Anyone sailed a Moody 34 or 346?

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NealB

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I've just dug out the YM review of the Moody 34, by JJ and AB, written after a gusty test sail, in flat seas, in 1983.

As an ex-Moody 33 mk1 owner, I was very surprised to read their opinion on the 34's sailing performance eg rounding up unpredictably in gusts, and being generally unpleasant to windward.

They suggested her fat bum was to blame, though there's a ps to the article, where they say Bill Dixon subsequently had a look at the test boat, and declared that her mast had too much rake.

Any more up to date views, please?

Thanks.
 
My 346 sails beautifully - she's NOT for sale but if your in the Solent mid week drop me an email and you can see for you self

John
 
Neal - we previously owned a fin keel 346 for 7 years and sailed her for around 1000 miles each year including some pretty heavy windward beats. I was pleasantly surprised at her sailing performance though the new sails we bought in the first season made a dramatic improvement! Like many boats they respond to being sailed in a particular way. It just takes a bit of time to find out the best way.
 
We had a 346 for 3 years, and it was a great first boat.

It depends what you used do, and how you want to use the boat.

Not a racer, but a great cruiser easily sailed short handed.

The MOA is superb value, and the technical forum which Cantata has mentioned is excellent.
 
Thanks for the replies....sounds like it was the mast rake causing the problems.

Certainly, we were very happy with the performance of our Moody 33 that we took to the Mediterranean for 18 months, back in the early 90's: decent performance (used to surprise quite a few people, in fact), well balanced and very easily handled.

To Zambant... if I can take up your very kind offer, I'll send you a pm.
 
I have sailed a Moody 346, and I think you will find that the reviewer in 1983 was just much less used to yachts that round up when heeled than any reviewer would be now. Certainly the 346 would track on happily at greater angles of heel than my present Jeanneau 35. If when looking to buy last I could have found an near-as-new Moody 346 I'd probably have bought it.

Most modern boats sail beautifully up to about 15 degrees of heel, but shortly after that you hit an angle at which one degree more means no control. I came to the Jeanneau 35 from owning a heavy long-keeler that you could sail on heeled 45% with sidedecks and coachroof sides awash if you didn't want to bother reefing for a squall.

Modern handling is the price you pay for modern interior layouts and space packed into relatively short hulls ..... The nicest handling boat I've ever sailed was a late 70s era She 36 - but there is no practical way you could put a wide double berth cabin into that hull and still have a saloon, even if you started with a bare hull to fit out - and I heard a rumour that there was such a bare hull sitting in Ireland.
 
NealB said:
I've just dug out the YM review of the Moody 34, by JJ and AB, written after a gusty test sail, in flat seas, in 1983.

As an ex-Moody 33 mk1 owner, I was very surprised to read their opinion on the 34's sailing performance eg rounding up unpredictably in gusts, and being generally unpleasant to windward.

They suggested her fat bum was to blame, though there's a ps to the article, where they say Bill Dixon subsequently had a look at the test boat, and declared that her mast had too much rake.

Any more up to date views, please?

Thanks.
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Found just that - directionally unstable. Had a 346 for 4 years and never happy with it so changed for a 376 which is totally different.

We used to do N Wales down to France most summers and inboard autohelm was the norm. Wind strength would only have to change by a couple of knots and it would either tuck up or drop off quicker than the helm could catch it, wake looked like a lazy "S". When hand steering it wasn't so much of a problem as a slight tweak would correct as change in wind speed sensed. I think the used boat test said something along the lines of "the boat would change direction for no apparent reason". Ours was a twin keeler but the test boat was fin.
 
GrahamM376 said:
I think the used boat test said something along the lines of "the boat would change direction for no apparent reason". Ours was a twin keeler but the test boat was fin.
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Here's the precise words of wisdom from the article:

"To windward, she responded unpredictably in the gusts, luffing up and bearing away in an exaggerated manner. Waves, too, caused her to veer sharply off course, and we found her a hard boat to anticipate".
 
NealB said:
Here's the precise words of wisdom from the article:

"To windward, she responded unpredictably in the gusts, luffing up and bearing away in an exaggerated manner. Waves, too, caused her to veer sharply off course, and we found her a hard boat to anticipate".
Click to expand...

I don't remember that wording, it's a bit more extreme than the one I read and I think from my experience overstated. Is there another YM or PBO used boat report, maybe on the 346?

addition - When helming rather than autohelm as I said before it wasn't much of a problem. I well remember racing ours one lively day, hard on the wind on one leg, gusting F9 with the end of the boom in the water at times. Quite predicatable and very seaworthy boat.
 
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NealB said:
Here's the precise words of wisdom from the article:

"To windward, she responded unpredictably in the gusts, luffing up and bearing away in an exaggerated manner. Waves, too, caused her to veer sharply off course, and we found her a hard boat to anticipate".
Click to expand...

I'd say that's a load of carp. They were obviously struggling to set her up properly on the day.
 
I have made a few posts on this forum regarding the unstable directional qualities of my 346. The replies you have got so far, mirror the response I got. I was told mostly that the boat must be balanced with good sails.

In short I would confirm the review article that the boat tends to charge off in any direction at the least bit of inattention. I have sailed mine for three summer years and I still dare not let go of the wheel to have a pee. I have sailed other boats for years on end so I know it isn't my technique that causes it. This year I will bolt my Aries on which is presently on my other boat to augment the Autohelm 3000 and hope that works.

I will also fit a pedestal mounted chart plotter so that I can avoid the near disaster last year when I couldn't go below to get a fresh chart.

I sail single handed so I hope the Aries will solve the problem.

To me she is like an inverted triangle balanced on its point ready to fall either way at the least excuse.

I have installed a new smaller 100kg Yanmar to replace the heavy 300kg Thorneycroft along with the mild steel fuel tank swapped for plastic so a major shift in weight distribution. It could be better or worse I am actually excited to find out in the Spring.

EDIT The angle of mast rake is a new one on me and never heard of it as a reason before so I will try that in the Spring. My mast is presently vertical with no rake so who knows, playing with the rake may improve things.
 
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BurnitBlue said:
I have installed a new smaller 100kg Yanmar to replace the heavy 300kg Thorneycroft along with the mild steel fuel tank swapped for plastic so a major shift in weight distribution. It could be better or worse I am actually excited to find out in the Spring.

EDIT The angle of mast rake is a new one on me and never heard of it as a reason before so I will try that in the Spring. My mast is presently vertical with no rake so who knows, playing with the rake may improve things.
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The directional problem you have sounds far worse than we had which in our case can better be described as annoying. Our rig was the original and was set up correctly according to Moody yard.

Will be interesting to see how your boat will trim with all that weight removed as it's already light, sailing solo in a 6 berth boat/cockpit.
 
GrahamM376 said:
The directional problem you have sounds far worse than we had which in our case can better be described as annoying. Our rig was the original and was set up correctly according to Moody yard.

Will be interesting to see how your boat will trim with all that weight removed as it's already light, sailing solo in a 6 berth boat/cockpit.
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That is a good observation because I have noticed that my smudge line at the waterline is quite a bit lower at the stern compared to the previous owner's smudge line who sailed with crew. I really expect the unbalance to be worse with the lighter engine but I am happy about the light weight because I can load the stern with the 35kg Aries and later (if I want) a goal post davit system for solar panel and dinghy stowage.

I like the boat very much when she is sailing and she is OK to live on with the separate aft sleeping cabin. I just need to be able to let go the wheel and hope my Aries will allow that. I have owned that Aries for donkeys years and when it was bolted to my HR Rasmus I could sail for days without touching the wheel.

EDIT: Don't know if I have made it clear that the engine was swapped during the early winter and has not been afloat with it installed yet. So it will behave very differently in 2014.
 
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moodyNick said:
We had a 346 for 3 years, and it was a great first boat.

It depends what you used do, and how you want to use the boat.

Not a racer, but a great cruiser easily sailed short handed.

The MOA is superb value, and the technical forum which Cantata has mentioned is excellent.
Click to expand...

We too had a 346 and agree with Nick
Had an MOA do where we were all in Haslar. On the sailback to Swanwick we showed a clean pair of heels to an almost new Moody 34 :-)
 
I know people with 346's and quite honestly I have never heard of these problems with directional stability. This generation of Dixon-designed Moodys are generally well regarded for their sailing and sea-keeping qualities.
The behaviour that has been described sounds to me as though the boat is trimmed with the rig forward, to the point of acquiring lee helm. I think if a boat of mine behaved like this I'd be thinking of raking the mast back more.
 
Cantata said:
I know people with 346's and quite honestly I have never heard of these problems with directional stability. This generation of Dixon-designed Moodys are generally well regarded for their sailing and sea-keeping qualities.
The behaviour that has been described sounds to me as though the boat is trimmed with the rig forward, to the point of acquiring lee helm. I think if a boat of mine behaved like this I'd be thinking of raking the mast back more.
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Well I am not going to argue further because this is not my thread albeit on topic. Recall this. The original test of the boat by JJ and AB found her directionally unstable. Graham found the same and got rid of the boat after 3 years. I found that I could not let go of the wheel for more than a few seconds before she rounded up or took off down wind and this is not gradual it is a sudden and quite violent course change and is not easy to get back on course because the sails and sheets are all over the place. I couldn't even put my sunglasses on without the boat charging off at 90 degrees swing. Everything has to be with one hand constantly on the wheel. Believe me, it also happened under genoa alone with a furled mainsail so I don't think on reflection that mast rake has any bearing on it.

This is the sixth boat I have owned and I swear that there is a design fault somewhere. It is steady under engine so the problem lies with the sail balance and maybe the rudder but there is a fault somewhere. The only answer I have come up with is that here is too much area of rudder forward of the pivot point giving positive feedback to even a slight course change without a hand on the wheel to dampen the effect.

I sincerely hope my Aries will give me a respite from being a prisoner at the wheel.
 
BurnitBlue said:
Well I am not going to argue further because this is not my thread albeit on topic. Recall this. The original test of the boat by JJ and AB found her directionally unstable. Graham found the same and got rid of the boat after 3 years. I found that I could not let go of the wheel for more than a few seconds before she rounded up or took off down wind and this is not gradual it is a sudden and quite violent course change and is not easy to get back on course because the sails and sheets are all over the place. I couldn't even put my sunglasses on without the boat charging off at 90 degrees swing. Everything has to be with one hand constantly on the wheel. Believe me, it also happened under genoa alone with a furled mainsail so I don't think on reflection that mast rake has any bearing on it.

This is the sixth boat I have owned and I swear that there is a design fault somewhere. It is steady under engine so the problem lies with the sail balance and maybe the rudder but there is a fault somewhere. The only answer I have come up with is that here is too much area of rudder forward of the pivot point giving positive feedback to even a slight course change without a hand on the wheel to dampen the effect.

I sincerely hope my Aries will give me a respite from being a prisoner at the wheel.
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Does she always turn to leeward, or is the direction random?
 
mrming said:
Does she always turn to leeward, or is the direction random?
Click to expand...

Although I have not tabulated the turns accurately I would say from memory that they are random because I recall the sails being suddenly aback or sometimes they are full after rounding up with a large heel as the wind comes on the beam.

These course changes are not small or gradual but a massive swing bringing the boat out of control by about 90 degrees before I can get hold of the wheel.
 
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