Are people becoming useless

[oldsaltoz]

Got to love that! Caring grandparents palm off 22 year old death trap on inexperienced driver so they can justify buying a safer car for themselves!

Though the car is 22 years old it has no rust, a full service record and had a number of items upgraded in the long life.
Brakes replaced with larger drums and pads, steering system replaced including CV joints, seat belts replaced, wiper motor and linkage replaced.
I would never give anyone a vehicle that was in anyway unsafe, and I certainly would allow the wife to dive one.

So far from being a death trap, 'some' of us care about others and our own values.

Good luck and fair winds.

 

[Jim@sea]

but I know someone with small hands who can do it it without any dismantling.

A lady came into my garage and asked if we could change a rear light bulb, and I could not get my hand down the space between the frame and the back of the lamp cluster. Don't worry I said we have a special tool for that. so I went in the workshop and returned with a mechanic who had a deformed hand, two fingers and a thumb, he was able to change the bulb. I have never forgotten the look on the lady's face, she was trying (unsuccessfully) not to laugh.

 

[Deleted member 36384]

I agree but I think there's a fear of getting things wrong or breaking things that my (our?) generation didn't seem to have..

My first motor bike was an old BSA C15 at 16 years old. After much whacking with a hammer the obvious way of removing the front wheel spindle to me, which was of course wrong, revealed that the clip thing which held the bearing in place had shattered the cast retaining lip on the hub. Lesson learned, one of many such practical lessons. No Haynes manuals until much later in life, all word of mouth and trial. I bought that bike from a geezer in London, who stuffed two C15s in couple of tea chests and dispatched to Scotland. Such simple junk bikes were still available even in the mid 1980s. Modern junk bikes are still available but the plastic bits and molded stuff can be a bit less intuitive.

 

[nimbusgb]

Though the car is 22 years old it has no rust, a full service record and had a number of items upgraded in the long life.
Brakes replaced with larger drums and pads, steering system replaced including CV joints, seat belts replaced, wiper motor and linkage replaced.
I would never give anyone a vehicle that was in anyway unsafe, and I certainly would allow the wife to dive one.

So far from being a death trap, 'some' of us care about others and our own values.

Good luck and fair winds.

I guess you missed the smileys then!

 

[Avocet]

Well, that's one option, I guess. Trouble is, Mrs Avocet's current velociped is an 8 year old 4x4. While it would be a good, safe car for the daughter, I doubt she' be able to afford the insurance or fuel. Over here, insurance for first-time drivers is absolutely crippling, so they can only really afford to insure little shopping trollies with tiny engines. Also, we tend to hang on to cars until they're dead. There's plenty of life left in the 4x4 at present, but it's also fairly thirsty, so we HAD been wondering about replacing it with a more modern one. I do all the car maintenance in the household, so I'd still end up maintaining it anyway, if we did hand it own. Certainly an option though.

Will PM you about yacht, but back in the water on a local lake and this year, we had the best summer that I think we've had for 10 years! It's everything I could ever have hoped. I don't mind admitting that in the course of the renovations, I did, more than once, think about chain-sawing the b'stard up and weighing-in the lead from the keel for scrap! I'm SO glad I didn't now. It has been utterly magical to see the lads (they're much younger than the daughter - 9 and 11) gaining confidence on the water with every trip.

Hi Avocet,
One of our Grand daughters was looking for her first car,great kid.
The wife was not looking for new car despite the old (22 years) Toyota Corolla Hatch back / shopping trolley.
I decided it was time to get a safer vehicle for the wife and pass the old Toyota onto the grand daughter.

Well they both fell in love with their cars. though the pink hart the grand daughter put on the Toyota looked a naff.

So what if the first car is not new or near new, neither of these precipitants complained, ecstatic probably best describes their reaction.

Neither had any clue what was planned so It was a complete surprise to both and hint of any expectation.

PS. The wife loves the new Kia with all the bits and bobs, cruise control, 6 speed auto, blue tooth, navigation, independent rear suspension, the speedometer goes to 330 kph but I have not got even close to that on a run, restricted to 110 kmh here in Oz. speed limit, not the car.

Good luck and fair winds.

PS. What's the latest with the yacht?

 

[GrahamM376]

My first motor bike was an old BSA C15 at 16 years old. After much whacking with a hammer the obvious way of removing the front wheel spindle to me, which was of course wrong, revealed that the clip thing which held the bearing in place had shattered the cast retaining lip on the hub. Lesson learned, one of many such practical lessons. No Haynes manuals until much later in life, all word of mouth and trial. I bought that bike from a geezer in London, who stuffed two C15s in couple of tea chests and dispatched to Scotland. Such simple junk bikes were still available even in the mid 1980s. Modern junk bikes are still available but the plastic bits and molded stuff can be a bit less intuitive.

My first bike (at the age of 14) was a James 98, then a 125, which we were only supposed to ride around the fields - got nicked on the road by local bobby and fined £4.10.0d. First car at 16 was a 1930's Morgan 3 wheeler which, IIRC cost around £35. Anyone safety conscious should never drive one of those.

 

[vyv_cox]

First car at 16 was a 1930's Morgan 3 wheeler which, IIRC cost around £35. Anyone safety conscious should never drive one of those.

How much today, I wonder? The new replicas go for about £30,000, original ones x10?

 

[Sarnia]

Interesting theory! I used to play with Meccano, built plastic kits, built balsa planes, built RC boats, etc, as a kid. Then lots of DIY car work. I've always loved taking things apart and putting them back together. As a result, I can confidently tackle almost any job around the house or boat. A lot of younger people just grew up with the telly on, and never developed any practical skills.

Must +1 that.. As kids we built everything we could, street carts, bikes starting with a bare frame, scrounged for wheels etc, a number of us built a cinder race track, was a post war bomb site, we had pits and mechanic areas where we could strip any part and rebuild it between races, my mothers vaseline pot ( she sometimes marshalled the heats) always had black in it from where we dipped fingers in to lubricate stearing bearings and place the ball bearings back into place. Similarly with balsa and models, later with first cars which needed continuous maintenance, it was said in thos days the cure for delinquency was to give the deliquent an old car to keep in roadworthy condition, they wouldnt have time for crime!
And so it continues, tackling so many jobs, built a bungalow over three years, renovated houses and built back kitchens for my kids, one had a small general shop, when the shop next door became available, bought it, told her to go for a two weeks holiday, closed the shop, knocked them together, and she returned it was now double the size, stocked and ready to go, the only proffessionals on site were plasterers and electricians, not something that happens to much today.

 

[laika]

A lot of younger people just grew up with the telly on, and never developed any practical skills.

There's a whole generation of smug grease monkeys who completely lack a comprehensive knowledge of 1970s TV and advertising jingles.

sorry...just to present the other perspective...

 

[Scomber]

DIY

i always remember my dads advice which had been passed onto him by relative who to a young working class lad seemed to be doing okay

the advice.......

we cannot afford to pay anyone to do anything we can do ourselves

thanks dad -- and god bless

oh yes .... and a true YORKSHIREMAN !!

 

[Scotty_Tradewind]

Surprisingly big bangs from a bit of weed killer and a couple of other ingredients and some metal pipe or, bin liners full of oxy and acet. Try doing it these days and your collar will be felt big-time! Much of the fun has gone.

Yes, been there, done that! Weed killer and sugar, rammed in a pipe, fuse from a broken up penny banger, light fuse and run like hell.
The last time I did that I ran round the corner straight into a coppers arms. They used to patrol the streets once upon a time.

I blame the lack of proper Craft lessons in school.

I rue the day we called it CDT then Design.

I did an engineering craft apprenticeship for five years before working as a craftsman.

Eventually taught woodwork in school. Then I taught CDT wood, metal and plastics with basic technical drawing. O.K. so far.

Then the subject was gotten hold of by academics who wanted to uprate the subject and give it the umbrella name of Design.

Out of the window go the straight forward learning all the woodwork joints etc. working on sheet metals, filing mild steel, brazing etc.
In comes drawing little sketches and pretending you were designing something and then making a model of it out of paper or cardboard.
All being assessed internally with little or no exam!

Hopeless. Producing kids who can make models and mini bits and pieces out of odds and ends is no better than 'Blue Peter'.

S.

 

[ghostlymoron]

I disagree. I went to a grammar school and the only practical stuff was woodwork in the first two years. At year three, being earmarked for university, I was told to drop woodwork in favour of Latin. So spent the next two years learning a dead language that has never been the slightest good to me. Despite that I can service old cars, have built a house (excluding brickwork and plastering), and tackle most tasks on a boat.
It's not education, it's motivation.

 

[vyv_cox]

I disagree. I went to a grammar school and the only practical stuff was woodwork in the first two years. At year three, being earmarked for university, I was told to drop woodwork in favour of Latin. So spent the next two years learning a dead language that has never been the slightest good to me. Despite that I can service old cars, have built a house (excluding brickwork and plastering), and tackle most tasks on a boat.
It's not education, it's motivation.

Most of what you say is the same for me. However the last sentence raises some alarm bells. Is it better for people to understand that they have no competence to do jobs, and get someone else to do them, or be motivated to make dangerous modifications and unreliable servicing? There have been several honest posts here in the last few years admitting that owners have created major problems by being motivated to have a go.

 

[ghostlymoron]

It was a neat final sentence and should possibly have caveats attached.

 

[Avocet]

And yet... today's school kids actually get to do FAR more practical hands-on stuff than I ever did! Like Ghostlymoron, the only practical stuff I could have done at school was woodwork - and that was very much looked down-upon as being what people who were too thick to do something "proper" (like Latin) did. I started off doing Tech Drawing (which I really enjoyed, but was "strongly encouraged" to drop it in favour of Spanish O-Level). These days, my kids get to do all sorts of "design and technology" stuff that I'd have LOVED to do when at school. The problem is that they see it as "something that stays at school". So far, they haven't had THAT much enthusiasm for continuing it at home. We've built a soap box cart, and a working tank that they drive round in, so it's not like I ain't trying to enthuse them in this regard! I do fear for where the next generation of Colin Chapmans and Trevor Wilkinsons are going to come from!

 

[vyv_cox]

And yet... today's school kids actually get to do FAR more practical hands-on stuff than I ever did!

You are almost straying into my favourite rant there! Most of the great rock music of the past 50 years was created by people with no formal musical education. Now that kids have access to professional teaching of guitars, drums, brass, keyboards etc at school, playing the music of their choice, where is all the fabulous rock music? All we seem to get now is tuneless droning.

 

[bikerbill]

I disagree. I went to a grammar school and the only practical stuff was woodwork in the first two years. At year three, being earmarked for university, I was told to drop woodwork in favour of Latin. So spent the next two years learning a dead language that has never been the slightest good to me. Despite that I can service old cars, have built a house (excluding brickwork and plastering), and tackle most tasks on a boat.
It's not education, it's motivation.

I would argue that people need to be motivated before they can be educated. At school, we got Technical Drawing, woodwork and metal work, subjects which I did well in and learned skills I still use to this day. Might have been because some pupils had the right aptitude for these subjects, while others in the class who were not motivated didn't do well. Could also be how we were taught. I recently restored an old BSA Goldstar that my son (23) helped me with. I was quite surprised as he had never showed an interest before. He would ask how this worked and when I let him carry out tasks by himself, I could see that he was thinking critically.

 

[usernamenotvalid]

Son in law teaches heavy vehicle mechanics, formerly known as diesel fitting at TAFE, that's tech college in Oz. Seems they use a computer welding simulator to speed up module type learning. Apparently one large company had a spate of very expensive failures recently and the whole thing is being kept under wraps. I spent thirty plus years catching fire and being burnt and uncomfortable doing it properly. But I spose welding with a mouse on a screen is a lot safer. Until the bits of metal suddenly aren't stuck together anymore.

 

[GrahamM376]

Most of what you say is the same for me. However the last sentence raises some alarm bells. Is it better for people to understand that they have no competence to do jobs, and get someone else to do them, or be motivated to make dangerous modifications and unreliable servicing? There have been several honest posts here in the last few years admitting that owners have created major problems by being motivated to have a go.

Maybe you and I grew up in the same era when formal qualifications weren't as necessary as they are for kids leaving school today, I "left" school at 15 in 1961 when jobs could be had just with a phone around and few employers were asking for any GCEs. I think we tended to have more practical skills, playing with Bayco and Meccano, building tree houses, building our own bikes out of scrappers etc. than later generations although they can leave me standing at IT - things have moved on since our valve powered army surplus radios.

I've always been willing to have a go and particularly today, there's so much information around, even instructive utube videos and I get frustrated by people who have the time but won't attempt even very simple jobs, then complain how much they've been charged.

 

[Lakesailor]

You are almost straying into my favourite rant there! Most of the great rock music of the past 50 years was created by people with no formal musical education. Now that kids have access to professional teaching of guitars, drums, brass, keyboards etc at school, playing the music of their choice, where is all the fabulous rock music? All we seem to get now is tuneless droning.

Or indeed, most skills.

Rock climbing? You need an SPA

Yachting? You need RYA training


Etc etc.


Gone are the days that we just started doing something because we fancied having a go.