Advice for a novice on lowering the sails.

[ProDave]

For the sake of a fivers worth of sliders and shackles why not make yours' and the missuses life easy?

I think I'm sold on the sliders idea, particularly if I can sew the sliders on myself. I had previously been advised to rivet eyes into the sail and fix the sliders to the eyes with plastic shackles.

Yes you are dead right, when lowering the main you end up with a lot of flapping sail. Actually that went okay this time as we lowered it in stages, throwing some sail ties round before lowering further.

So I'll fit some sliders and see how it goes, then determine if I need lazyjacks or not, I can probably establish that at home on the trailer over the winter. While I like the idea of lazyjacks and it looks simple enough to set up, it's still one more thing to set up when you launch the boat. But that's not a big issue having secured a berth so she should be in all summer.

I know how well the sliders work. I had a spare sail that came with the boat with sliders sewn in, and I tried that sail. It went up and down beutifully. Only trouble was the sail was more than a metre taller than the mast, so clearly not right for this boat. I've since sold that spare sail but at least it gave me a taster of how well sliders work.

It will only be a week or 2 before she comes out for the winter but we hope to get out on her once or twice more to have some more practice.

 

[Lakesailor]

There seems to be a vital piece of the jigsaw missing here,

Not if you read my post and the previous one

 

[ProDave]

Here's an update to this thread. We took Ferndell out again today.

Today we got ambitions. Too ambitious for our experience as it turned out.

No problem getting out and getting the sails up. The wind was forecast to be E and F3, and the plan was to sail SW for 5 miles then back again, i.e the first time actually sailing with a destination in mind then back again.

As it turned out once we got under way, the wind was actually NE, i.e right behind us. To avoid sailing completely on a run, we sailed a few degrees off, gybing occasionally, and reached our destination. All the time not paying attention to the weather behind us.

When we turned to come back, which because of the wind on the nose would have been tacking all the way, was when we noticed the wind had freshened to probably a F5, Wind over tide now so a short chop and a very bouncy ride, more than our inexperience was happy with, so we pulled the sails down and motored home.

At least this time we had no particular problems getting the sails down, having tried to heed the advice earlier in the thread.

Because of the wind over tide and short waves, it was a choppy ride home on the motor that took an hour and a half, averaging just over 3 knots over water on a modest throttle on the outboard.

There was another (larger) yacht sailing much the same course as us, and he too took his sails down and motored back, so we feel we made the right choice.

All part of the learning curve no doubt.

That's probably the last sail this year, we are taking her out this week. But we now have two offers of experienced skippers to come out with us next year to help improve our skills.

I find examining my foresails that they do already have the steel wire with eyes sewn in each end, so I will definitely be buying a roller furling drum and bearing for that.

 

[Searush]

Hopefully, you have learned a couple of useful lessons.

You never notice the wind increasing when it is astern, because you simply go faster. Always be aware that the wind will apparently increase a couple of forces when you turn into it. Be ready to reef if you are going to beat back.

The tide can affect conditions significantly - especially if it flows strongly where you are. Always be aware of when the tide changes. And think about what will change.

Well done, every trip will bring something new & fun. And thanks for the feedback.

 

[westernman]

It of course depends on the boat, the wind direction, where you are and how much space you have.

This is what we do in a 34 ton boat in our home port.
This port has a channel leading up to the marina which is quite long and very wide - 170m. (8 boat lengths).

So normally, with the wind coming from the usual prevailing directions, we will sail in through the harbour entrance and into this channel. Before this we will have lowered and stowed the topsails, and furled the jib (which can be a right pain so this we always do first unless the wind is very light).

So when we heave to, we have up the main and the staysail. If the wind is very strong, the main may be reefed. Heaving to the sails are sheeted to close hauled and then we tack without touching the staysail, then luff up.

At this point the boat will be stable and not healing too much. Also it won't be going anywhere very fast.

Slacken of the staysail sheet about 6 inches and then lower the stay sail. (If the sheet is not slackened, the pressure on the hanks in the middle of the sail will stop it coming down). This comes done almost on its own, and will pretty much flakes itself into a nice pile on the deck inside the bulwarks. We don't bother tidying it up until we are at the dock.

The boat will then head up into the wind, but will not go very far (normally we don't have to touch the wheel).

We top up the boom (this weighs several hundred kilos), winch in the main until it is centered over the boom crutch and then slacken off the topping lift until the boom is in the crutch. Then we lower the main. We used to do this slowly folding it as it came down, but we have since discovered that if we drop it fast it folds itself just as well!.
The topping lift stops the gaff swining very far so no one will get knocked overboard (Tabarly).

While the crew is putting on the sail ties I start the engine, move back into the middle of the channel if we have drifted too far. Put the engine into neutral, and finish off tidying up the main. (In particular the reefing penants which dangle in the cockpit and will snarl with the wheel given half a chance).

In places where there is less space, we will drop the sails outside the harbour. If possible we will sail in just under staysail, but that does not happen often (either not enough wind to move the boat fast enough to be in control, or it is a head wind).

We can drop the main on almost any point of sail if we top it up first, and once down we can get the boom into the crutch without much difficulty.

Trying to keep a boat head to wind as you mess around is tricky - whether with engine or not unless have someone experienced on the helm with just that to do.

So we don't try to do that.
Being hove to, means that you are not going anywhere (or hardly), and that the boat is very stable - even in a strong wind and choppy water. Ideal for moving around on deck.

If we are tying up to a mooring buoy we will just sail along side it up wind on close reach and juggle sheets and direction to come to a stop with the buouy against the side of the boat next to the shrounds. We then just tie up (usually both of us do this as we have to thead it around the bob stay for the bow sprit etc). We then can drop the sails in any order at leisure.

(We really pissed off a mobo one time doing this picking up the last free buoy in the anchorage, he really did not want us to get the buouy but as he was give way vessel he had to keep out of our way!).

 

[ianat182]

Further to all the previous threads. If you are really keen on using sliders on the main then I suggest you purchase a spraycan of teflon or silicon. Spray each of the sliders and the luff groove as far up as possible. If you take off the sliders and revert to the luff rope being fed to the luff groove, spray the luff rope of the sail all the way along its edge,don't overdo it ,though it won't normally stain the sailcloth. You now have two options and the sail will go up like greased lightning and descend likewise for stowing, or reducing to take a slab reef.
Recently I tried a different method when singlehanded which was to put the boat in a 'hove-to' state before dropping the main. To do this the jib is brought across the boat so that it is backed and the speed is more sideways and very much reduced ;the mainsail is stalled, and the tiller pushed to the opposite side as if about to tack, and held there( a short shock cord will suffice to hold it there.your boat is now stable,the engine can be started and you will be able to lower the mainsail and do a quick rough stow.The sail will come down very quickly, so two sail ties, or elastic ties, will be sufficient to secure.
Return to the cockpit now, and then furl the jib whilst motoring near head to wind, the sheet under slight tension.

The advantage of Lakey's furling method is that the halyard has to be kept under tension to work ,and the gain is then having a tight forestay, this improves pointing ability.
On sailing dinghies where this method is used, they have a 'muscle box 'of pulleys ,or a Highfield lever that is set to the desired tension for the weather conditions. Bar tight for strong winds and beating, and eased slightly when going down wind; I doubt you would bother with the latter action on your boat but the first element is important.

Your new club friends will explain the' hove-to' situation if this is unclear, but I hope it helps.

ianat182

 

[William_H]

Going for a sail

Always if at all possible sail up wind first for any pleasure sail especially if you have nervous people on board. The home is a breeze down wind. Yes as said I am always amazed how much difference the apparent wind is when you turn around from a run down wind. If you make 5 knots down wind and 4 knots up wind the wind will be 9 knots stronger sailing into it. A huge difference in 10 knots of true wind. Still sialing is all about learning things the hard way. good luck olewill

 

[Lakesailor]

Ianat182 is correct in that the luff is taking the strain of , but not replacing, the forestay.
I have fitted a rigging screw between my furling drum and tack to help tension the luff. Unfortunately the "pre-stretched" halyard does still stretch a bit. I'm not about to spend £40 on a dyneema halyard! And yes there is a shackle in there and I just don't care.

Yesterday I went out for a singlehanded sail and in a mile or so had a decent 12 knot breeze, absolutely nothing and then a 20 knot breeze for the last half mile. As my 17 ft boat doesn't have any reefing facility I was ready for a rest and to put everything that crashed to the floor in the cabin back so I loosened the sheets, furled the headsail and dropped the main without any difficulty. My boat won't heave to successfully so I luffed up and furled the headsail with a slight pressure on it (tidier furling) and then dropped the main, gathering it inboard until there was little wind pressure, then sheeted the boom in and flaked the sail loosely.

I was filming this using my new-found video skills, but my video knowledge is sparse so of course the memory card ran out before the big breeze.

I agree with WilliamH as well. If you have a choice do the cold wet bit first and then sail home in comfort.