Axopar 28 cabin

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miket

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Had a fun demo on this from Saxon Wharf into Southampton Water in a F6/7. Very impressive.
Interesting “shared ownership” purchase basis (25% minimum share) with fully managed contract.
Liked the people, the boat and the style of ownership.
Owned own boats for 40 years, but with much reduced current usage, so something very different for me.
Anyone any comments, one way or the other?
All documentation appears well researched but would be checked out by legals anyway.
 
IMHO shared ownership is going to be increasingly popular as new boat prices always seem to rise faster than inflation and more owners realise that the use they get out of their boats does not justify 100% ownership. Its certainly something I might consider in the future

Having said that, the figures I've seen for boat share costs often look artificially inflated to me. I'm talking more about used boats here but it could equally apply to new boats. If you multiply the price of each share by the number of shares you often end up with a total which is well above the actual market value of the boat and the same goes for the maintenance costs. I think you have to be careful that the dealer or whoever is offering the boat share is not using it as an opportunity to screw extra profit out of what is a single boat sale. So in your case if the share price x 4 adds up to more than the discounted cost of the new boat then they are using you as an extra profit opportunity. Same with the maintenance/management costs
 
+1 what Mike says (and I speak as someone who owns a third share in a boat).

How much is the "managed contract" costing the syndicate?

Would you actually own a share of the boat or a share in a company that owns the boat?

Pete
 
miket said:
Had a fun demo on this from Saxon Wharf into Southampton Water in a F6/7. Very impressive.
Interesting “shared ownership” purchase basis (25% minimum share) with fully managed contract.
Liked the people, the boat and the style of ownership.
Owned own boats for 40 years, but with much reduced current usage, so something very different for me.
Anyone any comments, one way or the other?
All documentation appears well researched but would be checked out by legals anyway.
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I had a demo on Axopar 37 from Lymington last weekend in F7 -F8 Like you I have been boating for a long time, Looking at the monthly cost I thought it was very reasonable. The 37 would be based out of Saxon Wharf where I currently Keep my Hunton , (Its up for sale) I obviously compared by current berthing fee Vs what this company would charge for the Axopar, the monthly fee includes everything. I.E Berthing fees, Insurance, Sea start and all maintenance. Plus a valet of the boat every week. you only have to pay for fuel. Yes they are a business so expect to pay for the privilege, What I liked is you get 13 weeks usage a year , That is more than I currently use the boat. There are no unexpected maintenance costs . The boat is always ready to use, I have a lease car via work that we swap every 6 months, that is also hassle free motoring to me, These days time not at work is for enjoying / relaxing not having to worry about getting boat serviced or fixed ETC . With this scheme you do "OWN" 25% share or more if you chose. Have you costed the 28 fully spec'd ?
 
Ian h said:
Yes you actually do own a share of the boat.
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That's good. I'm always a bit wary of paying someone to manage the boat but you can work out whether the cost is fair or not.

I'm a big fan of boat sharing and also like the Axopar 28. I'd prefer the T-Top but then again I'm in the Med. I'd deffo prefer the options of a cabin under the sunpad.
 
Thanks for all thoughts.
Yes, Ribshack.
I have costed the normal retail and it is close to 4 x the quarter share. I assume Ribshack get a reasonable discount and have no trouble with that.
The annual 100% management charge is strong, but as you mention, they are in business.
They have been around for 17 years which indicates some substance.
Very nice people too.
 
A few of the ribs go to Salcombe for a week as well.
The 37 we are looking at is based at Saxon Wharf - which is where my boat is already . But for a slightly increased fee it could be based in Lymington .
 
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Ian h said:
I had a demo on Axopar 37 from Lymington last weekend in F7 -F8 Like you I have been boating for a long time, Looking at the monthly cost I thought it was very reasonable. The 37 would be based out of Saxon Wharf where I currently Keep my Hunton , (Its up for sale) I obviously compared by current berthing fee Vs what this company would charge for the Axopar, the monthly fee includes everything. I.E Berthing fees, Insurance, Sea start and all maintenance. Plus a valet of the boat every week. you only have to pay for fuel. Yes they are a business so expect to pay for the privilege, What I liked is you get 13 weeks usage a year , That is more than I currently use the boat. There are no unexpected maintenance costs . The boat is always ready to use, I have a lease car via work that we swap every 6 months, that is also hassle free motoring to me, These days time not at work is for enjoying / relaxing not having to worry about getting boat serviced or fixed ETC . With this scheme you do "OWN" 25% share or more if you chose. Have you costed the 28 fully spec'd ?
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The 37 is an odd boat - not sure it makes much sense in the UK?

That said if you've owned a Hunton you can make sense out of anything ;)
 
DiscoVolante said:
The 37 is an odd boat - not sure it makes much sense in the UK?

That said if you've owned a Hunton you can make sense out of anything ;)
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The 37 Cabin makes a lot of sense for UK boating, our sea trial was in F7 -F8 roof and doors closed and heating on, lovely and warm, For how I want to use a boat with 3 grandchildren it now makes a lot of sense to me, The Hunton is a great boat but not as family friendly as the Axopar,
 
The problem is that it has very little interior space for it's extra length being an open bow and narrow beam. It also only comes with twin petrol outboards and I find the price a little OTT at £200k given it was supposed to be an affordable brand below Nimbus / Paragon. A used Paragon 31 would be a much better boat for the Solent IMO. The 28 is probably the most usable of the Axopar range - is half the price and doesn't cost £10k a year to berth in Lymington.
 
Deleted User said:
Having said that, the figures I've seen for boat share costs often look artificially inflated to me. I'm talking more about used boats here but it could equally apply to new boats. If you multiply the price of each share by the number of shares you often end up with a total which is well above the actual market value of the boat and the same goes for the maintenance costs. I think you have to be careful that the dealer or whoever is offering the boat share is not using it as an opportunity to screw extra profit out of what is a single boat sale. So in your case if the share price x 4 adds up to more than the discounted cost of the new boat then they are using you as an extra profit opportunity. Same with the maintenance/management costs
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Whilst I agree with your comments, maybe that's not the way to look at it. Can I get all (or at least most) of the boating I want per year, what does it cost per year, and how does that compare with buying a similar boat and running it per year?

Especially when you consider that you don't have to do anything, someone else is cleaning it, servicing it, antifouling it etc etc.

If the answer is that it will give you all the boating you require (or as close to as you need) at a significantly reduced cost then what does it matter if adding the four quarters up doesn't add up to the normal full cost? You're not planning to buy all four quarters.

Bit like taking a taxi ride, if you work out the cost of the car and the cost of running it and your proportion of the use of it, it's potentially a very bad deal. But all that really matters is that it can get you to the train station for a fiver and then you can forget about it. (Lots of holes in that analogy I know, but you get the point, all that really matters is, what do I get for the cost being asked and is that worth it?)
 
There are two elements to 'managing' a boat syndicate:

1) Arranging cleaning, servicing, paying the bills, etc. This is easy. I have a lady that I send a Whatapp message to, she cleans the boat, send me photos and I give her €35 when I'm next on board. I have a decent local mechanic (English speaking) who looks after the engines and an ex Fairline guy who looks after everything else.

2) Providing support for your fellow owners, for example the phone calls "engines won't start", "how do I switch the A/C on", etc. I suspect many people overestimate the value of 1) and underestimate the value of 2).

As for paying more than a quarter of a boat's entire value for a quarter 16/64's, just remember at some point you will want to exit the syndicate. If there are other syndicates out there with shares for sale, run on a non profit basis, you may struggle to sell your share in a boat that has heavy management fees.
 
ari said:
Whilst I agree with your comments, maybe that's not the way to look at it. Can I get all (or at least most) of the boating I want per year, what does it cost per year, and how does that compare with buying a similar boat and running it per year?

Especially when you consider that you don't have to do anything, someone else is cleaning it, servicing it, antifouling it etc etc.

If the answer is that it will give you all the boating you require (or as close to as you need) at a significantly reduced cost then what does it matter if adding the four quarters up doesn't add up to the normal full cost? You're not planning to buy all four quarters.

Bit like taking a taxi ride, if you work out the cost of the car and the cost of running it and your proportion of the use of it, it's potentially a very bad deal. But all that really matters is that it can get you to the train station for a fiver and then you can forget about it. (Lots of holes in that analogy I know, but you get the point, all that really matters is, what do I get for the cost being asked and is that worth it?)
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Totally agree with you. I have looked at my actual boating over the last 10 years and it is less than 10 weeks a year,
My thinking behind the boat share is that at the start of each year you have 13 weeks allocated , I.E every 4th week, I am thinking that I will put these weeks on the calendar and actually get out more often, When you own the boat there is always next week to go boating ETC .
For me it makes sense but to others it does not.
Surely if it does not make sense you do not do it.
The terms are you buy into a new boat that is for a 3 year period, then the boat is sold and you receive a quarter of the sale money back,
As said before I lease a car yes at good rate, I am not bothered I do not own it, its hassle free motoring, So the boat share is to me hassle free.

They say that running a boat annually you should allow 10% of the value, I bet for most of us this is approx correct,

I know people like to tinker with their boats, I want to turn up and go boating , living 1 hour from the boat I can not just pop down for an hour or so,
 
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DiscoVolante said:
The problem is that it has very little interior space for it's extra length being an open bow and narrow beam. It also only comes with twin petrol outboards and I find the price a little OTT at £200k given it was supposed to be an affordable brand below Nimbus / Paragon. A used Paragon 31 would be a much better boat for the Solent IMO. The 28 is probably the most usable of the Axopar range - is half the price and doesn't cost £10k a year to berth in Lymington.
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The 37 has the interior space that suits the type of boating that I now wish to do, The 37 Cabin is well suited to UK boating, I do not see the problem with twin petrols . Yes a little more expensive than twin diesels but for me that is not a problem, the 28 cabin is very cramped. We all have different requirements from a boat.
I have seen the Paragon and its not what I want
 
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