Anchor chain/locker

[Tranona]

I think you views are influenced by your experience of sailing the Med. In the Caribbean anchoring is the norm. Marinas are few and far between. We see on a regular basis the stick in the chain locker. There are plenty of Bav, Jen Ben based over in the Caribbean that spend the whole season at anchor. They just have to learn to use a stick. We also see appalling anchor practice but that is a whole new thread

Not at all. Plenty of anchoring in the Med. It is not about my view, but just commenting that what you see as a big issue is not the same for the people who buy modern production boats. If it was then designers would design their boats with better anchoring arrangements. As I said, once you learn how to do it with an open top locker it really is not a big issue. After all hundreds of boats with this type of anchor locker anchor in the Caribbean all year round - the boats are very popular there and the numbers will only increase so I guess the buyers are happy with their boats.

 

[geem]

Not at all. Plenty of anchoring in the Med. It is not about my view, but just commenting that what you see as a big issue is not the same for the people who buy modern production boats. If it was then designers would design their boats with better anchoring arrangements. As I said, once you learn how to do it with an open top locker it really is not a big issue. After all hundreds of boats with this type of anchor locker anchor in the Caribbean all year round - the boats are very popular there and the numbers will only increase so I guess the buyers are happy with their boats.

Haha, you should hear our Canadian friends with a Jen 45DS complain about the build quality of their boat. Windows falling out is the latest. Happy is not a word they would use. They have had the boat from new and have developed a very low opinion of Jeanneau

 

[Tranona]

Haha, you should hear our Canadian friends with a Jen 45DS complain about the build quality of their boat. Windows falling out is the latest. Happy is not a word they would use. They have had the boat from new and have developed a very low opinion of Jeanneau

So, what has this got to do with anchor lockers - or indeed the thousands of happy owners of Jeanneau boats. If they really were that awful then how come they are the largest volume producer of yachts in the world?

 

[Neeves]

Not at all. Plenty of anchoring in the Med. It is not about my view, but just commenting that what you see as a big issue is not the same for the people who buy modern production boats. If it was then designers would design their boats with better anchoring arrangements. As I said, once you learn how to do it with an open top locker it really is not a big issue. After all hundreds of boats with this type of anchor locker anchor in the Caribbean all year round - the boats are very popular there and the numbers will only increase so I guess the buyers are happy with their boats.

My take is slightly different.

The owners might be a husband and wife with the husband the individual with the desire for the yacht. The husband, or male partner, is more than happy when the female part of the 2 person team (not forgetting a couple of children) likes the domestic arrangements and then compromises on the attributes important to him. In fact the male part of the team will sacrifice anything and everything if his partner likes the galley, shower, dining arrangements. This manifests itself here, on YBW when members describe how they sail solo, or their wife prefers golf.

Acceptance of inadequate anchoring arrangements can be swiftly become one of the compromises.

Designers, yacht builders and the salesmen (and saleswomen) at boat shows recognise this and there is much attention to soft furnishing, monogrammed towels, flowers and champagne glasses strategically place in the accomodation. Equally interesting more time is spent examining the interior than the deck layout. if you think about it the soft furnishing, a bunch of flowers on the saloon table have nothing at all to do with the characteristics of the yacht - so why are they - without exception - on every yacht at a boat show?

Interiors sell yachts (not anchor and chain lockers)


We are not 'better' than the caricature I draw (is it a caricature or close to reality) - but we don't like marinas and anchor (which is why I have a fascination for the topic. We anchor in good or bad weather and we have altered our 'ground tackle' arrangement (with my wife's support as she deploys and retrieves). But I am sympathetic to my wife's interests and we carry crab pots, cray fish pots, 'ordinary' fishing rods and game rodes - and all the kit needed to cook the successes. We can have 2 hot showers a day - and the grandchildren (primarily female) love 'the boat' because its like being at home or in a hotel (with rather small rooms ).

So, what has this got to do with anchor lockers - or indeed the thousands of happy owners of Jeanneau boats. If they really were that awful then how come they are the largest volume producer of yachts in the world?

See the above.

It takes all sorts and as long as owners are happy (and accept the compromises in good grace) then they are helping support the 'industry' on which we all rely.

Take care, stay safe

Jonathan

 

[Neeves]

I have also read of people using cones, traffic cones or those cones they seem to use for football practice. I have tried it and think it a waste of time (and they take up fair amount of space). In order to work the apex of the cone needs to sit under the hawse pipe, fairly accurately, and this demands a flat locker base. The cone needs to be firmly attached - throwing a few tens of kilos at a plastic cone will move the cone.

It is what it is - and a stick seems to be the best remedy, hopefully your tower of chain is accessible from the deck and adjacent to the windlass. Having to dodge down to the forepeak and prod around with a stick is really not very efficient (when you are in a hurry).

In Coopec's case he might be able to alter the feed tube to better effect. Drain holes or drainage of the locker in which the chain is housed needs careful attention as leaving a small puddle in the bottom of the locker means that the chain will inevitably be always damp and some of the chain will be in the water. It merits thought that lifting the locker base by inserting a grate is advantageous - as it keeps the chain out of the puddle and better allows the chain to air.

This a new yacht at a boat show. I don't know why the locker is not draining, the drain hole might be blocked or the locker is poorly designed. The water looks as if it has been there for some time. But really an awful example of many things - but would you buy a yacht from this distributor - the lack of attention to detail is appalling and the wiring looks very average. Having water in chain lockers is not unusual - no wonder chains corrode.

View attachment 133171

Jonathan

I raised the question an earlier post, above

Who would buy a yacht from this company (who are acting for one of the triumvirate of Ben, Jen, Bav)

At the same boat show (I really need to stop flaunting my fetish) I came across this anchor locker




Anchor lockers are simply not important to the buying public, the males are happy their wife likes the galley - and shuts his eyes to what he has seen.

I don't recall but I bet the accomodation on both yachts was superb - matching sheets, pillow cases, towels, wine in the fridge, decent wine glasses, china plates. etc. The anchor locker is not important (who is going to look?)

Jonathan

 

[Tranona]

Acceptance of inadequate anchoring arrangements can be swiftly become one of the compromises.

Designers, yacht builders and the salesmen (and saleswomen) at boat shows recognise this and there is much attention to soft furnishing, monogrammed towels, flowers and champagne glasses strategically place in the accomodation. Equally interesting more time is spent examining the interior than the deck layout. if you think about it the soft furnishing, a bunch of flowers on the saloon table have nothing at all to do with the characteristics of the yacht - so why are they - without exception - on every yacht at a boat show?

I think that sums it up well. I have spent too much time over the years on boats at boat shows observing buyers and potential buyers. Only a tiny proportion of boaters actually buy a new boat and you are right most of the viewing concentrates on the interior - not too different from buying a car. Nobody looks at the engine of a car, or where the towing hooks are located, or whether the EGR valve can be accessed easily - these things are givens at this stage. Probably one of the decision makers has read up all the technical details of the boat, the reviews etc to see if the style and performance meets their expectations. Many (in the UK) will have experiences of owning older boats and as far as anchoring is concerned the arrangement on my Bav 33 was far superior to anything on a UK production cruiser of the 1970/80s! - even if it falls short of the "ideal". You can go round any boat and find things that you don't like, or could bee improved - that is just life. Of course if you style of sailing includes regular anchoring in challenging situations you may well give more attention to the design of the locker etc, and it may well influence your choice of boats. But for the vast majority modern production boats are fine.

 

[geem]

So, what has this got to do with anchor lockers - or indeed the thousands of happy owners of Jeanneau boats. If they really were that awful then how come they are the largest volume producer of yachts in the world?

You said that you guessed the buyer of modern boats were happy with their choices. Just letting you know that the boat who happens to be anchored next to us is a Jen 45DS they have had from new and they describe it as poorly built. They are not happy with Jeanneau.

 

[Tranona]

You said that you guessed the buyer of modern boats were happy with their choices. Just letting you know that the boat who happens to be anchored next to us is a Jen 45DS they have had from new and they describe it as poorly built. They are not happy with Jeanneau.

not so sure why you think I should know about these people. You seem to be a magnet for unhappy people! Of course you can find people who are unhappy with their purchases but inevitably they are in a small minority. Why do you think their opinion overrides all the thousands of others who are happy - the silent majority.

I hope you meet some happy people some day, must be miserable having to listen to all the moaning.

 

[Minerva]

Oi Traona! Geem! pack it in you pair.

This thread has (amazingly) so far been an amicable anchoring thread. Lets not derail a good thing with pointless yet predictable bickering over modern production boats.

 

[Tranona]

See post 43. Tried hard to keep on topic.

 

[geem]

See post 43. Tried hard to keep on topic.

Try harder?

 

[coopec]

One thing I've learned from this thread is to follow the designers plans meticulously.

I decided the designer was wrong putting a hatch on the deck so I extended the trunk cabin for'd a bit and put the hatch on the trunk cabin.

Duh! Now I realise he wanted a hatch directly above the chain locker

 

[Neeves]

The odd things are:

To us part of the pleasure of owning a yacht is that you can move your location to somewhere else, equally attractive. You can enjoy company (with like minded people (or not). But to do this and have the support of your 'family' the anchoring experience needs to be painless and, importantly, should be suitable for all occasions and be reliable (ie - be safe and easy to use).

So why are yachts commissioned with a Delta anchor, invariably, and not a Rocna, Spade, Excel, Supreme etc that are consistently quoted as being reliable and predictable. You only need one bad anchoring experience, for any reason, and it will be an uphill battle to anchor again, the use of the yacht will be curtailed and buying a replacement but bigger yacht - an unrealised dream.

I know you can buy a new anchor, of your choice, but when you buy a Stg50,000 yacht the cost of a Rocna, a Spade or even an Ultra is loose change. Equally having an anchor/chain locker that is sensibly designed will enhance the whole experience. After all the boat builder wants you to upsize from the stg50,000 starter yacht ( ) - repeat business is more likely with a host of pleasant memories seared into the buyers (and his partner's) brain cells.

Anchor choice and locker design does not demand much rocket science, as Coopec describes in the previous post - and designers/builders must know by now what makes a good locker. Designers make the yacht saloon interior a delight, putting many new inner city apparent to shame - is it really so difficult to design an anchor locker and choose an anchor (that does not need to be changed)?

I find it all an unforgivable mystery.

But focussing on the OPs issues:

I considered this locker had some thought invested in it. Its not perfect - but better than many (and I thought the snubber parsimonious in the extreme).



The windlass is below deck (and hopefully has a matching moulding to fill the hole where the capstan protrudes). It appears to be deep enough and the fall of the chain seems sensible - but I particularly liked the moulding to house a spare, Danforth type, anchor. I'm not so sure the windlass is easy to service (I was to besotted with the Danforth housing to notice!) and I did not check the drain holes. But deck wash down, foot switches all in one location and not located where they can be inadvertently stood on.

And no - its not a Ben/Jenny/Bav)

Jonathan