Bavaria 44 (2002) Thru-Hulls - Bronze/DZR??

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Gypsy

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There have been various threads suggesting that European boatbuilders have been using brass thruhulls in recent years.

Does anyone have direct experience or knowledge of the material of thru-hulls used in Bavaria 44s built during 2001 and 2002?
 
They're almost certainly brass, so ought to be checked and possibly replaced. The RCD, introduced in 1998, dictated standards for boat equipment; through-hulls and seacocks in brass meet the standards, so that's what most European boatbuilders fit.
 
What pvb said. On my 2001 Bavaria, they were brass that was pink about halfway through on the worst ones (heads), two were jammed and one had a free spinning handle. Surveyor said they passed hammer test, but recommended replacing, which I did with Tru-Design ones.
 
Yes, they will be brass. However, the ones in my 2001 37 were still sound when I sold it last year. Bavaria (and most other European manufacturers) were fitting the same type of brass valves long before the RCD, although most British builders used bronze and then DZR when bronze became expensive.
 
Further to my original post in April this year, the boat has been hauled out and all the thru-hulls removed and replaced. Given that it was 95% sure that they were brass rather than bronze the results on inspection are both surprising and satisfying.

Surprising that there was such a difference between the thruhulls and satisfying that they survived 14yrs and yet I was able to change them without drama.

There are 3 x 1 ½” thruhulls used for toilet outlets. Two are side/side for the aft toilet, one for direct to sea and the other the holding tank dump to sea. The 3rd is for the fwd heads. The one on the left of the photo, the holding tank dump outlet, is affected dramatically more than the one on the right but I can’t say for sure whether the other was its immediate neighbour or from the fwd heads. Two are fitted about 100mm below the water line and the 3rd about 300mm below the waterline.

There are 8 x ¾” thruhulls, 2 for inlet and 6 for outlet. They are mounted about 100mm below waterline. The photo shows 2 of these and once again there is quite a variation of how they were effected.
All hull fittings and seacocks have been replaced with Tru-Design glass re-enforced composite products. Very easy to work with but a bit bulkier than their brass predecessors. Luckily they all fitted without problems.

So it seems the brass easily met the 5yrs RCD requirement and would have still been good at 10yrs, however 15yrs would be critical for some of those on my boat.

1-5Thru-25.jpg3-4Thru-25.jpg
 
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Gypsy said:
So it seems the brass easily met the 5yrs RCD requirement and would have still been good at 10yrs, however 15yrs would be critical for some of those on my boat.
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I'm sure that's reassuring for some, perhaps less so for others with a boat coming up to that age. Imagine if everything on a boat had a 15 year service life :ambivalence:
Still, that's better than some insurers reckon for standing rigging (not that that's at all comparable with skin fittings).

The truth seems to be that brass through-hulls last better than we sometimes fear. Certainly there is little or no anecdotal evidence of serious incidents caused by their failure. There may be others but the only one I know of is Random Harvest (MAIB report 28/2000), but even there the failure of a brass (aka Tonval) fitting was accelerated by dodgy electrical wiring.

Wouldn't dream of fitting one, though.
 
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nigelmercier said:
Interesting, I note that TruDesign have a good range of hose fittings. Any problems combining with DZR?
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I replaced all our underwater through hulls with TruDesign and all but one of the seacocks and tails with the same. As I had a spare new 1 1/2" dzr I used that with TruDesign through hull and hose tail, it fitted fine. It's now the only one which is "sticky" to turn whereas the composite ones can be turned without any force, even after several months without moving them.
 
Tranona said:
Yes, they will be brass. However, the ones in my 2001 37 were still sound when I sold it last year. Bavaria (and most other European manufacturers) were fitting the same type of brass valves long before the RCD, although most British builders used bronze and then DZR when bronze became expensive.
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Out of interest, do you know if they are still fitting cheapo Brass on your new boat, or have they responded to the concerns and now fitting something else?

When YM were doing lots of articles on the woes of Brass seacocks I wrote to them suggesting that they should put their actions where their words were and state what type of seacocks were fitted in each of their boat tests. However I got a rather dismissive reply that they couldn't do this as they might not know! So how the heck could an average boat buyer punter find out if YM could not be bothered when they were dealing directly with dealer and builder.
I thought it was shocking hypocracy on YM part when making such noise in a different section of the same mag. Perhaps they may reconsider now - an article with a table of who fits what type today would be illuminating
 
Believe they are also brass in my boat. Although I am well aware of the consequences of dezincification, I believe the chances of it happening are vastly overstated. European and Scandinavian builders have been fitting the same seacocks for over 30 years. Just think of how many 100's of thousands are in use - and there has not been an epidemic of boats sinking.

Some people get obsessed with the RCD requirement as if it was something new and therefore a reduction in "standards" when in fact it led to no change. The 5 years is misleading as this thread shows. My old 37 of similar age still has all its original seacocks except for the toilet outlet which had seized.
 
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