Basic question re manual windlass

[Babylon]

I'm thinking of fitting a manual windlass, mainly to ease the burden of recovering a lot (up to 80m) of 8mm chain and a heavier anchor. Am I correct in thinking that I can also simply lift the chain off the gypsy at any time and haul the chain in hand-over-hand and down the hawse-pipe as I currently do - more quickly, especially once the majority of weight has been recovered - or does the setup preclude this?

 

[VicMallows]

I am glad you ask this question,because it's one I have also been trying to get clear in my head!! However, if you don't mind, may I broaden the question to include power windlasses, and whether vertical or horizontal alters matters?

I have found both the literature and sales-people quite inadequate in this regard.

I also find the issue of whether the chain can 'freefall' quite difficult to establish. (Of course if the chain CAN be easily taken off the gypsy
this is not an issue).

 

[NormanS]

There is absolutely no problem in doing so with a windlass with a horizontal shaft. With the vertical type, I do not know, having no experience of such animals.
I take it that for freefall, you mean by de-clutching the gypsy. That should be no problem.

 

[ghostlymoron]

The advantage of the vertical axis type is said to be that the chain has a greater length of contact than the horizontal axis type (Lofrans Royal). I've never found this a problem. The operation of the latter type is easier as you can do it standing up with a back and forth action as opposed to the 'winching' action required by the vertical axis type in a sitting position.
You can pull the chian off the gypsy with either type and recover by hand. Beware of finger entrapment when you do though.
good vid of lofrans here
With electric windlasses the operating criteria don't apply and they are a lot less intrusive.

 

[Babylon]

good vid of lofrans here

Here's a better video of the same sort of yacht without a windlass, entitled "How to p1ss off your wife" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0cCcqrhB2E

The problem is a wife - from previous experience - won't be cheaper!

 

[Babylon]

There is absolutely no problem in doing so with a windlass with a horizontal shaft. With the vertical type, I do not know, having no experience of such animals.
I take it that for freefall, you mean by de-clutching the gypsy. That should be no problem.

Freefall isn't the issue. Its recovering the cable that I'm interested in. I'm keen on buying a horizontal windlass, despite its greater obtrusiveness - so your answer has helped me. Thanks!

 

[Caer Urfa]

I'm thinking of fitting a manual windlass, mainly to ease the burden of recovering a lot (up to 80m) of 8mm chain and a heavier anchor. Am I correct in thinking that I can also simply lift the chain off the gypsy at any time and haul the chain in hand-over-hand and down the hawse-pipe as I currently do - more quickly, especially once the majority of weight has been recovered - or does the setup preclude this?

Yes I also have a simple manual (Lofrans Royal) windless and a great bit of kit, and yes you can do all that you ask.
They are quicker than you think when using the windlass pole but I also once most of the anchor is on its way up as you say I bring most aboard by hand and that feeds straight down the hawse pipe.

Couple of tips, if you buy one make sure you get an operating handle and also invest in a cover for the windlass, also cheap 'anchor chain markers' are a big help.

Mike

 

[Nina Lucia]

Windlass

I'm thinking of fitting a manual windlass, mainly to ease the burden of recovering a lot (up to 80m) of 8mm chain and a heavier anchor. Am I correct in thinking that I can also simply lift the chain off the gypsy at any time and haul the chain in hand-over-hand and down the hawse-pipe as I currently do - more quickly, especially once the majority of weight has been recovered - or does the setup preclude this?

That's what we did, and work

 

[Babylon]

Yes I also have a simple manual (Lofrans Royal) windless and a great bit of kit, and yes you can do all that you ask.
They are quicker than you think when using the windlass pole but I also once most of the anchor is on its way up as you say I bring most aboard by hand and that feeds straight down the hawse pipe.

Couple of tips, if you buy one make sure you get an operating handle and also invest in a cover for the windlass, also cheap 'anchor chain markers' are a big help.

Mike

Thanks for this Mike. I've heard some negative stuff about the Lofrans Royal in terms of robustness and longevity, so I wonder how long you've had yours and how its fared? (The cover is obviously there for a reason, then!)

That's what we did, and work

Thanks Ivan. Did you also fit a Lofrans Royal?

Jon

 

[Caer Urfa]

Thanks for this Mike. I've heard some negative stuff about the Lofrans Royal in terms of robustness and longevity, so I wonder how long you've had yours and how its fared? (The cover is obviously there for a reason, then!)

The windlass was fitted in 2004, good bit of kit and other than hosing it with fresh water requires no mainternace!.

Also good service from Italy if required, I lost the manual 2 years ago, but they sent one in 2 hrs to download.

Cover cost £30 and well worth it.

Mike

 

[Nina Lucia]

Lofrans

Thanks for this Mike. I've heard some negative stuff about the Lofrans Royal in terms of robustness and longevity, so I wonder how long you've had yours and how its fared? (The cover is obviously there for a reason, then!)



Thanks Ivan. Did you also fit a Lofrans Royal?

Jon

Hi Jon,
I bought that one on the boat jumble in Essex five years ago for £35.
Best buy ever, still in perfect working condition and we never ever did any major service to it.
Only thing, we do get some water leaking down the chain as I never made any cover for that.
More than welcome to have a look, we will be in Porchester SC at the begining of January.

 

[Tranona]

If fast recovery of significant lengths of cable is your objective then a manual windlass is not the answer. The Lofrans is the only small manual windlass left on the market (assuming Lofrans survives the Navimo failure). This tells you something about the demand. In reality the latest electric windlasses are far superior and the price differential has shrunk dramatically.

A manual windlass has some value in helping break out the anchor and relieving some of the work of recovering chain, but it is very slow and still hard work. Most people tend to do the bulk of the recovery by hand - motoring up to create slack and bringing in the bulk of the chain by hand, then using the windlass for the last bit. An electric windlass allows you to do the whole operation without physical effort, although still worth using the engine to take up the slack.

Unless you can get a used manual one from somebody upgrading it does not make much sense buying a new one compared with a new electric.

 

[Otter]

I agree, we used to think an electric windlass for for softie posers - then we fitted one to the Kipper and it changed anchoring for ever. The cost vs a new manual was only £100 more but we did get a cracking deal on the electric. Don't discount the idea of electric.

 

[ghostlymoron]

The lofrans royal is a great bit of kit and retrieves chain without back strain. Perhaps more suited to leisurely retrieval though. I wouldn't recommend the 'no maintenance' approach because the materials of which its made can become corrosion welded making v difficult to dismantle if left for several years. An annual strip and lube is a good idea.

 

[JimC]

If fast recovery of significant lengths of cable is your objective then a manual windlass is not the answer. The Lofrans is the only small manual windlass left on the market (assuming Lofrans survives the Navimo failure). This tells you something about the demand. In reality the latest electric windlasses are far superior and the price differential has shrunk dramatically.

A manual windlass has some value in helping break out the anchor and relieving some of the work of recovering chain, but it is very slow and still hard work. Most people tend to do the bulk of the recovery by hand - motoring up to create slack and bringing in the bulk of the chain by hand, then using the windlass for the last bit. An electric windlass allows you to do the whole operation without physical effort, although still worth using the engine to take up the slack.

Unless you can get a used manual one from somebody upgrading it does not make much sense buying a new one compared with a new electric.

I agree with all the above but before buying an electric windlass make sure your anchor locker meets the windlass manufacturer's requirements in terms of chain path and depth of drop. This is much more critical for electric than manual due to much faster recovery speed.

 

[scottie]

With the electric Sl winch we have which is fitted in the anchor locker there are two obstacles to overhauling by hand
The pawl lock is very easily knocked back into place and secondly the run is rotten and requires to have the heaped chain cleared forward

 

[JimC]

... Am I correct in thinking that I can also simply lift the chain off the gypsy at any time and haul the chain in hand-over-hand and down the hawse-pipe as I currently do - more quickly, especially once the majority of weight has been recovered - or does the setup preclude this?

The Pro CV1000 from South Pacific appears to be a good candidate if you need this ability http://www.southpacific.com.au/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=50&category_id=7&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=54