Anchor rode length?

[Dockhead]

You don't say... Learned this for ages. Compulsory
Actually I may say why the "a" - On russian square rigger up there in rigging you can hear that a lot
Polish grammar is about the same style, though, so not much problem for me with russian.
But then on Iceland we met an owner of a big trawler - so I was told the story of his first mate, from Poland, who had one answer for every instance something needed taking care of; so those are the only words he knows in Polish: nie ma problema - also grammatically wrong

But there is another story to this... http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/24999379.jpg

Well, that would be just about correct in Russian -- "eto ne moya problema" ("znachit, tvoya problema")

 

[Rossynant]

Etot probliem yest' - niekovo probliema niet (on yest - evo niet)
(in Polish: problem - problemu. )

 

[Murv]

As I read it, the OP has a 24ft motor boat with outdrive. That will definitely limit the weight of chain you can carry; I would go for chain + nylon.

Page 24 here has info

http://bradneychain.anu.net/Mooring-and-Anchoring-Leaflet/Mooring-and-Anchoring-Leaflet.pdf

And Chris Wiggins at Bradney Chain http://www.bradneychain.com/ is a good guy to talk to.

No connection etc.

Fascinating reading! thanks for the links

 

[Dockhead]

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instanc...x/24999379.jpg

Ha, ha. This is misquoted. What he actually said was:

Net cheloveka -- net problemy.

So, it's one problem, in the genitive case. If it were many problems -- then net cheloveka, net problem.

"Chelovek" has an "a" in the genitive case because it's masculine. "Problema" is feminine.

Sorry to everyone else for this boring digression

 

[Rossynant]

Именительный - проблем
Родительный - проблемa
Дательный - проблемy
Винительный - проблем
Творительный - проблемoм
Предложный - o проблемe

Probliema is not feminine. It's second case for masculine. Same way my name goes
May be for English speaker words have no sex - so a confusion - but most other languages it's different.
Here there are two ways: as in english "no problem" you may say 'niet problem'; for 'there is no problem' - zdies niet problema.

 

[stevepick]

>
Since it's the weight of the catenary with the anchor as back up that anchors the boat how can it be false, or do think it's something else?

Kellyseye, can I suggest you do some simple physics before promulgating wrong information? The OP is looking for correct information.

First go to wikipedia, and look at catenary curves. Note one important thing, WHEN THERE IS ANY TENSION ON AN ANCHOR CHAIN AND A CATENARY IS FORMED , ONLY A TINY (IF ANY) PORTION OF THE CHAIN RESTS ON THE SEABED. Sorry to shout, but I am fed up with this nonsense spouted on this forum by people who say/think it is "weight of chain " that somehow holds a boat .If you believe this, how many times have you disconnected your anchor and merely laid a length of chain to anchor somewhere? Really, you have never tried it?
Its easy to pull even 50m of chain along the hardstanding near my boat, its friction is fairly low (compared to the windage force supplied by the boat it anchors). The only thing the weight of chain does is keep the angle of pull to the anchor low in light winds, and during digging it in. As Vyv says above , in high winds an anchor chain will be to all intents and purposes straight. In high winds shock loads, due to shearing and squalls will risk pulling the anchor out and in these circumstances you need a good length of elastic snubber.
To the OP, read Poiraud, & Fraysse, what they say is technically and factually correct , backed up by basic mechanics.

 

[Jamesuk]

Our rode (learned a new word today ) is all chain.
Reading up, it appears that this is unsuitable and I should change it to 12mm nylon rope with just a short length of chain.

How long should the total length be? I've read it should be 4-7x the length of your anchorage depth, but for example, that would mean around 3000' of rope to anchor in the deepest part of the English channel. I assume you'd just motor somewhere shallower if you had to anchor?
What's a good "rule of thumb" length of rode for a newby boater in the south East planning on tidal river and inshore coastal work?

All chain, the heavier the better. Bank on being in 10 metres x10 for chain BUT to save cash short term allow at least 3x the boat length for chain if you want a formula.

 

[RupertW]

Kellyseye, can I suggest you do some simple physics before promulgating wrong information? The OP is looking for correct information.

First go to wikipedia, and look at catenary curves. Note one important thing, WHEN THERE IS ANY TENSION ON AN ANCHOR CHAIN AND A CATENARY IS FORMED , ONLY A TINY (IF ANY) PORTION OF THE CHAIN RESTS ON THE SEABED. Sorry to shout, but I am fed up with this nonsense spouted on this forum by people who say/think it is "weight of chain " that somehow holds a boat .If you believe this, how many times have you disconnected your anchor and merely laid a length of chain to anchor somewhere? Really, you have never tried it?
Its easy to pull even 50m of chain along the hardstanding near my boat, its friction is fairly low (compared to the windage force supplied by the boat it anchors). The only thing the weight of chain does is keep the angle of pull to the anchor low in light winds, and during digging it in. As Vyv says above , in high winds an anchor chain will be to all intents and purposes straight. In high winds shock loads, due to shearing and squalls will risk pulling the anchor out and in these circumstances you need a good length of elastic snubber.
To the OP, read Poiraud, & Fraysse, what they say is technically and factually correct , backed up by basic mechanics.

+1

I can only think that some posters have never anchored in clear water in anything above a force 3, as the sight of chain rising an inch or two above above the ground right by the abchor is so visible, with a lovely long curve which starts to straighten as the wind or current increases.

Please could somebody who believes this theory drop a chain only and watch the world go slowly past them.

 

[vyv_cox]

Was it in a wheelbarrow? If it was stretched out in a line, you're a stronger man than me.

Yet another assumption stated by someone who has never tried it. I might be stronger than you, which must put you very well down the scale, as I am by no means physically endowed. I had my 60 metres of 8 mm chain regalvanised and took it back to Koiladha, Greece. There I laid it out ahead of the boat ready to feed it into the windlass. During the course of this I hauled it forward and back several times, pulling the whole length.

I delivered the chain to BE Wedge in a soft plastic container used by builders, one with two handles. The foreman at the plant lifted it out of the car and carried it across the loading bay. One of the handles snapped off and he continued with one hand. That was strong!

 

[NormanS]

Yet another assumption stated by someone who has never tried it. I might be stronger than you, which must put you very well down the scale, as I am by no means physically endowed. I had my 60 metres of 8 mm chain regalvanised and took it back to Koiladha, Greece. There I laid it out ahead of the boat ready to feed it into the windlass. During the course of this I hauled it forward and back several times, pulling the whole length.

!

If you actually read the text of my post, you will see that I am not making any assumptions.

I reckon that your chain weighs in the region of 81 kg, and I would love to see you pulling the whole length.

 

[vyv_cox]

I reckon that your chain weighs in the region of 81 kg, and I would love to see you pulling the whole length.

I can push my car, which weighs about a ton and a half. I didn't say I could carry my chain, just pull it. Try it - it might surprise you.

 

[prv]

I delivered the chain to BE Wedge in a soft plastic container used by builders, one with two handles. The foreman at the plant lifted it out of the car and carried it across the loading bay. One of the handles snapped off and he continued with one hand. That was strong!

Yep!

I've carried my 40 metres of 8mm around in the same kind of container. I can lift it out of the car and carry it through the house and down the garden. But I wouldn't like to try the same with 50% more of it

Pete

 

[NormanS]

I can push my car, which weighs about a ton and a half. I didn't say I could carry my chain, just pull it. Try it - it might surprise you.

Sorry, I hadn't realised that your chain was fitted with wheels, like a car

I suppose your amazing ability to pull your chain, in one length, depends on the surface, and therefor the friction. I'm sure it would be a relatively easy pull on a flat shiny surface, like, for instance, a supermarket floor. Not many seabed conditions are like that.
Please note, I am not of the opinion that chain, on its own, will anchor a boat, except in very calm conditions.
I do know that there is no way that I can manually pull my 64m x 10mm chain along the gravel of the yard where my boat is.
One of my previous boats had 100m of 16mm, which was twice pulled up a beach to be loaded into a trailer, for re-galvanising. Now there would be a challenge for you