Beta 20....starting problems......where to start looking??

Beta plugs are fairly accessible. If I suspected the plug supply circuit on my Beta, with the symptoms described by the OP, I'd first try activating the plugs by holding a wander-lead of reasonably stout wire between the battery +ve. and the bus-bar prior to a cold start. If the engine started OK, that directs suspicion towards the plug power supply. Beta engines don't normally have a relay in that circuit, so it could be the switch or corrosion.
A slight puzzlement is that the OP reports that the problem can recur after the engine has been off for a few hours. Both of the Betas I've owned would start instantly, without heating, after the first start of the day.
 
Two points:-
1) I had similar intermittent, random and annoying start problems from my Vetus including slow cranking. I suspected everything, tested everything and eventually diagnosed the starter as being knackered. Irritatingly that worked fine on the bench, but a new starter motor has fixed my problems.

2) Testing glow plugs. It's possible to do a basic check with them in the engine, but experience with cars tells me that they can draw current but not heat at the tip.

Summary, test, test, test again. And sometimes you have to remove stuff to test even if it passes the ' installed test'. And other times you need to accept that being an amateur mechanic will only take you so far and you need to use that skill set to narrow things down as far as possible and then become a fitter.

Good luck.
 
PaulRainbow said:
Problem when you try to help, there is all too often someone with nothing better to do with their time than Google through all of the online manuals, then they think they know the answers.
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Unfortunately, and this is not aimed at any participant/s in particular, it seems to be a general feature of this forum that someone tries to address a question or problem with a helpful suggestion which, although correct in principle, is not 100% accurate in terms of the specific detail for that particular engine/equipment.

What happens then is the other posters pile in with exclamation marks, underlining, emboldening, asterisks, quotations etc as if the poster who is trying to be helpful has committed some heinous crime against humanity by not getting the micro-details right.

I find it more constructive to say something like "That is the right approach ..... but with this particular engine you have to remove the thribble before you can access the sproglet", and thereby maintain a total absence of punctuation marks, underlining or text colouration and hence ensure that everyone feels that their opinion is valued. :)

Richard
 
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KellysEye said:
O ne problem we had starting was the solenoid was loose and not earthing, check it for any movement.
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Do you never read what the OP writes? There is no problem with the starter.

Just because you once had problems with a solenoid does not mean you have toitell everybody when it is totally irrelevant to the question.
 
Tranona, It depends on how you see the purpose of the forum, is it just to answer the current question or provide a resource such that anyone with a similar problem in future can refer to the answers and solve a slightly different problem.
 
Tranona said:
Do you never read what the OP writes? There is no problem with the starter.

Just because you once had problems with a solenoid does not mean you have toitell everybody when it is totally irrelevant to the question.
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And telling them about the four hours it takes to change Ford / Peugeot glow plugs ......:-)
 
This is the note I sent to Beta to get their angle Dear Beta, our Beta 20 is approx 10 yrs old and has never missed a beat.Until the last 2 weeks that is.It starts and runs perfectly.It has about 300 hrs on it.We have a Racor 10 micron filter also on it. It has 35mm square welding cable as starting cable with 110 amp /hr battery. Our starting procedure hot or cold is to pre heat for approx 8 seconds with throttle closed and as we turn the key it would fire up very smoothly,no miss fires and idle very cleanly.Always "on the button" Now, on a couple of occasions as we turn the key the engine would not start instantly but as we keep the starter turning the engine would pick up faster and faster until the engines speed over takes the starter and the engine runs very smoothly from then on. A bit like the old steam traction engines of yester year. starting...but you may be too young yo remember!
Have you any idea's where to start looking. I don't think its air in the fuel line as it would run more erratically. I don't think its a tired battery as if it was when you turned it over it would turn over slower and slower ,rather than faster and faster.I know its a very difficult question but your advice is appreciated.Regards
I hope this ties up with what I first wrote. I always presumed the glow plugs were heating because of the beeping noise present before I turn the starter key but I now realise this noise also covers the oil pressure. My problem is that ,so far, it has only happened twice. When we didn't expect it. even though its not a certainty, surely if the glow plugs draw say 20 amps for as long as I have the heater circuit on then, probably, the heater plugs are working. just reading what you guys are suggesting it may be a glow plug problem though. Ta Nik
 
I don't know why everyone's first choice is an email. Are you scared of actually talking to the very knowledgeable people at Beta Marine? You'll get your answer much quicker as well.
 
ghostlymoron said:
I don't know why everyone's first choice is an email. Are you scared of actually talking to the very knowledgeable people at Beta Marine? You'll get your answer much quicker as well.
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It's our modern times! But you're right, a phone call might find someone sensible who can advise.

However, I was intrigued by the OP's claim that "Our starting procedure hot or cold is to pre heat for approx 8 seconds....", as the excellent Beta Operator's Manual has a big note - "WARNING! Do NOT leave the key in HEAT position for more than 6 seconds - this will damage the heater/glow plugs and eventually lead to poor starting." Maybe that's what has happened.
 
pvb said:
It's our modern times! But you're right, a phone call might find someone sensible who can advise.

However, I was intrigued by the OP's claim that "Our starting procedure hot or cold is to pre heat for approx 8 seconds....", as the excellent Beta Operator's Manual has a big note - "WARNING! Do NOT leave the key in HEAT position for more than 6 seconds - this will damage the heater/glow plugs and eventually lead to poor starting." Maybe that's what has happened.
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I saw that but it depends on the edition of the manual you read. The earlier version says to preheat for a maximum of 15 seconds!

I dont know if this reflects a change in the glowplugs used in later engines or just a revision of the starting procedure. Perhaps Beta will clarify in their reply to the OP
 
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The 6 second requirement is a new one to me. The handbook delivered with my engine in 2012 specifies 10 seconds. A 2016 download I have on my PC quotes 15 seconds.
I doubt if much has changed on the actual engines. Beta seem to be all over the place on this one. I'll have to buy a stop-watch:).
 
earlybird said:
The 6 second requirement is a new one to me. The handbook delivered with my engine in 2012 specifies 10 seconds. A 2016 download I have on my PC quotes 15 seconds.
I doubt if much has changed on the actual engines. Beta seem to be all over the place on this one. I'll have to buy a stop-watch:).
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6 seconds is what it says in the handbook which you can currently download from Beta' website

They seem to have replaced the previous manuals that covered a small parts of the engine range with one that covers them all from 10 to 115T

http://issuu.com/betamarine/docs/heat_exchanger_om_221-20031_rev-00_?e=15614309/64727780
 
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