Berthing in / near Sydney

Jonny_H

Jonny_H

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We have been doing some research and talking to people and I hear that berthing in Sydney is (not surprisingly) quite pricey! However, someone mentioned that the Sydney Harbour Water Authority (?) have quite cheap berths if you apply in advance.
We're not planning to arrive in Sydney until Nov 2009, but thought if I could get our name on a waiting list in advance it may enable us to get a good berth. (We would want a long term berth (2 years) with possible liveaboard).

Any advice?

Jonny
 
Sydney Harbour Waterways Authority when I was there. You can apply for a private swing mooring on the harbour, but there used to be a long waiting list. I think you need to pay a nominal fee just to be on the list. I had one for a 33 footer that cost me about AUD450 p.a. Not sure how things have changed. That was 10 years ago.
 
Pals of mine sailed into Sydney about 12 years ago and anchored in Farm Cove (I think that is the name) - the wee cove by the Opera House - and nobody troubled them there, and they did not have to pay any anchoring dues.
I think they stayed there for a while, saw Sydney, and had a wonderful time.
(OK, this doesnt answer your question, but you could always do the same for the first few days when you arrive, if anchoring there is still allowed)
 
Jonny, I live in Sydney so naturally know nothing about facilities for visiting yachts so I called NSW Maritime Authority (+61 2 9563-8511 fax +61 2 9563-8522) to ask. The answers I received show we are just not setup for having visitors drop in and stay for any period - no comparison with my experiences in the Med over few seasons.

I am told the following:
1) You can arrange for a berth at any of a number of commercial marinas around the harbour, preferably before you arrive. In practice you would find it difficult to get a berth in any convenient marina close to the city and would pay about A$900 per mth for 40'. You may find berths up the Paramatta River in one of the newer marinas.
2) You can arrange for a swing mooring at one of the marinas, these are more likely to be available and would cost about A$300-400 per mth for 40'.
3) You can free anchor in various places but you are not allowed to leave the boat unattended (this applies to anyone, not just visitors). However, I know of two favourite areas (Rozelle Bay near the City and Birkenhead Point near to a shopping centre) where one often sees foreign cruisers at anchor. I doubt you would be allowed to stay anchored at Farm Cove for more than a couple of nights. It is right next to the Opera House and in these security sensitive times I would expect you would recieve a lot of attention.
4) You cannot live aboard your boat in Sydney Harbour (or anywhere in NSW waters), not even at a marina. Obviously this needs clarification as to what is "living aboard" but the idea is they do not want boats to be an alternative to apartments/houses.
5) You may only keep your boat in NSW for 90 days. If you stay longer you must register it with NSW Maritime (approx A$300 per yr for 40').

So, the detail of the laws are unfriendly to cruisers, that's for sure. In practice there are many cruisers which visit Sydney either from interstate or overseas so the restrictions can't be too difficult in practice. But as for the talk of berths for visiting boats, get back to your friend to find out more.

Another matter to be aware of. Customs and Quarantine regs are very tough for visiting vessels protecting against illegal immigration, drug smuggling and stowaway bugs in your boat. All vessels must report to Customs well before they arrive. See Here for details under Travellers/Yachts travelling to or departing from Australia.

Here are other links:
NSW Maritime Authority
Afloat Magazine, has information about boating in Sydney/NSW including adverts for Marinas and other suppliers

Please don't be put off by all this bureaucracy, we all have to suffer it. Best you know the rules before you trip over them.
Ray
 
Wow - thanks for all that - invaluable!

We knew already about informing them prior to arrival. I have a job arranged in Sydney for two years upon my arrival so my employer is sorting visa's and work permits etc.

Interesting about registering the boat in NSW - I assume you don't have to pay any import tax on the boat (I would imagine this only becomes necessary if you sell it in NSW?) - A$300 p/year isn't too bad.

As for the marina's - this is what I suspected - although looking at many of the marina price lists they include a supplement (A$40 per month) if you want to liveaboard - so maybe it is possible? We may end up with an apartment and leave the boat a bit further away to use at weekends etc.

We should have a month or so between arriving and my job starting, so hopefully we'll be able to use this time to find somewhere!

Thanks again - massively appreciated

Jonny
 
I´m going to be in Sydney for a month, starting 17th Dec, I have a few friends with boats down there, I´ll investigate for you, PM me with a reminder before I go or even when there as will be online sometime. Botany bay may be a cheaper better bet.
 
I lived on board for 3 months and never had a problem with the authorities, but that was only 3 months. I think it depends more on the marina. The one in Balls Head Bay used to be home to most of the cruising boats from memory.

Your other option may be the marina or moorings near Hawksbury River Station (Brooklyn) immediately north of Sydney. A much nicer sailing area. The train is cheap and takes around an hour to Central. Or Botany Bay and Georges Rievr on the south side. Although they are both pretty shallow.
 
You might want to check up on the import tax situation before you commit too heavily: I knew someone who brought a Swan down here from the UK and ended up having to sell it to pay the tax (some percentage of what they decided it was worth IIRC!!).

Done a quick look - up and you can check here

Hope that helps

Arthur
 
Thanks for this - just had a good read of the website and decided to send them an email asking some specific questions.

You don't happen to know what the rule is regarding cruising permits? It says on the site that they issue them for stays of less than 12 months - I assume they wouldn't look too favourably on someone staying for 12 months, leaving Australian waters for a short time and then returning and applying for another permit? Has anyone got experience of trying to extend their permits after the 12 months is up?

Jonny
 
No sorry,

I don't know about cruising permits as we sold our boat prior to emigrating here!! I haven't even been able to find an Australian online community like this one to check for answers.

Hope there's someone on these forums who knows...
 
I don't think there is a cruising permit per se, just the rule that you can use your boat in Australian waters for 12mths. After that you MAY be able to negotiate an extension but the normal rule is you have to decide whether to take the boat out of Australia or pay the 5% duty and 10% GST (VAT). I can't see why a trip to Noumea and return shouldn't allow you to restart the clock but then again logic doesn't always work.

One poster suggests Botany Bay as an alternative. Not really for keel boats and masts. There are no marinas there for such things, some for motor boats up the Georges river. The pointer to Brooklyn is useful. The Hawksbury river is a great cruising ground (not so much sailing as mooching around under motor) quite beautiful in a rugged way and very quiet. The train ride is a commute but do-able.

Although there will be a few who can say they have lived aboard I think you would be stretching it to plan to be on board for 2 yrs. More likely you could use your boat as a base to live whilst sorting out an apartment and then choose an apartment that is not too expensive and makes you want to get onto the boat as often as possible.

Where is the job?

Ray
 
In Sydney - my firms (PricewaterhouseCoopers) offices are on Darling Harbour.

Would be good to have the boat there - but if not we'll have to take her to NZ or New Caledonia after the 12 month permit expires and just visit for holidays. I'll just have to buy an 18foot skiff to keep me busy whilst in Sydney!!

We probably will get an apartment, but would like to keep close to the boat if possible.

Jonny
 
Rozelle Bay which I mentioned in my first post, is just around the corner from Darling Harbour. Good place to start. There is a marina in Rozelle Bay/Blackwattle Bay but it is pitched for "Super Yachts". Very convenient but probably very expensive, I haven't enquired.

If you have a work visa for a fixed period it may be enough to allow you to keep the boat with you for the duration of your visa so long as you export it afterwards (or sell and pay appropriate tax/duty) because it may come under the description of personal/household effects which are allowed to be imported temporarily. It is certainly worth asking Customs. I am sure they deal with this type of thing often.

Yes get into skiff sailing...12, 14, 16, 18ft, plenty of choice. My son sails a 12ft skiff. There is something a bit bizare about a boat that won't stay upright on the water even when there are no sails rigged. But they are so fast and most other boaties give way to them.
Ray
 
The Cheapest way that I know of mooring a boat in the Sydney area is to moor it on a NSW Maritime swing mooring. As a previoupost stated the cost of this is in the order of A$450 per year for a 40 foot boat. This cost varies with length of the boat and where the mooring is located. There are waiting lists for these moorings and the waiting time varies. When I was trying for a mooring,early this year, the waiting time varied between 12 and 15 weeks for the Pittwater area where I wanted to be located. An indication of the waiting time for the given area is given on the Maritime web site and if you contact them with a specific enquiry about a specific area they will normally give you their best estimate. Pittwater is a sheltered stretch of water off of Broken Bay, it is approximately 25 kilometers North of the harbour bridge. To apply for a mooring proof of ownership of a vessel registered in NSW and a fee are the basic requirements. When the mooring license is granted it must be taken up within 14 days and a mooring laid and vessel on the mooring within 31 days, otherwise you go back to the bottom of the waiting list. The costs of laying the mooring are around A$1000. Pittwater is a lovely cruising area with sheltered bays and beaches and is far less manic during Summer weekends than the Harbour. All the information on NSW Maritime services, fees and maps is available at http://www.maritime.nsw.gov.au.
Allen
 
I live in Sydney. Getting a permanent mooring or berth here is an expensive business and some of the queues are very long; six years is not unheard-of.

However, we moor our Bavaria 34 forty minutes up the road in Pittwater (Broken Bay), and we pay $270 a month for our swing mooring at Gibson Marina. A berth would be a little more; although they are quite well subscribed, occasionally one becomes temporarily available because the owner has gone cruising. Call Peter on +61 (0)2 9999 2209.

Gibson is a small, quiet and basic marina. If you prefer something with a few more of the traditional amenities, then you could try the slightly more expensive Royal Prince Alfred Yacht Club (www.rpayc.com.au) and the Royal Motor Yacht Club (www.royalmotor.com.au). Perhaps you may be able to get some discount or preferential treatment if you are a member of an affiliated club back home.

If you are intending to get any major work or repairs done while you are here, then I would suggest getting a mooring or berth in Nelsons Bay, Port Stephens. This is about two and a half hours drive north from Sydney, and commutable by train/bus, but the shipwrights and facilities there are far cheaper than in Sydney or Pittwater. You should be able to find a place at either Nelson Bay Marina (www.dalboramarinas.com.au and go to Nelson Bay) or The Anchorage (www.anchoragemarina.com.au), both of which are excellent choices.
 
We lived aboard at Cammeray Marina for 2 years whilst working in Sydney. A great hideaway place so close to the city.

http://www.cia.com.au/cammarina/home.htm

It was the only marina that tolerated liveaboards. Some had been living aboard there for 10 years. Moorings and berths are available. It's not a flash joint but it attracted all the international yachties which was interesting. It's run by the Rabbits (the owner calls himself Bunny).

We did a Temporary import and had it extended for 4 years. Told them we couldn't leave due to mechanical problems, cyclone season moving in up north etc. etc. Also had our boat valued by a surveyer who deflated our yachts value by half so only had to put up half the amount of bond. There are ways of getting around it all.

If you cruise in you will get a cruising permit and you can extend that for a year or two. If you do sail out and sail back in to get a new permit, you must stay out more than 6 months.

Whatever you do stay away from the NSW Waterways as much as you can. However, you will have to register with them after 3 months and stick 6" black numbers all over your boat. We got away without putting the numbers on but were forced to register or have our boat impounded... even though we are registered for international waters. It's the only country I've encountered so far that demands an extra registration. You'll see these guys running around in motor boats harrassing and fining people. It turned me off Australia.

You won't get a mooring from the Sydney Harbour Water Authority as the waiting list is too long plus you're not a resident. You cannot live aboard these moorings either. Waterways are constantly checking and harrassing anyone who appears to be living aboard at anchor or on a private mooring. Those guys were everywhere...

Good luck!
 
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