Advice Please re Najad

Numba

Numba

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All you experienced yachties, please help

I am 58 years old and charter in Turkey every year
We parked next to a Najad 50 foot yacht once and I lost my heart to the Najad
I intend to retire in about 6 years and then want to sail the Med for a few years

Would a 34 foot Najad be a good boat for 2 people to cruise the Med with?
Where can I get hold of a layout of the old 34 foot Najad with a central cockpit?

Your suggestions and advice will be appreciated:D
 
That size and type has been very popular, but by today's standards is on the small and cramped side for liveaboard. Centre cockpit has its advantages from the accommodation point of view, but aft cabins are not spacious in the same way as those on similar size Moodys and Westerlies.

The Swedish builders are mostly going over to aft cockpit designs in this size, reflecting customer preference for this style, but of course there are 30 years of production of the old style on the market.

As to finding one - not easy. Very few were built because they were (and are) inordinately expensive compared with alternatives. You can get perfectly adequate bigger boats for the same money, or a "lesser" boat of similar size for a lot less money. You will find many more of the similar HR 352 around, but even these command high prices, and are getting to an age where they need major works to keep them up to standard.

It is a real heart and head issue. Is your priority having a high grade boat with the sort of style they offer or do you want a simple, practical boat that will provide a good platform for living out your retirement. The numbers suggest the latter approach is more popular!

Another thing you have to bear in mind is that if you buy a boat in Northern Europe to use in the Med, you need a big budget to equip it for its new life and a year or more to get it out there. For many people this is fine as the couple of years' preparation and the journey there is all part of the plan. If, however, you want a quick change in lifestyle there is merit in buying a boat already out there - and there is plenty of choice because of people giving up and returning to a shore based life, or moving up or down in size.
 
The nice thing is that you might scrape into the cheap 10m berting charges in the Med.
(I know its 10.363m but maybe ok)
 
Additional to Tranona's post, good advice there, boats designed for the Baltic can be very hot and airless in the Med. Although the wind will blow through at anchor you will find that very often you will want to be in a harbour - in France and Italy because anchorages are rare and in Greece because they are free or nearly so. The designers of these facilities consult a secret document that tells them how to site the berths so that the strongest winds blow across the boats, maximising inconvenience and minimising airflow through them. Ideally you need side windows or portlights that open and three or four deck hatches to keep the interior cool. Last week in Leros the temperature ashore and in our cockpit under the bimini and awning was 42C and down below, even with some airflow, it was 35 C for most of the day and night, dropping to around 30C by early morning.
 
As others have said 34ft is a little short for a cruiser for two people BUT lots of people do cruise on boats that size and smaller.

My first cruising stint was on a flush decked 38 ft CC boat and that was fine. On my second stint I have a 44 ft aft cockpit boat with about the same interior space which I find comfortable.

One thing to consider is that most Najads will come with teak decks which under a Med sun will make the boat hotter inside, most people can not walk on them barefoot and repairs / replacement WHICH IS INEVITABLE will be expensive and time consuming and messy.
 
Thanks again to all you experienced guys. It is really very helpful to be able to ask questions and get sensible logical answers:)

It seems I will have to rethink my infatuation with Najad.

I think I could have overcome the size issue, as I do not intend cruising all year, it would probably be 6-9 months of the year, but the heat is a very logical off-putting issue

One of the other reasons Najad attracted me, as I understand it, it is a very safe ocean going boat and as I am not very experienced I thought that if I do get caught out in the open in force 6-7, I would prefer an ocean going yacht!
Would that be something I should concern myself with or are the other boats, Moodeys/Westerleys etc also fine?
 
Najads are lovely boats, but there aren't too many around. You'll find it much easier to source a used Hallberg Rassy, which is built to at least as good a standard. HRs tend to have a very reassuring motion, and will certainly look after you in adverse weather. Teak deck condition is a factor to consider (and to reflect in any offer you make), but I wouldn't rule out teak decks entirely for hot climates. As for ventilation, lots of HRs were specified originally with opening ports, which give a good through-flow of air. My HR352 has 6 opening ports in the aft cabin and saloon. It's even possible to retro-fit opening ports on many models.
 
pvb has a good shout.

I have raced against a Rassy 342 in a knockabout class and have always been impressed by her all round performance, so you should not get too disillusioned by her in light airs.

You may have seen this Najad 34 for sale, some idea of the layout can be seen in the photo section:

http://www.yachtworld.co.uk/core/li...rency=GBP&access=Public&listing_id=44586&url=

You just have to take a view about the teak deck and live with it; a newer Rassy may give you 10 years without worry and then it's the next owners headache. A deck with problems has to be attached to a very cheap boat.
 
Numba said:
One of the other reasons Najad attracted me, as I understand it, it is a very safe ocean going boat and as I am not very experienced I thought that if I do get caught out in the open in force 6-7, I would prefer an ocean going yacht!
Would that be something I should concern myself with or are the other boats, Moodeys/Westerleys etc also fine?
Click to expand...

Ability to cope with bad weather at sea is more about size than anything else - in other words better a similarly priced 42 ft Benny than a 34 ft Najad safety wise. Anyway, F6-7 is something that almost any cruising boat will cope with. The weakest part of the equation is always the crew so again a big boat or a boat with a more comfortable ride ( not always the same) will help the crew more.

If you do wish to live aboard 9 months pa then you should think seriously about a cat for two reasons. Firstly it will give you more useable room and more airy room, and secondly it will be far more comfortable at anchor and you will spend a lot of time at anchor. We swapped our cat for a mono because we do more weekending and day sailing here in the UK but I would not hesitate to buy a cat if I were planning on doing what you are.
 
Numba said:
Thanks again to all you experienced guys. It is really very helpful to be able to ask questions and get sensible logical answers:)

It seems I will have to rethink my infatuation with Najad.

I think I could have overcome the size issue, as I do not intend cruising all year, it would probably be 6-9 months of the year, but the heat is a very logical off-putting issue

One of the other reasons Najad attracted me, as I understand it, it is a very safe ocean going boat and as I am not very experienced I thought that if I do get caught out in the open in force 6-7, I would prefer an ocean going yacht!
Would that be something I should concern myself with or are the other boats, Moodeys/Westerleys etc also fine?
Click to expand...
The issue about "being caught out" is vastly overrated, particularly if you are sailing in the Med. Surely one of the objectives of retirement sailing is not to scare yourself witless! With today's weather forecast and a relaxed attitude to cruising the chances of getting caught out in rough weather are very, very small - and anyway just about any modern boat (and most old ones) will cope far better with weather than you will.

You will find that somewhere around 85% of your time - or even more is spent at anchor or tied up to a quay or marina. Of the rest of the time on the move more than 50% will be under motor, and most of the rest will be light airs. There is simply no need to have a boat that is at its best in cold stormy northern waters.

Just look at the kind of boats that people use for this purpose. Increasingly it is 35-40ft modern sailboats with big rigs, good engines, large cockpits, big battery banks, lots of water and fuel, electric windlass, good ventilation, big fridge and plenty of shade. Of course some people use older boats, and smaller, but this is often driven by budget. If you only have £30-40k to spend then you can't get a decent size modern boat. However, in that price range there are plenty of Moodys and Westerlys that are far better value than a similar aged Najad (or HR) and they have sailed all round the world - you see plenty of them in the Med.

The downside of course is that they are all old boats and hugely variable in condition and equipment and you can easily spend almost as much as your purchase price on top to bring them up to scratch. You can sometimes find really good ones - a Conway with all the work done went for £35k last year, little more than the cost of the refit.

If you move up a notch you can get a 10 year old 35-38ft Ben/Bav/Jen in the £50-70k range that will knock spots of any of those old boats as a functional liveaboard. Does not have the cred of an HR or Najad, nor are they as nicely handbuilt, but functionally very good. They are built for easy maintenance, have modern equipment and all the major bits will have 20 years of life, rather than getting near the end of their life (think boring things like engine replacements at £8-10 a time).

I went through exactly the same process as you and ended up with a Bavaria. I admire the Najads and HRs etc - they are lovely things to own - but they are neither the best design for the job, nor "good value" if you are trying to maximise your pleasure with a limited budget.
 
Tranona said:
I went through exactly the same process as you and ended up with a Bavaria. I admire the Najads and HRs etc - they are lovely things to own - but they are neither the best design for the job, nor "good value" if you are trying to maximise your pleasure with a limited budget.
Click to expand...

Some truth there, but then again boat ownership isn't exactly a rational thing. I bought 3 new Westerly yachts in the 70s/80s, and thoroughly enjoyed them. Then I bought a used HR. I've had infinitely more pleasure from the HR than any of the others. It's properly built, intelligently thought-out, over-specced, solid, durable, and exquisitely finished. In 16 years, it's cost me next to nothing in necessary repairs (although I replaced the rigging when it was 20 yrs old, and replaced a leaky oil cooler this year). Cosmetically, inside, it remains beautiful. It wasn't cheap to buy, but it has held its value very well, and I reckon it'll be easier to sell than any Ben/Bav/Jen.
 
Numba said:
All you experienced yachties, please help

I am 58 years old and charter in Turkey every year
We parked next to a Najad 50 foot yacht once and I lost my heart to the Najad
I intend to retire in about 6 years and then want to sail the Med for a few years

Would a 34 foot Najad be a good boat for 2 people to cruise the Med with?
Where can I get hold of a layout of the old 34 foot Najad with a central cockpit?

Your suggestions and advice will be appreciated:D
Click to expand...
For longish term Med use a bigger and more modern mass production boat with no teak decks will be much more practical and comfortable. And old teak decks that are "still OK" when you buy now will be really shot after 5-10 years in the Med, and take a huge chunk off the resale value of the boat. Get some quotes for redoing the teak on a 34 ft Najad and frighten yourself.

Yes - Najads and HRs etc are very seaworthy, but for seaworthiness a bigger "lesser" boat is usually just as seaworthy as a smaller "better" boat. Size matters.
 
pvb said:
Some truth there, but then again boat ownership isn't exactly a rational thing. I bought 3 new Westerly yachts in the 70s/80s, and thoroughly enjoyed them. Then I bought a used HR. I've had infinitely more pleasure from the HR than any of the others. It's properly built, intelligently thought-out, over-specced, solid, durable, and exquisitely finished. In 16 years, it's cost me next to nothing in necessary repairs (although I replaced the rigging when it was 20 yrs old, and replaced a leaky oil cooler this year). Cosmetically, inside, it remains beautiful. It wasn't cheap to buy, but it has held its value very well, and I reckon it'll be easier to sell than any Ben/Bav/Jen.
Click to expand...

You are right about ratioinality. You can rationalise owning almost anything (even my Morgan!). I could say exactly the same about my Bavaria - well thought out and put together, lasted for 12 years so far with few problems and done more miles in that time than most boats do in a lifetime. Lacks the exquisitely finished bit, but it only cost 60% of an equivalent size HR and was perfectly suited to the environment. A boat for living on 9 months of the year in a hot climate is a very different animal from a weekend and 2 weeks holiday a year in northern waters, or from a long distance bluewater cruiser.
 
Hi all

Unfortunately it all boils down to the age old "champagne taste and beer budget" story

If budget was not a problem - 50 foot Najad with modified windows fresh from the factory
If budget is a problem - like mine - then consider all options.

I fortunately - actually unfortunately because I am dying to do this - still have about 2 years to research this
 
Tranona said:
You are right about ratioinality. You can rationalise owning almost anything (even my Morgan!). I could say exactly the same about my Bavaria - well thought out and put together, lasted for 12 years so far with few problems and done more miles in that time than most boats do in a lifetime. Lacks the exquisitely finished bit, but it only cost 60% of an equivalent size HR and was perfectly suited to the environment. A boat for living on 9 months of the year in a hot climate is a very different animal from a weekend and 2 weeks holiday a year in northern waters, or from a long distance bluewater cruiser.
Click to expand...

+1
 
wotayottie said:
Trad or Aero? Somehow Morgan ownership doesnt go with Bav but a long keel wooden boat. Old house or modern?
Click to expand...

Well, being a bit of a pig I have two matched pairs. The Bavaria goes with my CMax 2l diesel, bought partly to do the long trips down to the boat in Corfu.

Morgan matched with my long keel MG Eventide currently having its 50 year refit. Morgan is 2003 very basic Runabout bought new to last the rest of my life. Get tempted with an early Aero8 every time I go to the dealer for service. Then my wife reminds me it won't fit the garage!
 
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