Storyline
Well-Known Member
Yes but with the proviso that they are not the best when it comes to fine mud (apologies if you have already read this).
Edit: that should be soft mud
Anchor Question
- Thread starter simonjames
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Yes but with the proviso that they are not the best when it comes to fine mud (apologies if you have already read this).
Edit: that should be soft mud
Vid
Well-Known Member
That's interesting: please explain, or point me in the direction of the relevant information.
I've just bought a Rocna and have recently been anchoring in the soft, fine mud of the Medway (Stangate Creek) where the Rocna set rapidly and held very securely, admittedly in not testing conditions but for over 12 hours so with changes of tide.
What are the weaknesses that I need to be aware of?
Storyline
Well-Known Member
That is just my experience in one particular anchorage where we have been going for years. Firstly with a cqr and in the last 5 years of so with the Rocna. It is easy to get both anchors to set initially but the cqr would hold even against full revs astern but the Rocna will often pull out. It is possible to get the Rocna to set really well but it takes quite a bit of time and our technique is to pull it in using slowly increasing short bursts of astern. Eventually it will get fully on but in the process can quite often pull out. Have tried every way I can think of and this system works best for us.
So, in summary, the Rocna initially sets easily in mud but can be pulled out with 46hp in reverse if you do not set it properly. This anchorage (Puilladobhrain) is heavily used so regularly churned up and the bottom is fine mud. I think but am not certain it is mud derived from slate as there are slate quarries nearby on Seil at Easdale.
Until recently I thought I was alone in this thought (because in sand the Rocna is incredible) but recently Fortress did an anchor test which I think came to a similar conclusion. There is a link to this somewhere on these forums, I seem to remember Vyv Cox posted a link but cannot be sure.
This is the only real weakness we have found with the Rocna and as I said, in sand it really grabs fast and if you reverse too fast you can stop with the fabled jerk !
stevepick
...
That's weird. I only have experience of using rocnas on my current & previous boats ( the cqr copy that was on the first boat when it was purchased became an instant garden ornament). We never had any problem getting the rocna to set in Puilladobhrain, or in L.Spelve (fine, peaty mud near the mussel farm) or in L.Aline near the head of the loch where it is again a fine , peaty mud. My experience was with a 15kg "original" NZ rocna and more recently with a 25Kg Canada metals "chinese" rocna. Standard procedure for me was 3 to 4 times depth as scope with a gentle reverse up to full revs for a few mins. Never had the anchor pop out, and have sat out 40-50 knot nights in L.Aline & Puilladobhrain with never a squeak from the anchor. Have to admit in Puilladobhrain, if it is busy , and short scope anchoring looms , I park outside . We are only talking 30 or 40 anchor nights over the last 8 or so years, but I wonder why Storyline's experience is so different ( no criticism intended). Also never had a problem in weed with the rocna, including multiple nights in Canna.
We were in L.Moidart in june and anchored in the pool behind the castle, there was a fair amount of scope out because we were in 10 or so metres, but anchored first time and held without human interference through 3 180 degree swings as we were tide rode, its pretty "muddy" there too.
We were in L.Moidart in june and anchored in the pool behind the castle, there was a fair amount of scope out because we were in 10 or so metres, but anchored first time and held without human interference through 3 180 degree swings as we were tide rode, its pretty "muddy" there too.
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charles_reed
Well-Known Member
My sympathy is with the OP.
My experience is that the Delta, though an excellent anchor, does not reset well and like all plough anchors is not good in soft mud (like Alvor). In sand or in soft mud the Danforth digs in well as does the Fortress & Brittany - but neither apparently reset well.
I use my Delta as an aft mooring kedge for town quays, where it's unlikely to be asked to re-set.
The CQR is great in shingle, excellent in stiff mud and despite the denigratory remarks of those besotted with "new age" anchors will reset quite adequately - it does need severe digging in - but @ 60% of the weight of "new-age" recommendations, saves my back and the balance of the boat.
I'd look closely @ the Bugel - it's not quite the ridiculous prices of Spade and Rocna - or the Manson. All these four set quickly, reset well and are good in soft sand and mud where the CQR does lack grip.
My experience is that the Delta, though an excellent anchor, does not reset well and like all plough anchors is not good in soft mud (like Alvor). In sand or in soft mud the Danforth digs in well as does the Fortress & Brittany - but neither apparently reset well.
I use my Delta as an aft mooring kedge for town quays, where it's unlikely to be asked to re-set.
The CQR is great in shingle, excellent in stiff mud and despite the denigratory remarks of those besotted with "new age" anchors will reset quite adequately - it does need severe digging in - but @ 60% of the weight of "new-age" recommendations, saves my back and the balance of the boat.
I'd look closely @ the Bugel - it's not quite the ridiculous prices of Spade and Rocna - or the Manson. All these four set quickly, reset well and are good in soft sand and mud where the CQR does lack grip.
Storyline
Well-Known Member
Hi Steve
Our experiences are indeed different because we regularly have problems with the Rocna (NZ
) in Canna ! This is not the fault of the anchor but the dammed weed. Occasionally we will get on first time but normally we get a ball of weed a few times first. Having said that, once on, the holding is good and a few years ago (cqr days) we sat out a sw 9 in there. As there is limited fetch the sea was flattish but as it is so low lying the wind was screaming through the anchorage - have some old hi-8 video of it and it is spectacular. Usually lie to a short scope in Puilladobhrain but dig in on 40m or so and then pull in chain and lie at 5:1 ish.
Cannot comment on Spelve or L. Aline as it is years since we have been in either. Edit: (& apols to continue o/t), have you tried the good alternative to Spelve just across the Firth in the Black Isles (near Fladda), although very small the holding is fantastic on sand ? Nowadays we love sand !
I suspect that we can still trust the Rocna in soft mud because even if full revs might pull it out just after laying it, a steadily building wind would slowly dig it in deeper & deeper. A couple of times we have been content to settle for 2k revs when anchoring which is enough to come up on the chain but the snubber is not quite at full stretch and then a full gale has developed which I assume then has buried the anchor nicely.
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ribrage
Well-Known Member
That one isn't mine but I have a similar one. You can see it, with a fishing float on the end, in this pic.
This year I have been taking many underwater pics of anchors in Greek waters and most liveaboard ones have floating lines attached. All Sunsail ones used to have the same, don't know now. The one in #20 was fairly long with a small float on the end on the surface, as a marker and could be used for recovery in the event of fouling something. Mine, and most others, is about a metre long and is there so that the anchor can be located in weed or in cloudy water. It has proved useful on several occasions.
We probably read the same piece on the web about marking anchor location on the sea bed to aid visual inspection of its position using a snorkel or dive gear and more importantly the set of the anchor, in dense weed it's often difficult to spot an anchor or even follow the chain to its location.
I picked up a foam stick from the beach shop and chopped it up into sections , used a splicing needle to push some floating rope through it, about a meter in length, i found yellow to be the most visual and easiest to spot, if you pull loop through loop like climbers do with ropes there is no chance of it snagging on deployment and readily floats free on impact with the water to its maximum length (1 meter)
It's not a tripping line or suitable really for recovery as the breaking strain of the floating rope I'm using is way less than the load on a snagged anchor, it's purely an aid to locate it on the sea bed for snorkelling or diving
Slowtack
Well-Known Member
I use a 15kg Manson, but havent shackled to the long slot yet but will consider doing so as it digs in well and I had some more than usual trouble breaking it out one day last week. I generally use a buoyed tripping line which eases the recovery process, as it did on that occasion. As to bringing a tripping line on board, the only time a dragging yacht bumped into mine was due to the too-short tripping line doing its job!