukh AFAIK, but aren't the Volvos marinised Perkins? Not that it matters particularly.

Pete
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Yes. The MD just means marine diesel and has been used for all small engines. The models up to 200x series of less than 30hp were purely marine engines, although larger engines of the same age were often marinised vehicle engines. 20x0 and latest D1 are marinised Japanese Perkins and the long running MD 55 is a a BL Perkins vehicle engine.
 
OGITD said:
Firstly may I thank everyone for their advice as to my choice of boats in the 29' range ..... but I think I'll have to extend my options from 27' - 30' .... because finding one considering price, location & condition isn't an easy task.

Also .... is any one engine better (more reliable etc) than any of the others, yes, the BUKH is excellent ... but ... all I tend to find are 30+ year old units which are looking like a rebuild or replacement.

+ one of the Beta units seems to like destroying alternator belts (why!) .... & Yanmar seem to of changed (upgraded?) their units recently-ish.

Anyone selling a Sadler 29 (twin keel) in good condition ... I promise you will have a reserved berth anytime I'm taking her out ...... :encouragement:
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There is little to choose between the popular brands of new engines. They all follow the same pattern of using small Japanese indistrial engines 9even Yanmar who use the same base engines for their industrial products). The key thing in a re-engine situation is ensuring that it was done properly and in particular that all the ancilliaries were either replaced or checked properly. There is a tempatation to skimp in this area as folks tend to ignore the bits you can't see.

Find the boat you like in the best condition you can afford and don't get too hung up on the make of engine.
 
Somewhat anecdotal but when my model of cat was launched in 2005 it was designed primarily for charter use and won the boat of the year award or somesuch. It had Volvo engines. We chartered one in the Caribbean in 2008 and were told that the engines were one of it's weak points. I thought this was a pity as we liked the boat.

When we were back in the UK a year later, the builder announced the switch to the equivalent Yanmar YM series engines. I am guessing that this might have been after pressure from the charter company, their largest and virtually sole, customer.

We then bought one of the first series with the Yanmars. When I last spoke to the charter company a couple of years ago, they seemed to be pleased with the change.

Richard
 
If you have to replace an engine, try (if possible) to do it with the identical model, or the more modern version thereof. Then there's a fighting chance it will more or less fit, and not require too much expense in reshaping the engine space, changing all ancillaries, etc.
 
Some of the boats around the age you are looking at will also have original engines. There was a tendancy at that time to just give you enough to get you in and out a marina or on and off a mooring. I know there is the argument about too big an engine will not be worked hard enough but make sure whatever you buy will not have you stuck doing 2 kots when the going gets tough. An eaxmple would be the Mirage 28 with an 8hp yanmar another wold be the Trapper 300 with the same 8hp single Yanmar which was my prevoius boat, although it would run all day on a litre of diesel there were many occasions I wished I'd had more power. I'm sure in it's day (around 1940) the single cylinder 8 or 12 hp horizontal bore Yanmar was great little engine but I would avoid one at all costs. It is the noisest rattliest thing I've ever heard on a boat. It will shake everything to bits including your teeth.
 
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Twister_Ken said:
If you have to replace an engine, try (if possible) to do it with the identical model, or the more modern version thereof. Then there's a fighting chance it will more or less fit, and not require too much expense in reshaping the engine space, changing all ancillaries, etc.
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That is rarely possible as the new style engines are almost all physically smaller. However not really an issue as there are well proven ways of adapting new engines to fit in place of Bukh and old style Volvos as used in the boats the OP is looking at. Common to need to replace many of the ancilliaries anyway as 40 years or more of use and neglect often means they are past it.

As I suggested above, important when looking at a reengined boat to check it has been done properly.
 
Twister_Ken said:
If you have to replace an engine, try (if possible) to do it with the identical model, or the more modern version thereof. Then there's a fighting chance it will more or less fit, and not require too much expense in reshaping the engine space, changing all ancillaries, etc.
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When I replaced a Bukh 20 with a Yanmar 3GM30F I gained 27 HP and a large space above the engine that is now occupied by a tool box. I lost 90 kg, a most useful saving. I needed a short length of exhaust hose and an adaptor to accommodate the larger bore, new Morse cables, not much more other than two lumps of steel to raise the engine about one inch. For a season I kept the same prop, which I intended to change anyway.
 
vyv_cox said:
When I replaced a Bukh 20 with a Yanmar 3GM30F I gained 27 HP and a large space above the engine that is now occupied by a tool box. I lost 90 kg, a most useful saving. I needed a short length of exhaust hose and an adaptor to accommodate the larger bore, new Morse cables, not much more other than two lumps of steel to raise the engine about one inch. For a season I kept the same prop, which I intended to change anyway.
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Bukh 20 - Yanmar 3GM30 = 27 HP. Surely not? :confused:

Richard
 
Yanmar spares are like shopping at Waitrose after buying stuff at Lidl Volvo.

Says smug git with Mitsubishi/Westerbeke clockwork. For Beta fans, now 2200 hours on same belt. You pays your money and find something that fits...
 
michael_w said:
Yanmar spares are like shopping at Waitrose after buying stuff at Lidl Volvo.

Says smug git with Mitsubishi/Westerbeke clockwork. For Beta fans, now 2200 hours on same belt. You pays your money and find something that fits...
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How often do you change your HE, my Nanni is now 12 yrs old but now on the 2nd replacement Elbow with the original HE
 
Just replaced the V belt on my Beta with a Polyvee /ribbed belt kit. An easy fix for older Betas, as previously mentioned newer ones come that way as standard. The Kubota based engines are well made reliable and in my case the three cylinder BD722 is as smooth as silk compared to the old Volvo twin it replaced.
 
Eyore said:
Just replaced the V belt on my Beta with a Polyvee /ribbed belt kit. An easy fix for older Betas, as previously mentioned newer ones come that way as standard. The Kubota based engines are well made reliable and in my case the three cylinder BD722 is as smooth as silk compared to the old Volvo twin it replaced.
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what did the conversion kit cost pls
 
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