Antifoul - every mistake in the book

Sailfree

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10yrs of Micron extra peeling in places!

Firstly after 4 days of rubbing down the bad areas with an orbital sander I am developing muscles but can still only manage short bursts holding sander over my head. Got face covered and good fitting face filter and high winds are wonderful in taking dust away ( the bit that not collected in the dust bag). I am always standing upwind.

However if I realised how bad anti foul condition was I would have arranged to strip it using soda blasting. Other method I seen work well was doing it in 500mm squares with cling film covering the paint stripper then scrape. However 43' boat would be hard work/expensive any way I tried.

I thought anti foul was self eroding but on my boat it's very thick in places and little bond between various coats.

Problems

1. certain areas were easy to rub down to the gel coat and I suspect the mould release wax was badly cleaned off especially one patch that matches exactly the area and position of a cradle support.

2. 1st coat was blue and next years I went for black applied by boat yard. It was applied straight on top of the pressure wash by "professionals". I note that International Paints fact sheets States this method. All I can say is that some areas the bond was inadequate.

3. When I go over the anti foul with the sander problem areas just shed a complete layer and area grows as I try to get to an edge that "feathers". Again complete lack of bond between yearly coats. I suspect the major cause of this is applying a second coat too soon. We always waited until it was dry but now looking up fact sheet and allowing for cold weather we should have left it 24hrs between coats.

4. I am wondering how well anti foul was stirred but think this might be a minor point as I did most of the stirring not my crew! I do wonder though about the areas that are very thick with anti foul build up and 100% bonded between coats and can only conclude that very thick and hence inadequately mixed antifoul was applied in these areas - mostly along water line (2 coats each year) but certainly not been self eroding but bond between coats in these thick areas appears excellent!

Solution

5. with mechanical rubbing down and feathered edges I am hoping this years coat ( changing to blue) will adhere well but will wash down white gel coat areas with white spirit and use a primer.



Will see how good the prep is once I start applying this years antifoul!
 
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BE really careful with an orbital sander and AF. The dust is effectively poison hence the usual advice to wet sand.

But thanks for the info - brings home the importance of RTFM
 
BE really careful with an orbital sander and AF. The dust is effectively poison hence the usual advice to wet sand.

But thanks for the info - brings home the importance of RTFM

Had to smile at RTFM - had to look it up - read the f*****g manual.

Using a metebo dual action 150dia sander - great piece of kit and recommended by a neighbouring boat whose workshop use them professionally.

However I did read the manual. Point 1 knob marked 1 to 6 is speed control but doesn't say whether 1 or 6 is high speed, another switch is turbo speed but again it doesn't say which way OK you can figure these out but be helpful if manual stated it. One that less obvious is the change from 2mm oscillation to 6mm. Yes I can follow instruction to change it but it's not so obvious which setting you have!

Last point yes I know antifoul is meant to be poison but with dumbing down of toxicity due to environmental concerns I really wonder how much it now works as sea life loves it!!!
 
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I suspect the manual in question refers to the AF instructions, not the sander.

It did - Not that I red the data sheets religiously in great detail but has been lodged in my mind that you don't dry sand AF. Agree that copper not as bad for you as TBT but even so. Personally I just take off the really loose bits, primocon where needed then slap on Cruiser Uno and hope it erodes. Will slurry blast if it gets too bad as don't think I could cope with sanding it back myself!!
 
It did - Not that I red the data sheets religiously in great detail but has been lodged in my mind that you don't dry sand AF. Agree that copper not as bad for you as TBT but even so. Personally I just take off the really loose bits, primocon where needed then slap on Cruiser Uno and hope it erodes. Will slurry blast if it gets too bad as don't think I could cope with sanding it back myself!!
I scraped mine back. Never again! Slow, body aching work - I usually fly a desk.
 
After this winters work, will I suffer a long slow lingering death?

Probably not, but you are unlikely to have problems with barnacles on your bottom.

I scraped mine back. Never again! Slow, body aching work - I usually fly a desk.

I've got a titchy 16' boat to do, and I have been postponing it all winter. No more excuses: the industrial strength of RemoveAll is there, has been tested and works so there is no excuse. I start ... soon.
 
10yrs of Micron extra peeling in places!

Firstly after 4 days of rubbing down the bad areas with an orbital sander I am developing muscles but can still only manage short bursts holding sander over my head. Got face covered and good fitting face filter and high winds are wonderful in taking dust away ( the bit that not collected in the dust bag). I am always standing upwind.


I'm glad my boat / house / car are not downwind of you with that useful wind carrying all the dust away so that it is no longer your problem!
 
Too right, the OP's attitude is sod the other boats and users in the yard. All that antifoul dust settling on other boats, should be a nice surprise for them, and anyone walking or working downwind of your sanding gets a lungful without your "full face mask". Some people are incredibly inconsiderate, just because they're too lazy to wet sand, or too mean to get it properly blasted.
 
Ditto.

Holding a polisher whilst doing the topsides was bad enough and every time I do it I think never again. That and the thread re how much p.a. do make me doubt the sanity of ownership from time to time

Main halyard + longish bit of bungee = weightless polisher
 
Sailfree
I too have found areas of antifoul that peeled off easily back to a shiny gel coat, and deduced that the mould release wax had not been fully cleaned off and abraded during commissioning. Same bl**dy commissioning gang!
My solution two years ago was a slurry blast back to the gelcoat. Now happily building up coats again, but reckon it will see me out before needing another blast.
 
10yrs of Micron extra peeling in places!

Firstly after 4 days of rubbing down the bad areas with an orbital sander I am developing muscles but can still only manage short bursts holding sander over my head. Got face covered and good fitting face filter and high winds are wonderful in taking dust away ( the bit that not collected in the dust bag). I am always standing upwind.

However if I realised how bad anti foul condition was I would have arranged to strip it using soda blasting. Other method I seen work well was doing it in 500mm squares with cling film covering the paint stripper then scrape. However 43' boat would be hard work/expensive any way I tried.

I thought anti foul was self eroding but on my boat it's very thick in places and little bond between various coats.

Problems

1. certain areas were easy to rub down to the gel coat and I suspect the mould release wax was badly cleaned off especially one patch that matches exactly the area and position of a cradle support.

2. 1st coat was blue and next years I went for black applied by boat yard. It was applied straight on top of the pressure wash by "professionals". I note that International Paints fact sheets States this method. All I can say is that some areas the bond was inadequate.

3. When I go over the anti foul with the sander problem areas just shed a complete layer and area grows as I try to get to an edge that "feathers". Again complete lack of bond between yearly coats. I suspect the major cause of this is applying a second coat too soon. We always waited until it was dry but now looking up fact sheet and allowing for cold weather we should have left it 24hrs between coats.

4. I am wondering how well anti foul was stirred but think this might be a minor point as I did most of the stirring not my crew! I do wonder though about the areas that are very thick with anti foul build up and 100% bonded between coats and can only conclude that very thick and hence inadequately mixed antifoul was applied in these areas - mostly along water line (2 coats each year) but certainly not been self eroding but bond between coats in these thick areas appears excellent!

Solution

5. with mechanical rubbing down and feathered edges I am hoping this years coat ( changing to blue) will adhere well but will wash down white gel coat areas with white spirit and use a primer.



Will see how good the prep is once I start applying this years antifoul!

Sanders are a real nuisance and even if you get a smooth slope to the areas that are chipped off, you'll still have dimples under the new anti-foul. Try chipping it off with a scraper. The stripper and clingfilm/alu foil works as you've discovered.

However, you haven't made every mistake in the book until you've used filler to fill in the holes where it has flaked off (as the PO of my boat did).

The first year I got right back to the gel coat (43 footer too so took some work). I consoled myself with thinking it was easier than long-boarding a racer. Since then I've used rough scourers to take the bulk of the previous year's self-eroding anti-foul off - about four days does it using the scourer manually and keeping it wet.
 
Too right, the OP's attitude is sod the other boats and users in the yard. All that antifoul dust settling on other boats, should be a nice surprise for them, and anyone walking or working downwind of your sanding gets a lungful without your "full face mask". Some people are incredibly inconsiderate, just because they're too lazy to wet sand, or too mean to get it properly blasted.

Bit harsh!
 
I have a blunt chisel which I use for chipping off loose antifoul. I find that a rotary drill attachment with a very coarse sanding disc easiest for feathering off the edges. It seems to be gentler than an orbital sander and even less likely to go too far than a hand sanding block. I only have some patches around the waterline. Today was a good day for it - the dust just blew away.

My usual problem is getting Optima to stick to the Primocon that I cover my patch with. I think I will have to take more trouble roughing it to get it to key.
 
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