Advice sought for Atlantic / Caribbean cruise

. When you say arrive and turn left that means you are ignoring the advise to arrive in Barbados and sail over to Tobeago. Sailing from the Windwards to Barbados is done all the time but it is upwind and upcurrent and pretty hard work unless you have a boat that is a witch to windward.

Anyway Tobeago for sure now I know you like the water.

There have been comments that the French Islands are expensive. That is not neccessarily the case relative to the other islands. EVERY WHERE is expensive out here. Both the major rench Islands have good ECONO supermarkets. The one in Cul Du Sac Du Marin in Martinique is particularly good value and has its own dinghy dock. I stock up there and so do other frugal cruisers. They are cheaper than the other islands on most items.

Montserrat is worth a visit and take the volcano tour with Mr Philips accept no substitutes.

The Heineken Regatta in St Maarten is now bigger than Antigua Race week but the Classic week is special.

St Barts is really expensive but if you do go there make a point of visiting the hill above the airport and take your camera.

If you go to St Maarten visit Anguilla possibly by ferry and find out about the rebellion of 1968/9.

If you get to the BVI you must visit Saba Rock and see the leagacy of Bert Kilbride who began diving in 1948 and came to the British Virgin Islands in the late 1950's. Over his lifetime, he helped discover over 90+ shipwrecks. In 1967, he was named "Receiver of Wrecks" by Queen Elizabeth. This title allowed him to document and determine authenticity, if possible, of all BVI wrecks for HM government and ensure they were not desecrated. Then go to Barbuda and visit some of the wrecks he found. Many can be seen free diving.

Then go to the BVI icon of Foxys on Friday at Jost van Dyke. Take an old t shirt and marker pen, you will see why.

The Turks and Caicos used to have some of te best spearfishing in the Caribbean but I have been told that locals from the DR have fished out the southern reefs.

Now for the good news bad news bit.

OK first the good news.

It is still possible to cruise the Caribbean and not stay in marinas or pay for moorings. I have sailed from the USVI down to Grenada this year without a single night in a marina and only one night on a mooring which could have been avoided but it came with free water so it was a bargain as I have big tanks. See for details http://sailingonelephantschild.blogspot.com/

The bad news.

Most islands now ban spear fishing by visitors. Spearguns often have to be declared and may be held by customs until you check out. I think only Martiique and Guadaloupe in the Windwards and Leewards allow it. Also there are much fewer worthwhile fish around compared with 20 years ago when I fed the cats and myself occasionally with a speargun. A lot of the locals now go spearfishing/lobstering/conch collecting

Gunkholing around the Cul du Sac Du Marin in Guadaloupe will give you some chances though and it is a great area to explore with fair to good water quality depending on the swell direction.

But if you shoot with a camera as I do nowadays then there is good news as there are an increasing number of marine sanctuaries where fishing of all sorts is banned. The larger fish are not gun shy and in places where the local dive operations feed the fish they can be positively pushy.
 
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Thanks TQA
Be assured that we are ignoring no advice.
we need to sit down in front of a chart to understand the geography before all this advice makes sense.
Love the pic, looks like a big grouper or jew fish?
reckon I will get a good waterproof camera/camcorder for when I can't spearfish and stick to catching big fish on a line or else head out into blue water to spear big stuff.
I am pretty sure we will eat well either way.

We have been blown away by the response to my post and are humbled that people are spending so much time giving such detailed replies.
I owe you all a drink if I meet you on the road.....or sea.......you know what I mean.

In just over a month "Borne" will be sitting in our back garden many miles from the sea so that I can spend every spare moment working on her.
Next question to the panel of experts will be how to support her without a cradle....but I will leave that post for another day.

Thanks
 
>Why O Why does everybody make so much of going across the pond to the Caribbean.

What utter nonsense. It can be an easy trip and it can also be a nightmare. A few years ago the wind was never less than twenty five knots and usually over thirty. The crews arrived exhausted with torn sails, broken rigging, broken autopilots, broken booms, broken goosenecks. If anybody thinks it's a milk run they haven't done it in a bad year. It happens about every fourish years.
 
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Hi Kellyseye.......thanks for sharing that with us. We had been told it would be a picnic.
We have decided that its probably safer for us to stay at work in London.

That was a close one.......nearly did something really dangerous there!!!

anyone want to buy a boat....nearly ready to do an Atlantic circuit?
 
KellysEye said:
>Why O Why does everybody make so much of going across the pond to the Caribbean.

What utter nonsense. It can be an easy trip and it can also be a nightmare. A few years ago the wind was never less than twenty five knots and usually over thirty. The crews arrived exhausted with torn sails, broken rigging, broken autopilots, broken booms, broken goosenecks. If anybody thinks it's a milk run they haven't done it in a bad year. It happens about every fourish years.
Click to expand...

We had the opposite very light winds for the first 19 days and were often becalmed. lots of 2 to 3 knot days where we were happy to see 60 miles run and that was with a big assy spi.

A number of days we downed sail at 4 pm and went for a swim. The skipper holding on to a rope very firmly.

30 days in total, and did not break anything which was our goal unless you count the spi. halyard chafing through. The last few days we had the trade winds set in and in fact they were reinforced trades or the Christmas winds as the locals call them. 20 to 30 knots.

Nowadays there does seem to be a tendancy to drive the boat harder, we reefed down for the night and only flew the spi at night in light conditions with a good moon. Standing orders were that it came down at 5 knots plus.

Perhaps I was a wimp but we got there without breaking stuff.
 
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Mel and Nick, I hope that you will stop off in Barbados to say Hi to us on your trip across the pond - many folk arrive here saying 'oh we will only stay a few days, just need some fresh food', and a few weeks / months (years even....) later they are still here......

Just a few random thoughts now that havent really come up so far......

Although sunshine in northern latitudes is jumped upon whenever it makes a (rare) appearance, down this way you will find that you want to stay out of it as much as you can, otherwise you just get barbequed.
You should try, by whatever means possible, to have some form of bimini awning over your cockpit - and if you can arrange it so it can be left up when sailing, then even better. You will find that so long as the rain is not chucking down while at anchor, your cockpit becomes your saloon, as it is often too hot and stuffy down below, even in our 'wintertime'.

If you have room for a second tender, even if it is just a wee 6' roundtail inflatable, then go for it. And if your main tender is easily rowable, then even better, as then there is less dependence on the outboard engine.

Re places to go and see - if I was in your wellies (or bare feet rather - too hot for wellies here!) I would be seriously thinking about spending the summer going up the Eastern Seaboard of the USA, rather than sweltering in the lower Caribbean.
It is very hot and humid down here in the summer, and the tradewinds have absconded, hence anything is possible.

Even if you arrived out here in (say) early January, you could have a few months sailing in the Windward and Leeward islands, and then wander up through the Bahamas to the USA around May (after first taking in Antigua Classics and Race Week in mid / end April).
Potter northwards as summer advances, enjoy the Chesapeake, and aim on getting up to New England, especially Maine and spending some time there before absconding south again in the Fall (autumn).
I have sailed up that way a few times from the Windies, and thought it was wonderful.

Re sailing south again, you could typically leave from Newport, Rhode Island bound for Bermuda - it is only just over 600 miles rhumb line, and light years different when you arrive there, partially as a result of the effect of the Gulf Stream, which you have to cross.
But Herb gives excellent weather routing advice for crossing the Stream on his daily radio net (more about Herb at http://www3.sympatico.ca/hehilgen/vax498.htm )
So, maybe 5 days to get to Bermuda, and then perhaps 9 days from Bermuda down to the Leeward Islands (we took 11 days in an S & S 34 going the other way fifteen years ago, but we had very light winds then).

I know that the Western Caribbean has been mentioned above, and I know (from reports received) that it is very nice, however it is also a very loooong way to beat to windward to get back east again afterwards on your way home. Even if you go north from (say) Central America around the western end of Cuba and then through the Bahamas.

If you are keen on racing (on other people's boats), and partying, well, there is an almost non-stop continuous regatta scene in the Windies in winter time.
I think the La Source regatta is on in Grenada around January, and then there is the Heinekin Regatta in St Maarten in March, and the Bequia Easter regatta, followed soon after by Antigua Classics and (usually a week later) Sailing Week.
If you are still down south in May, Tobago has its Angostura Regatta then, followed soon after by the Mount Gay Regatta in Barbados.
And then there is the Carriacou Regatta in August.
(Have I missed out any?)

I hope that all goes well with Borne's re-fit, and we shall look forward to seeing you out here in the not-too-distant-future.

PS - Have a look also at the other islands mentioned in the link in my signature below.
And I will endorse the opinion aired earlier about getting some copies of any of the Cruising Guides to the islands - Chris Doyle's and Don Street's Guides are good, but there are others as well.
 
Thanks for that Bajansailor and TQA.
I spent £140 with Amazon yesterday so I am looking forward to having plenty of reading time during my daily commute to plough through all the guides etc and make some sense of the advice we have been given.

We are very much cruisers rather than racers. I prefer to touch the tiller leaving and entering a harbour and let "Blondie" ( my old hasler wind vane ) do the steering the rest of the time.

My rig will be twin headsails poled out ( roller and hanked on a removeable inner forestay ). I don’t have a spinnaker track on the mast so I shackle the cup fixings together and support them on a halyard and a line to the bow and another to the base of the mast.
This triangulated fixing is totally adjustable and very flexible so little rolling.

My boom is too low to have a bimini up when sailing with the mainsail ( unless someone has a clever idea? but downwind for the crossing I can set up a shade over the cockpit as the main will be stowed.
I was also hoping to rig the shade as a raincatcher with a hose take off in the middle so I can run it straight into the tanks.
I promise that we will visit ( and buy a drink for ) anyone on our route who we meet via this forum......it's all part of the adventure.
 
Re. cockpit shade,

On our boat we use a poled out headsail on the inner forestay one side. For the biggger genoa, we use the boom as its pole. Prevented right out as far as it will go, sheet rove through a block on the end of the boom.

Works great and means you can get some cockpt shade.
 
Here's an idea - try and choose a departure date to maximise moonlight ie probably full moon halfway thru your trip. This reduces the total blackness thing.

You can expect momentary winds (gusts) over 40knot true which sounds like awful but it's behind you. I've done it westwards 4 times and yep, one of those years was heftier winds, the rest not really enough. Or the sails not big enough, not sure....
 
Getting back

Everybody has talked about the passage west and all the islands when you get there. I haven't managed the time, money and opportunity simultaneously but did spend 5 years working in the W Indies..

Prior to this spent three years in Bermuda and still have to go back to see SWMBO's relatives. On your way back, if you want to take a break there, dont plan on it being much longer than it takes you to catch up on rest and re-stock provisions. You can tour the island in just a couple of days by bus or rented scooter .... and burn loads of money in shops, restaurants and bars.

The Azores often sound attractive - I quite fancy sailing there and back without going any further west.
 
We did the circuit a good few years ago now and don't have much to add about the Windies. Would endorse the remarks about the Spanish Rias, in fact we are planning to return there next year post retirement. No-one has mentioned thwe Intra-coastal Waterway. We sailed from Martinique via DR and Cuba, Bahamas and then to Ft Lauderdale and then up the ICW to Baltimore, with some of it outside, but most of it in the waterway. It really was one of the highspots of the trip- the southern states in particular, the Carolinas and Georgia, for the wild-life, the history- the wonderful old towns like Savannah and Charleston, and the friendly and hospitable people. The Chesapeake was wonderful and we had a memorable side trip to Washington. And don't believe all the stuff you read about "must haves". We didn't have refrigeration or a bimmini and it was fine, though these days a fridge would probably be on my wish list.
 
I will second the ICW as being worth doing. I did Key West to Washington DC and back down to Florida covering all of the ICW at least once but popping out from time to time in 1996.

However you would do this in summer which is Hurricane season. I was 20 miles south of the spot where Bertha hit. Then had Fran to contend with while I was in Washington and finally Josephine had a swipe at me.
 
Am I too late?

We did a couple of circuits, but one was a couple of years:

Uk, Rias, Canaries, Barbados and up the chain. Over to Bermuda and cross to Maine etc for Summer - Don't knock the US until you have been! - back down to the Bahamas, around Cuba and down to the Caymans, turn around and back to Cuba and home. - more or less!

The things you might be interested in are that generally in the US, the Bahamas and Cuba, there is plenty of spearfishing..... Cuba is probably the best cruising we have ever had.

It was a great route. PM me if you need more info or top fishing spots!

Patrick and Sinead
 
Foxy said:
We did a couple of circuits, but one was a couple of years:

Uk, Rias, Canaries, Barbados and up the chain. Over to Bermuda and cross to Maine etc for Summer - Don't knock the US until you have been! - back down to the Bahamas, around Cuba and down to the Caymans, turn around and back to Cuba and home. - more or less!

The things you might be interested in are that generally in the US, the Bahamas and Cuba, there is plenty of spearfishing..... Cuba is probably the best cruising we have ever had.

It was a great route. PM me if you need more info or top fishing spots!

Patrick and Sinead
Click to expand...

Hi
Never too late!
We leave in about 3 months.
would love to hear more about Cuba and the Bahamas (I read it was very shallow?)
Did you keep a blog or something we can look at?

thanks
Nick
 
melandnick said:
Hi
Never too late!
We leave in about 3 months.
would love to hear more about Cuba and the Bahamas (I read it was very shallow?)
Did you keep a blog or something we can look at?

thanks
Nick
Click to expand...

People make too much about being constrained by their draft in the Bahamas. Yes there is lots of skinny water but there are also lots of places you can get to with 8 feet draft.

Anything up to 6 feet means you can go most places but expect to touch from time to time. 6 -> 8 feet requires some careful chart reading and possibly sounding ahead from the dinghy getting in to some anchorages. Oh yes get some tide tables too!

If you plan to " do " the Bahamas make sure you allow time for the Turks and Caicos which are great.
 
Mel and Nick

l can't add to the places here. I am half way thru' my one year circuit. But the thing that has really made my trip is the cruising community. I have never experienced such a supportive community before. You have to lose your British reserve; get used to knocking on the hull of your neighbours at anchor. Chnaces arethat they'll offer you a beer, tell you the best places to go, introduce you to the rest of the anchorage and invite you to eat with them later. And it's not long before you reciprocate. I broke a windgen blade by walking into it. The threee year old who witnessed it remembered me weeks later 100 miles away! On the cruisers net I asked if anyone had a spare. Within seconds I had offers from all over Prickly Bay - free! Nationality etc are nothing. I was on a bus ride around St Lucia last week with 5 diff europeans, 2 americans and a St Lucian.

So I would treat your plans as you did your ongoing refit to the boat: as a working title. It will probably change along the way.

One thing: DO NOT arrange to meet friends in both place and time. One or the other; ask them when or where they would like to join you: not both. It just doesn't work. Either you get streesed trying to make an inappropriate passage or they spend extra money getting to you. If they want 'where' then ring them a little before to say when; or if they want 'when' then ring them a little before to say where. It's cheaper in the long run. I've got the t-shirt!!
 
Again, thanks for replies.

TQA - touching the bottom never appeals to me ( well, suppose it depends how firm the bottom is ;) ) and that is what has put me off the Bahamas as I draw over 6' in cruising mode, but I will take a good look at the charts.
The other thing is time, if we get to the Caribbean in Jan then we need to see as much as poss and be heading North and home before the wind gets out of hand so not sure if we would get time.

mattonthesea - I imagine in these days of worrying about pirates etc that if you knock on the hull of an American boat then you are likely to get shot!!!!

I agree though, that when cruising, the community is what makes it worthwhile.
It takes a certain kind of person to take all they own and stick it in a small floaty thing and then risk it all to the sea for the sake of a little adventure.
These are the people we want to be around and I have awesome memories of my last trip and the characters that became friends.

Nick
 
Hi Mel n Nick
Things are different when you get out there and start your adventure, if you arrive in the Caribbean in Jan then the trades are or should be in full effect giving some high winds and great sailing but if you head to far north to early you will be arriving in winter and all that that entails.

Look at the passage charts and check the percentages for big winds at various lats and longs, it is very hard to keep to a schedule once you start as the weather doesn't care where you want to be next week!

Piracy isn't a huge concern in most anchorages and most cruisers can spot another cruiser when you drop anchor. it takes a little getting used to but the expectations are always to say hi to your neighbours and exchange travel info going in both directions, where you just came from and where you are headed.
Internet and happy hour locations is always a great ice breaker along with the best supermarkets and local produce.

Have fun.

Mark
 
The tradewinds have set in finally, and they are blowing lustily - its even rather chilly at night, with temps getting down to around 22 - 23C on the east coast of Barbados (and that is before the wind chill factor!).

Re pirates, hopefully the various dinghy and outboard motor thieves havent cottoned on to what the lads in Somalia are up to now. I think they are happy though, doing what they do best, ie dealing in dinks and motors.
Hence you want to make sure that you provide lots of discouragement for them re your dink, so they go and have a bash at somebody elses.
RHIBs and 10 - 15 hp OB motors are VERY desirable, a wobbly old Avon Redcrest with a 2 hp on the back a bit less so.
But still lock up that 2 hp!

But the general consensus seems to be to just be careful, and take the same precautions that you would in eg somewhere like London. Many American yachtie folk seem to be quite happy living in big cities in the USA, yet feel compelled to equip their vessels with a veritable arsenal of weaponry for a Caribbean cruise.

Re the Foxy's B-log, it is here - http://www.yachtfoxglove.typepad.com/
I met them here in Barbados after they crossed the Atlantic, and I also met Foxglove with her previous Owners (a lovely American couple) in Lymington almost 20 years ago; they had built her themselves about 10 years earlier, and gone off on a wee cruise around the world.
Have a look also at Jonic's B-log at http://www.theyachtmoonshine.com/
 
From Gibralter to Cape Verde then Guyana IS MARCH a safe time?

For several reasons we will be delayed making our way from Gib across the Atlantic to (British) Guyana then the Caribbean. I would be v grateful for all advice and comments on the advisability and problems we encounter leaving this late. I had thought of hading down the African coast to Cape Verde (keeping several hundred miles off-shore) then once we reach the CV head across to Guyana. We would like to cruise up the Essequibo River for a few months before working our way along the Caribbean then Panama and the Pacific.

I have looked at the pilot charts and can see that there is likely to be more gales in Feb / March than November / December, but is it poasaible with good weather advice and routing to work our way down to the CV?
 
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