oldbilbo
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So, Vyv Cox, tell us about the length of floaty line visible in your #20 above.....
Anchor Question
- Thread starter simonjames
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vyv_cox
Well-Known Member
That one isn't mine but I have a similar one. You can see it, with a fishing float on the end, in this pic.
This year I have been taking many underwater pics of anchors in Greek waters and most liveaboard ones have floating lines attached. All Sunsail ones used to have the same, don't know now. The one in #20 was fairly long with a small float on the end on the surface, as a marker and could be used for recovery in the event of fouling something. Mine, and most others, is about a metre long and is there so that the anchor can be located in weed or in cloudy water. It has proved useful on several occasions.
tudorsailor
Well-Known Member
Can you expand on why it was useful to have the 1m line and orange float on the anchor. Was it stuck so that you needed to pull it out with a hook around the roll-bar?
I certainly do not like the idea of a line and float that is on the surface. Surely someone will drive their boat over it and get the line in their prop.
When it is warm I snorkle over the anchor but on most occasions the water is too cloudy for me to see the anchor. I doubt I would see you orange float. I am currently based in Croatia where the water is clear but depth of anchoring quite deep. Plus the slanting sun at the end of the day makes anchor viewing difficult
So I have invested in a magnetic trip line magnetic trip line, but have yet to use it in anger. Of course it does require forethought!!
TudorSailor
I certainly do not like the idea of a line and float that is on the surface. Surely someone will drive their boat over it and get the line in their prop.
When it is warm I snorkle over the anchor but on most occasions the water is too cloudy for me to see the anchor. I doubt I would see you orange float. I am currently based in Croatia where the water is clear but depth of anchoring quite deep. Plus the slanting sun at the end of the day makes anchor viewing difficult
So I have invested in a magnetic trip line magnetic trip line, but have yet to use it in anger. Of course it does require forethought!!
TudorSailor
LadyInBed
Well-Known Member
I dont recomend a fishing float, it knocks on the side of the hull at turn of tide and wakes you up!
I use a small sausage fender with a pollyprop pickup loop spliced into the 'other' end. It's marked with an anchor, skull and X bones.
noelex
Well-Known Member
Vyv's float, like mine is a metre of the bottom so if it hits the hull He probably wants to be woken up
If you use a surface float (which is different) beware that if the float is knocking on the side of the hull there is a real risk it will get caught, especially between the top of the rudder and the hull. If this happens the anchor is effectively at a 1:1 scope held by the crown and it will drag at very low wind speeds (like 10 knots).
Don't ask how I know this.
Sybarite
Well-Known Member
Why not simply tie the line to the chain?
john_morris_uk
Well-Known Member
Because he wants the option of using it as a 'trip line' if the anchor snags on something? Unless you mean why doesn't he tie the trip line in a big loop to the anchor chain? My experience of this is that the line gets tangled with the chain just when you want to use it as a trip line...
vyv_cox
Well-Known Member
I originally fitted the short line after my original connector broke when the anchor was in deep weed. I could not locate it and ultimately needed a diver to do so. Since then the float is easier to see than the anchor in weed and in some other bottoms. It has proved useful when the anchor was wedged in rocks and I needed to dive on it to free it. My anchor has only been painted white this year, which makes it very easy to spot, but in its original rather rusty galvanising finish it was far more difficult.
I do have a long line with an anchor buoy, enough to reach the surface, but it does have disadvantages. Turning tide is not one of them of course in the eastern Med but reversing wind direction often happens. The line and buoy shown on the Manson anchor was on a USA flagged liveaboard. The buoy is a simple polystyrene one and was useful for the owners in showing just where their anchor was, plus of course for freeing if/when fouled. It probably makes no noise if tapping on the hull and it is beneficial in preventing other boats from anchoring immediately ahead.
sailaboutvic
Well-Known Member
Why not just sink a line , it won't get trapped on passing boats , no one will steel the fender or buoy , and if you have to use it to trip the anchor , it ready on the bow . If you are worred about the it getting twisted around the chain , it not a problem to untangle it as you lift the anchor .
Oh and by the way , it best to attach a tripping line to the front of the anchor if you are planning to use it to trip the anchor and not the bar on top
BluewatersailorCroatia.webs.com
Oh and by the way , it best to attach a tripping line to the front of the anchor if you are planning to use it to trip the anchor and not the bar on top
BluewatersailorCroatia.webs.com
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vyv_cox
Well-Known Member
A tripping line is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist. In ten years in the Med I have only once needed to dive on the anchor to free it, which I accomplished with no problem whatsoever.
If you would like to look at the photo again you will see that the line is attached to the crown of the anchor but it runs through the hoop instead of in front of it. no importance at all.
sailaboutvic
Well-Known Member
I have to differ big time on this with you , each year we come across people with anchors around chains and rocks where a tripping line would had saved them quite a bit of money getting a diver out off course if you only ever anchor on sand and weed and I am not saying you do , in that case an tripping line isn't much use but it still would help to find you anchor if you lost it . I take it the reason you have a small line with a float is so you can see your anchor is and if it dug in , as I never bother to swim out to check my anchor I rather check it in by other means there wouldn't be any point in having a small line with a float but a line going back to the boat would not only help you find the lost anchor but if need be would also release it .
Ok so you might say that the Method you use would also help you trip it by going down and tiring a line to the small line , and off course your right but try doing that when the winds blowing hard the boat jumping about and your anchoring is stuck
Do I always use a tripping line ? No but if I feel I might need to I would , but I also carry diving gear on board .
www.bluewatersailorcroatia.webs.com
Ok so you might say that the Method you use would also help you trip it by going down and tiring a line to the small line , and off course your right but try doing that when the winds blowing hard the boat jumping about and your anchoring is stuck
Do I always use a tripping line ? No but if I feel I might need to I would , but I also carry diving gear on board .
www.bluewatersailorcroatia.webs.com
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vyv_cox
Well-Known Member
On the very rare occasions that we have fouled our anchor on rocks, bottom chains, etc I have almost always been able to free it by swimming down with a snorkel. On two occasions I have used my mooring buoy strop, a length of rope with two metres of chain in the middle, lowered down the anchor chain from the dinghy and then pulled forward. Compared with these simple and quick methods a tripping line used every time we anchor would be a total PITA, having to coil and uncoil it with anything up to 60 metres deployed, other boats dropping their chain on top of it and countless other problems. No thanks, you use your time consuming and often inefficient method and I'll use mine.
sailaboutvic
Well-Known Member
You do that VYV . Maybe some of us can't swim down 8 or 10 mts and still have the energy to. Release an anchor .
I am very surprise with you views on tripping lines , and the reason you out line for not using one when need be , as a rule your posting make a lot of sense , maybe you just having a off day .
Just to clear things up I wasn't making a comment re your little line and it float when I remarked that a tripping line need to be attracted to the front of the anchor , to be honest I having got a clue where the one in your photo is attached .
But as you said I will continue using my inefficient method , a method that worked for thousand of sailor thousands times over ., a method that's known to work ,.
Good luck with your photo and float .
www.bluewatersailorcroatia.webs.com
I am very surprise with you views on tripping lines , and the reason you out line for not using one when need be , as a rule your posting make a lot of sense , maybe you just having a off day .
Just to clear things up I wasn't making a comment re your little line and it float when I remarked that a tripping line need to be attracted to the front of the anchor , to be honest I having got a clue where the one in your photo is attached .
But as you said I will continue using my inefficient method , a method that worked for thousand of sailor thousands times over ., a method that's known to work ,.
Good luck with your photo and float .
www.bluewatersailorcroatia.webs.com
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Storyline
Well-Known Member
Don't say that
, we sometimes rely on our Rocna to reset itself should the wind back or veer significantly. I was under the impression that this was one of the main improvements over older generation anchors which could break out and then, as I said, skip across the surface. The Fortress in particular really needs to be set carefully and certainly I would not like to rely on it doing it when I was asleep ! In our experience, providing the Rocna likes the bottom (ie sand) it will set itself in a couple of anchor lengths if it did indeed break out rather than just turn as in Vyv's photo.
vyv_cox
Well-Known Member
You do that VYV . Maybe some of us can't swim down 8 or 10 mts and still have the energy to. Release an anchor .
I am very surprise with you views on tripping lines , and the reason you out line for not using one when need be , as a rule your posting make a lot of sense , maybe you just having a off day .
See post #27. Exactly my experience. They are not worth the trouble.
Storyline
Well-Known Member
Sometimes a tripping line can be useful, not for the purpose of tripping the anchor but just to show later arrivals where our anchor is. Sometimes strong winds are forecast from a completely different direction to the current airflow which can be sea/land breezes. After anchoring, the boat will lie to the current wind and so it is hard for a new arrival to know where our anchor is and swmbo views each new arrival as a potential threat !
The system we use is a great simple idea from an American site I read about many years ago. A small block is a attached to the bottom of the buoy with a very short length of line and then another line goes from the anchor through the block and a fishing weight (quite heavy, conical type for mud) is attached to the end. As long as the total length of line is no longer than double the depth, the weight will take up any slack and always keep the buoy directly over the anchor. Really no hassle to deploy (we keep it ready rigged) and it works a treat
Edit: of course also, the system will allow for any rise or fall of tide.
The system we use is a great simple idea from an American site I read about many years ago. A small block is a attached to the bottom of the buoy with a very short length of line and then another line goes from the anchor through the block and a fishing weight (quite heavy, conical type for mud) is attached to the end. As long as the total length of line is no longer than double the depth, the weight will take up any slack and always keep the buoy directly over the anchor. Really no hassle to deploy (we keep it ready rigged) and it works a treat
Edit: of course also, the system will allow for any rise or fall of tide.
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vyv_cox
Well-Known Member
I think you are describing an anchor buoy, not a tripping line. There is one exactly as yours in the letters page of the latest PBO. It is a tripping line that I have negative feelings about, a separate line running from the crown of the anchor back to the boat. Tedious to launch and recover, especially with a windlass, and in conditions where the boat moves around, e.g. light and variable winds, tideless anchorages, changes of tidal flow, etc., more nuisance than it is worth and a potential hazard.
sailaboutvic
Well-Known Member
Read it don't understand your point .
If you think your line and float will get you out of a problem when you need it too , that's fine , I can assure you when the winds blowing and the boat bouncing like a wild horse and the anchor is stuck on god know what and you need to move quickie , you will wish you had set a tripping line .
Your little trick is find if your in shallow waters no rush to retrieve the anchor which is in 2 or 3 mts of water , but it stop there .
It quite normal for us to anchor in 8 to 12 mts of water and at time a lot more and most of our anchoring is swinging free . maybe that why we don't get the cross anchor problem so many get and complain about on the forums . Sitting on a quay with the anchor holding me off waiting for the next guy to pull my anchor out or worse ram me , isn't my idea of fun .
As far as tripping lines getting tangle I would suggest there are not being deployed in the right manner , the worst I ever had it a twist or two about a metre or so from the bow roller , which is very easy to sort out , but I have seen all sort , but that's not the tripping line fault , it the way they have set it , just like so many people have no idea how to deploy and set an anchor and them Blane the anchor for their bad seamanship .
On that note I will say no more . Carry on what your doing . My posting wasn't in the begin a criticism on your posting , I was just given my opinion , your comment on my posting turn it into what it turn out to be .
Maybe you will be lucky and never get caught out .
www.bluewatersailorcroatia.webs.com
Storyline
Well-Known Member
Yes, my mistake, it is an anchor buoy. Having thought more about it, I first read about the idea here and then a few months later I was posting on a thread on an American cruising forum and mentioned it, loads of the posters there were very excited about it, some wildly so
. Fully agree with you, the idea of having another line from anchor to boat does not appeal, I can imagine that it would get twisted into the anchor rode and then make raising the anchor if you had to get out in a hurry into a nightmare. Anything other than one line going over the bow can twist. I remember years ago picking up our yacht club mooring in the Mersey, we got the strop on board ok but then had the bright idea of backing it up with a length of chain as the tide was sluicing. Morning broke and the only way to get off was to bring the vice onto the foredeck and hacksaw our chain off (sorry LMYC
).Nowadays the only time we have two of anything is the anchor snubber.
temptress
Well-Known Member
Interesting discussion. Last night we had 60knots in the anchorage here. BOATS dragging all over the place with one ending up on the coral. We have a 30kg Delta and held in the fine sand. I have yet to have a problem with the delta and we spend months at a time at anchor. That said I would consider having a Rocna. While others seem to have issues with various anchors I have yet to come across a Rocna owner that does not swear by them.