Barton Dingy-Style Jib Furler

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Arida

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am considering adding a Barton Jib Furler to my Kingfisher 20. It is much cheaper and simpler to install than a modern roller reefing system and, although not as flexible, appears to offer a good compromise for a small boat like the Kingfisher.

I understand that I should be able to use any jib which has a strong luff wire, which both of my elderly hank-on jibs seem to have. Presumably I simply remove the hanks and use otherwise as-is?

However, I am concerned about the amount of jib halyard tension which will be needed in order to achieve a reasonable luff shape now the sails will no longer have the benefit of being hanked-on to a very taught forestay.

The current jib halyard appears to be recent and in good condition, but is quite thin (6mm at a guess) and is almost certainly not made out of anything special. Is it likely to be too stretchy/weak for this application?

There is also a downhaul/kicker style tensionor (4:1) which currently sits between the deck fitting and the bottom of the luff wire in order to allow some tensioning of the jib halyard. Is this likely to need replacing with something with more mechanical advantage (16:1?). Will this tension need to be removed when not in use in order to avoid excessive stress on the halyard?

And finally, would it be best to place the furling drum directly on the deck with the tensioner above it, or sitting suspended above the tensioner?

Thoughts appreciated as ever.

Regards,

Rob
 
Kingfisher 20 is a small boat & the jib will be a reasonable size, but as a twin keeler it will be MUCH heavier than any dinghy & the sail will also be much heavier & stronger, I suspect that the forces required to set up the jib might put too much strain on the Barton bearings.

Why not e-mail Barton & ask the experts?
 
Thanks Searush/Vics

Understand it might be struggling with the Genoa, but much of the time I would be happy sailing with the standard Jib, at least on the short/single handed journeys where the furling would really be useful.

Still concerned about luff tensioning though, particularly given Searush's comments about bearing strain. Barton's web site does in one place mention "light displacement cruising yachts" though elsewhere this is ammended to "day boats". Also recognise that the K20, though small, is not "light displacement" for its size....

Just assuming I wanted to give it a try, would I be likely to get enough tension to make the luff shape ok using just a 4:1 kicker style tensioner? And would halyard stretch be likely to be an issue?

Regards,

Rob
 
The weight on 100sq ft of dinghy jib when heeling will be far less than on a K20 heeling due to the greater force required to make a heavy boat heel. That is why the sailcloth is so much heavier, and is what I think will create the problem with the bearings.

I can get the GP14 jib haliard bar tight (so the seperate forestay goes loose) with just a highfield lever, but even with a winch I struggled to do that, even on my first boat (W25).

Even when beating, there is little curve in the GP14 luff, but on my Pentland, you can actually see the r/r foil with (the forestay inside) is curved, not a lot, but just visibly so.

But ask the experts at Barton, they won't (or at least they shouldn't) want to sell you something that will not work, or will fail quite quickly in use.
 
g7elk,

I've had dinghies like Ospreys with a Barton furler but I share Searushs' concerns re the loads from a 20' cruiser like a Kingfisher.

Another way to douse the headsail is to fit a downhaul; a thin line to the peak of the jib, led aft via a block on deck to a cleat by the cockpit.

With this, if one lets the halliard off and pulls the downhaul, the sail is quickly down.

Netting on the forward section of the guardrails will prevent the sail blowing over the side, and is handy for keeping crew onboard too.
 
I have the Barton gear on my little boat and it works well.

To get enough luff tension in the foresail, I slacken my backstay a bit, tighten the jib halyard and cleat it off, the re tighten the back stay. By the time I've done that, there's not a lot of tension in the forestay, most of it is taken by the wire luff of the foresail.

It works very well once you get it set up. The most important bit of setting it up is the position of the last block feeding the furling cord into the drum. Too high or too low and you can get riding turns and the drum will "fill up" before the sail is unfurled.

Buy the larger size. The capacity of the smaller one must be tiny.

One thing I like, over a "proper" furling system, is that if something goes wrong, you can still drop the halyard and drop the sail as you would a hanked on one. If something goes wrong on a "proper" furling system, you may be stuck with a sail half out and you can't do anything to get it down.

And lastly, to put the cat amongst the pigeons, WHY can't it be used for roller reefing? I actually tried it on mine and had no problem setting the foresail partly unfurled. What am I likely to break if I do that too often?
 
Provided you can replace the existing jib halyard with a galvanised wire, with a hard eye at the furler bearing end and a soft 4" eye and light rope tail, say 10 ft long at the hoist end, a Highfield lever will provide a strong reliable tension to the jib, which itself should have a stainless luff wire.
The tension applied will then just slacken the existing forestay which if fitted with a snap shackle at the lower end, may be taken back to the mast whilst sailing; refitting this before lowering the jib, and connecting the upper and lower bearings of the furler when the sail is taken off for the day. Using this method the foresail is set at exactly the same tension when rigged, with minimal stretch. and an efficient leading edge to the sail.
By the way SeaSure also manufacture an almost identical product, which is the one I used on a Silhouette and a Wayfarer.
Most Highfield levers have various positions to adjust the tension. Just make sure that the lever is well secured to the mast luff slot.

ianat182

P.S. You can use the original rope halyard as a mousing line to feed the new wire halyard through without lowering the mast
 
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On my Seahawk 17 I used the larger drum and a rigging screw to tension the halyard. Luckily the headsail had a shorter luff than the forestay length so I had space for the rigging screw.
I left the forestay rigged and tightened the furling gear so that the forestay just lost tension. You need to make sure there is space for the headsail to furl if you do it this way.

Works perfectly. Use thinner furling line than I did to make sure the drum isn't over-filled.

The bearings will manage as much tension as you want to put on them. It doesn't seem to effect the furling effort at all.

Furling at 3 minutes 50 seconds




furlingdrumriggingscrew2.jpg
 
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Thanks All

Thanks for all the replies.

Lakesailor's photo/video were particularly helpful, as were Prodave's ideas on tensioning by means of the backstay - wish I'd thought of that.

Seajet's comments on dousing using a downhaul also gave me food for thought, as they come to the nub of the real problem, which is that I do not currently have <any> lines lead back to the cockpit (except the jib sheets obviously). Therefore I need to be up on deck to make any and all adjustments. I have been reliant on turning in to the wind and trying to strap the tiller in position whilst I venture on deck - on a couple of occasions recently this has gone badly, the boat has begun to turn and the sails have filled, requiring me to make a mad dive into the cockpit to resolve.

I now have a tiller pilot which should help more than a little, but perhaps I still need to look at things a bit more generally if I am to regularly sail singe handed.

As for the furling, it seems the Barton gear may be a bit marginal in my case due to the K20's weight and the high required luff tension. If I can find it, or something similar, going cheap at a boat jumble (Southampton next week?) I will still give it a go, but if not may save up for a proper roller reefing system instead.

Thanks again,

Rob
 
g7elk said:
Seajet's comments on dousing using a downhaul also gave me food for thought, as they come to the nub of the real problem, which is that I do not currently have <any> lines lead back to the cockpit (except the jib sheets obviously). Therefore I need to be up on deck to make any and all adjustments. I have been reliant on turning in to the wind and trying to strap the tiller in position whilst I venture on deck - on a couple of occasions recently this has gone badly, the boat has begun to turn and the sails have filled, requiring me to make a mad dive into the cockpit to resolve.

I now have a tiller pilot which should help more than a little, but perhaps I still need to look at things a bit more generally if I am to regularly sail singe handed.
Click to expand...

Yes use the tiller pilot to keep you motoring into the wind.

And lead at least the main halyard to the cockpit so you can drop the main from there as well.

In fact when I sail single handed, the only time I need to leave the cockpit is to remove, and replace the fenders. (why DOES etiquette demand you cant sail with fenders still hanging?)
 
You want fenders with eyes at both ends and a system of lines to the bottom of the fenders that hauls them aft and upwards and over the gunwhale.

I may just patent it and call it a LazySod system :D
 
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