2nd hand Floatation suits

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tarik

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Spoke to a chap over the week end who is a seasoned blue water sailor. He showed me his Floatation/Survival suit. He bought is second hand from one of the Oil Rig supppliers, it was worn by helicopter passengers. Although purchased in used a condition it seemed in excellent condition.
I have tried this morning to contact the company - Whirly Bird Ltd, Aberdeen, without success, does anybody know if they are still in existence and if not are there any other suppliers out there?

As ever many thanks for any replies.

David
 
When my old oilies needed replacing, I bought a Cosalt Gemini two piece flotation suit. See here http://www.cosalt.com/products-serv...05C3BA15-6E35-4ECD-8758-3D2B4FDFEA5A&pr_id=82

It's very well made. I can't remember the exact cost but it was much cheaper than most standard yachting jackets and salopettes. I bought mine on line from a now defunct Crewsaver web site (Cosalt own/owned Crewsaver) but you should be able to buy it direct from Cosalt.

I wear the jacket most of the time but it gets quite hot in sunny weather. It's brilliant otherwise and even on quite cold days I can wear just a T-shirt plus the suit and I am warm. Also, because I tend to wear the jacket a lot, I usually have 50N buoyancy in the event of falling out of the dinghy or off a pontoon. Coupled with a lifejacket and the salopettes, I have 250N buoyancy.
 
tarik said:
Spoke to a chap over the week end who is a seasoned blue water sailor. He showed me his Floatation/Survival suit. He bought is second hand from one of the Oil Rig supppliers, it was worn by helicopter passengers. Although purchased in used a condition it seemed in excellent condition.
I have tried this morning to contact the company - Whirly Bird Ltd, Aberdeen, without success, does anybody know if they are still in existence and if not are there any other suppliers out there?

As ever many thanks for any replies.

David
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Cosalt might be worth a try
 
Multifabs or Whirlybird Services.
These are just basically a goretex one piece with wrist and neck seals - they are a survival suit but not a flotation suit. Travelling offshore in addition we also wear a lifejacket and thermal lining. There is no reinforcing around prominent wear points and too many pockets where you don't need them. By the time they are disposed of to the second hand market, have been very well used.
If I was given one I would use one; pay good money for one? I would not. There are better suggestions above.
 
dukes4monny said:
Why not buy a new Fladen suit
I got one for overnight passages and it's the dogs dooda's.......

No links etc., just a happy customer :)
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Another vote for Fladen. Cheap kit that combines flotation and insulation. A bit too sweaty for racers and other active sailors but perfect for "lines led aft" family cruisers.

If i ever fall in I hope I'm wearing mine.
 
Fladen

Yet another vote for Fladen. I got my two piece for only £65 on special offer from the local Fisherman's CoOp. It's like wearing a suit of armour against the weather- you stay properly warm and dry inside. In summer I usually use just the top half, with a T shirt underneath when it's quite hot. I know it must be winter now because the bottom half has come out of the cupboard.
It isn't quite as supple and manoeuvrable as non-flotation clothing, I suppose, but that doesn't stop me sailing my dinghy wearing it.
 
Do not be confused.

You mentioned floatation suits as used by North Sea Helicopter passengers.

My understanding is that these are actually Survival Suits or immersion suits with attached mittens and boots and are intended for use if helo ditches. Never tried one but I hear that they are very cumbersome and are not intended for use whilst doing any activity other than floating around. Substitute for a lifejacket I believe. They reach a sell by date and are sold off by helo companies, used to be about 50 quid without a certificate.

Floatation suits on the other hand are heat insulated and prevent cold water shock, have wrist and ankle neoprine closures to limit water ingress. The Insulation offers about 50 Newtons floatation. Say 2 hours survival in cold water. Far better IMHO than regular sailing gear, Not a substitute for a lifejacket.

I got mine years and years ago from Cosalt for £95 and as someone else has said is the Bees Knees. Not breathable though. Various people make them now including Baltic.
 
Abandon heli suits

if you want to have them for say 7 crew as part of abandon ship kit, it's not a bad idea to have the ex whirlybird ones.One extra caveat in addition to the sensible comments above is that the wrist and ankle seals do not like tropical heat. Mine were kept dry and poly wrapped in Irish Sea/Channel waters and kept well, but wrist and ankle seals melted in the Med.
In cold climates apart from giving valuable time to casualties, they are great for beginning scrubbing off as the tide goes down on your drying slab.When the tide has receded completely you by then have washed off with freshwater hose and now proceed to antifoul if it is a dry day! I got mine from Macsalvors, in I think Cornwall area, yep its macsalvors.com
One might be able to haggle a bit for quantity?Little or no thermal qualities, with luck your clothes stay dry esp if you vaseline the zip and have it tight against your throat.These had neophrene mitts and hood too, and sort of floppy socks in orange material same as the suits themselves.
Good sailing andboating to all!
 
IIRC Whirlybirds was bought by Multifabs, which is now Survival One. Google either Survival one or multifabs.

There are few different types of suit used by helicopter passengers depending on the operator of the installation they are traveling to. The most usual is a Survival suit which is a Goretex shell with built in socks and wrist and neck seals. There is no insulation value but they are breathable.

On the Norwegian side of the North sea and for one of the operators on this side, there is an immersion suit with built in boots and insulation. These are much more cumbersome and less breathable.

THe ultimate immersion suit is thick neoprene with built in boots, gloves and hood and gives you the dexterity of a Telly tubby.

I'd go for the survival suit for sailing, but as mentioned before the ex north sea ones have had a hard life although the more modern ones have neoprene neck and wrist seals which will last better than the rubber seals. If you get the latter, lots of talc or french chalk to help stop splitting.
 
boomerangben said:
....more modern ones have neoprene neck and wrist seals which will last better than the rubber seals. If you get the latter, lots of talc or french chalk to help stop splitting.
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You can get Aquaseal Seal Saver from a diving or watersports shop which is a silicon liquid and treats and protects neoprene and latex seals. I use it on my sailing drysuit seals and socks & diving drysuit seals and then chalk over them. Its also worth getting a decent liquid wax lubricant for zips as well.
 
Some of the second hand items on the market are just that, very second hand ! Useful though if there is dirty work to do as they are waterproof and disposable and cost very little.

The PVC type materials are the best of the "disposable" items I find because they hose down well. Yes, you get hot and sweaty inside however, if your septic tank needs pressure washed, would you rather be inside a hot and sweaty suit of not ! !

The neoprens suits are fantastic for a night watch at the tiller, in fact anything that involves cold and wet that is sedentry. They are a bit more expensive but much better. Boomerangben is spot in this respect. Some of the better quality neoprexne suits are built from oil resisting and flame retarding material. Thgey can be taylored for different purposes too. The mittens can be cut off to aid dexterity, for example. Your local dive shop is the place to go for this type ofservice.

The Fladen system looks good to me, the jackets have about 50N available to keep you up but I believe that a lifejacket is a must with all the suits that I have seen.

73s de
Johnth
 
Another possible source for secondhand survival/immersion suits are shipbreakers.

I suppose there are really three or four different categories of survival/immersion suits, not counting Fladen which is not an immersion suit as such. The Fladen suit does provide floatation, but not thermal insulation since it does not seal the water out.

947886006875000.jpg

The most basic is the passenger suit. This is a waterproof but non-insulated suit. It will keep you dry even when floating around in the sea, but you are totally dependent upon the clothing you wear under the suit to maintain body temperature. The Gore-Tex suit boomerangben mentions would fall in this category wrt thermal protection. A big advantage on a yacht is that they are cheap and pack small, the shown model is, IIRC, vacuum packed and has a packing volume of 2 liters, so you should have no problem stowing one for each crew member. They are only intended for emergency use and you have to wear a lifejacket over the suit.

947886159843750.jpg

Next up is the rescue suit. It, too, is only intended for emergencies but has much better thermal insulation than the passenger suit. It will not stand up to daily use. No need to wear a lifejacket since the suit material has adequate buoyancy, even if the suit is flooded.

Both the passenger and rescue suits are intended to be used with your shoes on, i.e. you do not waste time taking off shoes or other clothing before donning the suit, just jump right into it and zip up.

947863309218750.jpg

Then there's the 'transport suit'. Shown is the most recent model worn by offshore helicopter passengers in the Norwegian sector. This suit is designed for daily use, but with the added safety features such as sprayhood etc it gets quite bulky.

947839029218750.jpg

If you intend to use the suit for standing watch in bad weather in a cold climate, say when circumnavigating Spitsbergen, the MOB-boat/work suit is the item you want. This is a suit that is intended for heavy-duty daily use. It has steel capped boots and reinforcements in all the right places.
 
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Wow, that was a fantastic round up OYVAND but would you want steel cap boots for sailing ? Only joking !

As far as I can tell, all the safety stuff in the in the oil industry costs an arm and two legs new. Worth every penny too however, back to the world of sailing and used immersion suits.

For what it is worth, I think cheap (disposable ?) for working about and a bit more expensive neoprene for the cold wet watch. I have seen them used by pilots when single engine over water. My understanding is that they are too cumberoume for hang gliding.

The Fladen jackets look and feel nice on but, as you say, it is not an immersion suit.

Hope we never need to use any of it except for working about !


73s
Johnth
 
So, we are back round the loop, it all depends on what you want to do with your suit !

I use mine to stay warm and dry on my canal boat, rushing to the pub before last orders.

The disposable one is for pressure washing the bits that need it.

73s de
Johnth
 
planteater said:
The Fladen one piece suit is rated as an immersion suit, meeting ISO15027-1. The two piece suit is made in the same way but, presumably, leaks at the waist and doesn't achieve the immersion suit rating.
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I wasn't aware of that, and a Fladen suit, or any suit that may be tightly cuffed at arms, legs and neck/face, and waist if two-piece, will certainly provide much better protection than not wearing one.

I served as a diver in the Norwegian Navy in the late '80s. The police were at the time considering a Fladen-style suit for their boat patrols, and had asked the diving doc to evaluate one of the candidates.

The good doc, quite a character BTW, figured what better way to find out the suit's thermal properties than to have someone test it in the sea. Since you're probably none too bright in the first place if you choose to become a navy diver, the doc had no problems finding volunteers.

This was in February, and the sea temperature was a balmy 5 degrees C...

I was only given a thin boiler suit to put on underneath. Rubber wellies on my feet, neoprene gloves and a diver's neoprene wet hood in addition to the floatation suit. IIRC, legs were taped over the boots, and all suit closures tightened. Then the trick was to lay as still as possible to avoid any circulation of water inside the suit. A medic continuously monitored my body temperature remotely while I was in the water.

I can tell you, it was painfull as h*ll, especially the freezing cold water around my neck. And I spent a full hour floating there in the sea...

The suit did work, though, I lost only a single degree of body temperature, which was actually an anomaly and significantly less than my fellow divers who were down more like 1.5 - 2 degrees.

OTOH, part of why it worked can be attributed to the fact that we were in a very sheltered harbor with absolutely still water. Had this been at sea with some wave action and ensuing circulation of water inside the suit, temperature loss would no doubt have been much more rapid.

This is not meant to discredit the Fladen suit in any way. It's great value for the money and a good piece of gear for cold-weather cruising. And it will provide a good degree of protection in temperate water. It's just not sufficient for really long-term exposure and/or very cold water IMHO - and that's from personal experience :p
 
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That's a really interesting post, thanks.

A word about how I use my Fladen, though: I wear it ALL THE TIME. I race dinghies wearing it. I row the tender wearing it. I walk the dogs wearing it, when the weather's particularly foul. Thus I consider it a cheaper and warmer alternative to standard oilies. I've never really considered the benefits of it as an 'immersion suit'- I guess that's just a handy bonus. I also tend not to rely on its flotation, and on a yacht I will always use a LJ on top, whilst in a dinghy I will use a buoyancy on top unless we have very calm conditions, other boats around, etc etc.
 
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