Another UKBA issue

  • Thread starter Thread starter timbartlett
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When you analyse what the UKBA is there for, it is to stop the smuggling of people or goods. Goods are smuggled because the are not available here or expensive. People are smuggled for the standard of living. We could remove the smuggling of good by making goods available at a reasonable price i.e. if drugs were legal, think of the money that could be saved by not having Drug Squads, crime as a result of drug use etc. People smuggling could be reduced by a swift return to country of origin once in the UK. At the moment once the person is in the country, it is easy for them to disappear.

Sorry, probably should be in the Lounge. Just working back to a root cause of why they need to board yachts.
 
I was watching what appeared to be a UKBA rib this morning in the Bristol Channel. (It was the only boat visible between Cardiff and the Second Severn Crossing so I was desperate.)

It was a large grey RIB with "Police" written on the side, a goalpost hoop over the stern and another contraption near the bow that could have been a gun emplacement, water cannon, kiddies climbing frame, or just about anything really. On board were six people wearing black.

The RIB would do a couple of doughnuts, jump it's own wake, then stop. Then turn and do it again. Then race off 100m in some direction or other and do it all again. Finally it moved off at speed up the channel and out of sight. I'm sure it was involved in some vital activity in defence of our lives and liberty, but it looked to be behaving more like a teenager on a holiday jetski.
 
trapezeartist said:
I was watching what appeared to be a UKBA rib this morning in the Bristol Channel. (It was the only boat visible between Cardiff and the Second Severn Crossing so I was desperate.)

It was a large grey RIB with "Police" written on the side, a goalpost hoop over the stern and another contraption near the bow that could have been a gun emplacement, water cannon, kiddies climbing frame, or just about anything really. On board were six people wearing black.

The RIB would do a couple of doughnuts, jump it's own wake, then stop. Then turn and do it again. Then race off 100m in some direction or other and do it all again. Finally it moved off at speed up the channel and out of sight. I'm sure it was involved in some vital activity in defence of our lives and liberty, but it looked to be behaving more like a teenager on a holiday jetski.
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If it said "police" down the side then it was almost certainly, and this might come as a big surprise, a Police rib! UKBA ribs don't say police. They may still say HM CUSTOMS.

As to what the Police rib was doing - they could well have been training. Presumably high speed manouvres are even more important for the police than standard powerboat owners - and even that is covered in RYA PB2.

I suspect this http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/4339/img1203editedny5.jpg was the vessel in question which belongs to Avon and Somerset Police.
 
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I'd be interested to know who would be liable should any UKBA officer be injured on your boat - say the shock of them boarding you so suddenly causes you to lose your concentration and accidentily gybe, knocking one of them out/overboard with your boom - maybe even killing one of them. Who would be liable? How would the insurance co take it? Should you be making them sign a H&S disclaimer form before allowing them to board?
I also wonder if you could you claim from the UKBA for any damage caused to your boat?
 
From their website

About Us - More Information The UK Border Agency is an agency of the Home Office. The Agency was formed in April 2008 to improve the United Kingdom's security through stronger border protection whilst welcoming legitimate travellers and trade.

The Agency brings together the work previously carried out by the Border and Immigration Agency, Customs detection work at the border from Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs (HMRC) and UK Visa Services from the Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO)

The UK Border Agency is a global organisation with 25,000 staff, including more than 9,000 warranted officers, operating in local communities, at borders across 135 countries worldwide with responsibility for securing the United Kingdom borders and controlling migration in the United Kingdom.

Our Organisation Agency status gives us and our people the freedom to operate and focus our resources within a clearly defined mandate from the Home Office. It provides us with:

a sharper focus on delivery, better meeting the public's expectations in maintaining secure borders, finding and removing illegal immigrants and tackling those who facilitate them coming here
clearer accountability, not only to the public, but also to our customers, to our partners and to ministers
greater operational freedom to respond to the challenges we face and to manage our people and resources more effectively
the ability to reinvest savings into improving our business delivery
an opportunity to forge new ways of working and new relationships with our partners and
a new identity to bring our staff together under a clear, single brand with unified clarity of purpose
Our Objectives

The UK Border Agency has three strategic objectives:

we will protect our border and our national interests
we will tackle border tax fraud, smuggling and immigration crime
we will implement fast and fair decisions
We also support departmental strategic objectives of the Home Office, HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC) and the Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO). As an executive agency of the Home Office, we support all the Home Office's strategic objectives. We lead on the Home Office objective to secure our border and control migration for the benefit of our country.

Our enforcement activities actively contribute to the delivery of departmental strategic objectives belonging to HM Revenue & Customs and the Foreign and Commonwealth Office. We lead or contribute to the following HM Revenue & Customs objectives:

Improve the extent to which individuals and businesses pay the amount of tax due and receive the credits and payments to which they are entitled
Improve customers' experience of HMRC and improve the United Kingdom business environment
Reducing the risk of illicit import and export of material which might harm the United Kingdom's physical and social well-being
We contribute to the Foreign and Commonwealth Office objective to support managed migration for Britain.

Our values

In September 2005 we launched our values, developed in consultation with our staff and stakeholders. Our values underpin how we will achieve our purpose and aims, and supplement the civil service values of integrity, honesty, objectivity and impartiality set out by Cabinet Office in the Civil Service Code.

We deliver for the public
We are professional and innovative
We work openly and collaboratively
We treat everyone with respect
 
Usual corporate bolloxspeak there, Steve.

It could probably be legitimately challenged at almost every point. But here's a couple for starters:

"to improve the United Kingdom's security through stronger border protection whilst welcoming legitimate travellers"

So exactly how does having armed men jump aboard a boat uninvited, after a stealthy approach, constitute "welcoming"?

"Improve customers' experience of HMRC"

Are we customers of HMRC, or victims?
 
Twister_Ken said:
Are we customers of HMRC, or victims?
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Customers hand over money in exchange for goods or services.
We only fulfil one part of that definition.

parasite 1. an animal or plant that lines in or on another from which it obtains nourishment. The host does not benefit from the association and is often harmed by it. 2. a person who habitually lives at the expense of others.
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I'd say that "host" was a more appropriate word than "customer".
 
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Major Catastrophe said:
The original post in this thread was about the UKBA NOT being armed.
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No, the OP stated that the civil service (ha!) stated that the people operating the cutters are not armed, which given civil service speak, leaves unanswered the question of whether the boarding parties are armed. And in a separate thread, we had an ex-boarder saying he was armed.

Even if not fire-armed, batons, pepper spray, tasers?
 
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trapezeartist said:
Nope. That's not it:
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boat.jpg


UKBA deny overmanning inefficencies :D
 
Ahh, the new Condor Ferries economy passage. None of them seem to be armed David, but I can see what a serious threat to our democracy they are - as some of them are not white.

Nick, Nick, quick, Mr Griffin, these people need shooting. :mad:
 
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