Advice on Princess Riviera 266 (twin Engine) Fuel consumption, and is it good for Thames?

[Phill]

If I were you, I’d take a drive out and visit all of the Thames brokers that you can get to. (Possibly by appointment at this time) between them they usually have lots of suitable river boats from Freeman, Fairline, Seamaster, etc, etc. Most of the upper Thames brokers are surprisingly close together by road and offer good advise. Once you’ve got a short list, let us know. Just remember that boats specifically designed for river use are easier and hence more enjoyable to use. Interested to see how you progress.

 

[lizziG]

Hey, back again with another boat find. After your sound advice I’ve been seeking out single Diesel engine boats for the thames.
Does anyone have anything negative to say about the Fairline 29 mirage. Found a lovely one, however I’m just checking a 1980 yr boat is still worth buying now? I know they are good river boats and have strong history.
The hard top slightly puts me off as I do like to sit in the sun when out back in cockpit, but I’d hope with the sunroof section open and the hood off the back end, that it would feel open enough? It’s not a sea toilet which I have been used to, but I presume that chemical toilets are also popular on the thames and easy places to empty them?..
Anyway she’s a lovely boat, kitted out with lots of toys.
be good to know if others agree that this type of boat is a good buy?

 

[The Glassman]

Hello again. The Mirage was a well made and designed craft - and rightly very popular for inland cruising. An aft cabin one with the (most commonly fitted) Volvo diesel engine with shaft drive is a very comfy boat for four. The aft cockpit ones are still a bit too cosy for regular use by four people IMHO. Still lots of them in good shape and getting strong prices too. Avoid the stern drive ones and have a proper survey done and you would be a happy boater. Good luck!

 

[Phill]

A much more suitable boat for the river that you will really enjoy using. It might be worthwhile putting a link here to the boat as we can offer an opinion on a specific boat which may be helpful.
As for the chemical toilet, it’s not a problem. Easy and cost free to empty (compared to £17.00 at my marina to empty holding tank) and in my experience less likely to block with zero maintenance compared to a sea toilet. More modern chemical toilets even have an electric flush. Useful but obviously fills the waste tank quicker.

 

[lizziG]

Hello again. The Mirage was a well made and designed craft - and rightly very popular for inland cruising. An aft cabin one with the (most commonly fitted) Volvo diesel engine with shaft drive is a very comfy boat for four. The aft cockpit ones are still a bit too cosy for regular use by four people IMHO. Still lots of them in good shape and getting strong prices too. Avoid the stern drive ones and have a proper survey done and you would be a happy boater. Good luck!

A much more suitable boat for the river that you will really enjoy using. It might be worthwhile putting a link here to the boat as we can offer an opinion on a specific boat which may be helpful.
As for the chemical toilet, it’s not a problem. Easy and cost free to empty (compared to £17.00 at my marina to empty holding tank) and in my experience less likely to block with zero maintenance compared to a sea toilet. More modern chemical toilets even have an electric flush. Useful but obviously fills the waste tank quicker.

A much more suitable boat for the river that you will really enjoy using. It might be worthwhile putting a link here to the boat as we can offer an opinion on a specific boat which may be helpful.
As for the chemical toilet, it’s not a problem. Easy and cost free to empty (compared to £17.00 at my marina to empty holding tank) and in my experience less likely to block with zero maintenance compared to a sea toilet. More modern chemical toilets even have an electric flush. Useful but obviously fills the waste tank quicker.

Hi Phil
Here’s the link to the boat I’m thinking of offering on
Fairline Mirage 29 For Sale from TBS Boats

 

[The Glassman]

Go have a look at it and see what you think.
Then have a look at one or two with aft cabin and a shaft -drive setup. You’ll then see why they’re the ones that sell well.
It looks like a nice clean boat, but don’t get too excited about a few ‘toys’ like mood lighting etc. - cost nothing much and don’t make a difference.
A nice clean aft cabin, shaft drive will be a bit more dosh, but worth it. ‘Toys’ that are really useful are bowthrusters, full service history, modern electrics etc.
Take your time, it’s a buyer’s market right now.
All the best,

 

[lizziG]

Hi, thanks for your advice.
I have seen the boat, she’s in very good condition. The toys don’t impress although the TV’s and DVD players are handy for my kids!!
Could you guide me a little on the shaft drive vs stern drive? I’ve been reading up on both, pros and cons etc...seems shaft drives cheaper to maintain but stern a little easier to handle? Also says shaft can’t be in shallow waters but guess on Thames this shouldn’t be a problem?
Also mentions both shaft and stern drives need to have anodes changed every year? Do the boats have to come out of the water for this? Ive only ever lifted my current boat once every 2 years for its usual anti foul and engine service (but it’s an outboard, so a totally different cost to upkeep!)
I think I may need to totally re think the inboard engine boats if I have to pay for lifting it out for servicing engine every year.
If it’s every 2 years and the main servicing can be done without taking it out then that’s a bit more appealing.
Engines are a new thing to me, so trying to educate and understand what the cost of moving from an outboard is going to be!
Thanks in advance

 

[The Glassman]

Hi.... please don’t take this personally, but I think you need a bit of a reality check here.

Running a boat on which you and kids can spend some time cruising on the Thames is not a cheap hobby....

You cannot trail a 3 or 4 ton boat around the place, so you’ll need a mooring. Think £2-3k per year for a (very) basic bank side berth or up to £4K plus vat in a Marina.

The EA then wants a fee for using the river. I pay £650pa for my 10.5 metre boat

The insurance for my boat runs me £500 pa

You will need to take her out for a pressure wash and antifoul every two years max. Mine comes out annually and that costs £1k plus.

Engines need a service every 100 hours or so. That could be annually or bi-annually depending upon the use.

Anodes aren’t a big issue in fresh water. Every few years will do. They’re checked when the boat is lifted.

You’re effectively maintaining a small, remote, second house, so there will be routine maintenance issues too.

This is not a cheap hobby! But it is a great way to chill, meet like-minded people, and see the magnificent Thames From an entirely different perspective.

We are lucky in that we own our mooring, but we still allow £4<5k p.a. for our wonderful Thames cruising.

As to handling, a shaft diesel with a bowthruster will knock spots off a stern drive IMHO.

All best,

 

[lizziG]

Non offence taken, apart from perhaps you haven’t read the thread of these messages.
I’m certainly not new to boating!
I’ve had boats all my life, on the canals with my parents, and now 5 years of owning a boat on the river myself.
I simply asked for guidance on shaft drive/vs sterndrive.
I’m fully aware of the costs!!
I have my mooring, I’ve had it for 5 years and I have a new mooring in place for a bigger boat when I buy it.
I anti foul my boat every 2 years, and obviously aware of river license and insurance fees.
So no need to educate on that side.

It’s interesting for me to get opinions from other boat owners about engines, I have also seemed advice of a very good surveyor, who has thankfully made me steer clear of the big American brands, as I don’t want high running costs on fuel etc.

I know not to go near a twin engine petrol, and ideally a single diesel would suit me well on the river.
What I wondered was why you were telling me to stay clear of sterndrives as it’s seems they are a very popular choice for engines on these slightly bigger boats.

ideally I’m looking to exchange my Viking 22 (as mentioned in earlier thread) for a bigger boat as we want to go away on it for longer than a long weekend and we could do with something that offers slightly bigger sleeping accommodation.

I know the bigger the boat, the bigger the costs. I’m just trying to educate myself a little more on engines and how they operate (as I’m purely used to an outboard)
If I could afford a Viking 275 or Shetland 27i snap one up immediately!

Would be good to get other opinions of other people from this sight, but I think if I’m going back and forth with same thoughts, I may now leave it to my new gained knowledge and advice of the surveyors on which I should go for.
I may also just wait a year and sell mine now while boats are being over priced and wait to see how the market lies next year.

 

[Phill]

The boat you’ve picked out is a very suitable boat for the river. Mirages were very well built and most still look to be in good condition all these years later. I can’t offer any advice on that specific boat but that’s what your surveyor will do. Shaft drives were only available on the aft cabin versions which are more expensive plus some prefer a larger cockpit.
Do not be put off by a stern drive. I’ve had three over the years, there’s hundreds of them on the rivers and most work really well. They do need maintenance and when they go wrong, can be expensive but that’s true of anything whether in the boating world or any other world. I’ve spent more on my teeth than my outdrives!
Engine servicing which should be fairly minimal can be carried out whilst the boat is in the water and you’ll probably need a lift out every two or three years for anti fouling and a check of the drive and anode. I used to change my drive gaiters every two years. If you can’t do that yourself, nip round the back of TBS’s office and ask the engineers there for an idea of cost.
I’ve bought four boats through Dominic at TBS and know that they will look after you so that’s another positive. If you like the boat, take it out for a run, get a survey carried out and see what that shows. And lastly, it seems you’ll never need to buy another fender. ?

 

[Phill]

Another thing that may be useful if you still have your Viking is TBS do offer a part exchange on some of their boats.

 

[lizziG]

Thanks Phil.I know Dominic is keen to sell my boat for me, but he didn't offer me part exchange on this as the owner of the fairline doesn't want to buy another.
It's also a little far for us to sail our boat to, so i'm going to take my viking to Walton marina for Tingdene to sell for me.

I'm going to see what i get for mine and then go from there, but thanks for all your sound advise on me taking the next step up from a viking!