£85000 to spend!

chrism

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I hope to buy a bluewater appropriate boat in the next year for a 2 person circumnavigation. Should I buy something recent and relatively lightweight lik a Beneteau 38 or something older such as a Moody 376 with possibly a bit more beef and a skeg hung rudder? My main concern with an older boat is that at least some kit will also be 20 years out of date. I like the ide of a Najd or HR but you have to put up with something very well used for the money.
I know there is no simple answer but I would especially be interested to hear from anyone who has bluewater cruised a Beneteau or similar. I am not sure that it wouldlook after a short handed crew like an older more traditional design
Chrism
 

Captain_Cava

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People do go bluewater cruising in lightweight Bens/Bavs/Legends etc and mostly they don’t have any disasters or deaths! However, IMHO you should be looking for AT LEAST Moody quality.

Funny you should specifically mention a Moody 376.
I'm retiring soon and we are selling our 376 and looking for something a bit bigger and newer to spend 6 months of each year cruising the Med. We are also on a budget (a bit more than yours) but the trouble we are finding is that a 376 is a really hard act to follow. For comfort, storage space, quality build, ease of handling etc etc we are struggling to find better, even at twice the price!

You are right about old kit, but does that really matter. A boat of that size could be re-rigged for say £3-4k, some new nav gear doesn’t have to cost an arm and a leg, and providing she has been well maintained the survey wont find anything major that needs rectifying, just small things and most of them probably only cosmetic. That is unless you are very fussy of course (and you can’t afford to be on your budget).

If you want something a bit newer try a Moody 38. All the brilliant Moody / Bill Dixon attributes of the 376, although some might argue that the build quality was slightly less on the later 38 model.

You should be able to get a good condition 376 for between £65k and £70k (leaving you £15k for upgrades) and an early 38 from about £80k or £85k.

If you want a reprint of a YM secondhand boat test on the 376, PM me with your address and I’ll send you one. It got a pretty good review with comments like “The general standard of finish and construction is high: in fact 15 years on, she may well be stronger than many new boats on the market” and “I would fully expect a Moody 37 or 376 to be in just as good a condition structurally in another 15 years time”

Good luck with your search.
 

LadyJessie

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Captain_Cava is right: newer is not necessarily better. The Moody is indeed a good old proven design. It should also mean that you can go back looking at those "old" Najad's and HR's. Personally, I would always go for an "old" Najad before a new Ben/Jen. There are a lot of great boats there that have not even reached their middle ages. They will continue to give.

The thing to understand here is that a very well built boat that is well maintained will keep. This is not the auto industry.
 

alandee

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Hi. What do you term "Blue Water"? Are you really talking about doing the Atlantic circuit / ARC etc. or sailing down to the Med? If the later then either will be fine although I would go for an older heavier well found boat such as a HR352. If the former then spend the next year reading up on / looking at / talking to people about what a "Blue Water" boat really is. The amount of kit required to turn a production boat into a Blue Water liveaboard can add between 25% and 50% to the basic price. An older suitable boat will have most of this kit on already ie. wind vane,water maker, gen set, storm sails, tender/outboard, liferaft, comfortable matress, radar, navtex/weatherfax, spares of just about everything, etc.etc. the list goes on. We spent £80k on our second hand basic Beneteau and £25k on the kit to make life comfortable and as safe as possible. Although we love our boat we wish we had bought something much more solid with a "sea kindly motion". Good luck and enjoy spending lots of time searching for your "perfect" boat. You will be glad that you did. We will next time!
 

Sybarite

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See my post "The perfect cruising boat ?" on Scuttlebutt. I would also look at an Amel Sharki 39', Benéteau Evasion 37 , HR 381,

For longtime cruising IMHO avoid a lightweight.

John Tynan
 

Richard10002

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[ QUOTE ]
We are also on a budget (a bit more than yours) but the trouble we are finding is that a 376 is a really hard act to follow. For comfort, storage space, quality build, ease of handling etc etc we are struggling to find better, even at twice the price!

[/ QUOTE ]

What's your budget. During my search I saw a lot of M42s and 425s asking around £100K, and would have expected to pay around £90K. M44s seem to be hovering around a selling price of £115K to £125K, (there are quite a few asking much more than this, but they only seem to dissappear from the market, (assumed sold), when the asking prices get down to sub £130K.
 

Captain_Cava

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We looked at some M42's and immediately said this is the boat for us.....then we saw an M44 and said it has to be this. However, we still haven't found one that's right. We've seriously thought about two of them on the south coast, but neither have been looked after very well and one of them has run about 2700 engine hours, a bit of a worry as she is only 10/11 years old and we plan to keep our next boat for another 10 years. If you hear of a good one, please let me know. Meanwhile, I keep upping the budget. I'm going to have to do a reality check soon!
 

Richard10002

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You could make it known on the moa forum that you are looking.

I think you should get a reasonable one for around £120K, but might have to kiss a few frogs.

If 2700 hours is high, you have me worried - mine has over 4000!

My father owned Rogue from 2003 to 2006 and, from the moment I stepped on board, I knew what I wanted, I spent 3 years looking whilst getting the money together, and nothing swayed me away from an M44. I was about to go and look at one near Alicante, so called Jeff, (father), to ask for some advice and see if he wanted to come. He thought I was responding to his email saying that he had decided to sell. Talk about coincidence! Needless to say, after a bit of negotiating, we did the deal.

I'll keep my eyes and ears open.

Richard
 

Richard10002

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[ QUOTE ]
Should I buy something recent and relatively lightweight lik a Beneteau 38 or something older such as a Moody 376 with possibly a bit more beef and a skeg hung rudder? My main concern with an older boat is that at least some kit will also be 20 years out of date. I like the ide of a Najd or HR but you have to put up with something very well used for the money.

[/ QUOTE ]

Chris,

sorry to hijack the thread a bit. Looks like you might even get a Moody 42 from around 1990 for your budget.

They might be old, but they are definitely solid and tough. Even if they look good and pass a survey, some things will need fixing or replacing, and you will want to update some stuff, even if only to make it "your" boat, rather than the previous owners'.

having said that, many owners tend to keep up with technology, so most should have electronics etc. from within the past 5 years or so.

If your total budget is £85K, including any maintenance and updating, you should probably be looking at a purchase between £65K and £70K.

I spent 3 years considering the newer v older issue, and couldnt live with the apparent flimsiness of the newer cheaper boats.

Good Luck

Richard
 

jonic

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Hi Chris

I would be looking at Moody and Westerly and perhaps if you wanted a more modern French production style boat consider the Dufour Classic range of circa 2000. The 41 is well built, has good joinery and as the floors are glassed into the hull, and not into a moulded floorpan, as is now the case with most production boats, the boat has a good soild feel and is noticably stiffer underway.

Najads and HR's will be very well used, and smaller, at that price point.

You might get a tired(ish) 1995 Moody 38. A westerly Oceanranger would also be a good bet.

I have bluewater cruised a Westerly corsair and now have a Moody 38. I do love the Moody, but budget was about £110,000 with the refit. I chose a skeghung rudder after much thought, mainly because we ended up doing so much shallow water cruising in the Bahamas.

Good luck and I have sent you a PM.
 

Liz_I

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We have lived on board our M42 c/c ketch for 11 years. Solid, dependable wouldn't/couldn't find anything to replace her.
66 built; 12 of which were c/c. One word of warning. check the decks above & below the main & mizzen. Neither have proper support. A few will have been strenghend but worth mentioning to your surveyor!!
Good luck with your search & enjoy your travels.


Richard we are with you on the engine hours tally, it's frightening how it mounts up. Being in the Med doesn't help.
 

jonic

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[ QUOTE ]


If 2700 hours is high, you have me worried - mine has over 4000!

Richard

[/ QUOTE ]

Just run in Rich, Diesels like use under load. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 

Amari

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Also consider Wauquiez - blue chip French built, subsequently taken over by Beneteau. Our W. Pretorien 35 (1985) was circumnavigated by our predecessors. Workmen comment on her strong build. Reassuringly stiff in a blow (both wife and I are whimps). Some for sale on ybw.com brokerage site
 

chrism

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Thanks for all he advice so far.. I do mean bluewater .. hopefully a circumnavigation. I also know that everything is a compromise...I did the Atlntic circuit in 1981/2 in a Vega! How times change! Chris
 
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