Filling propane Gas Bottles?

[Ian_Edwards]

It is currently proving impossible to get my Calor 3.9kg propane bottles refilled.
I'm thinking about buying a larger Calor bottle and decanting gas into the 3.9.
I've read many of the threads on this and all the dire warning, most seem manageable, if you plan set the decanting process up carefully and weigh the receiving bottle as you fill it.
I'd stress that I don't really want to have to do this, but it is becoming a necessity.
No gas no hot food!
The gas locker on the boat is designed for two 3.9kg cylinders and is too small to take the 5kg patio gas cylinders.
I’m thinking of buying a 13kg cylinder as the donor.
Has anyone come across a company who will supply a 13kg to 3.9kg high pressure hose which is pressure tested?
I could make one up from the components, but buying one ready made reduces one of the risks.

 

[lustyd]

I wouldn't say you need to weigh it, it can't go over pressure in this scenario and it's a liquid you're transferring anyway so just let gravity do the work. There are hoses available online for the job, and given both bottles have taps anyway you'd be pretty well in control the whole time. Just take the obvious safety measures like big open space no sources of ignition etc. and check for leaks the whole time.

 

[Stork_III]

I believe the weighing is to ensure only 80% full of liquid, providing expansion gassing volume.

 

[Scotsailor]

Why not call Calor Gas and ask their advice?

 

[lustyd]

Why not call Calor Gas and ask their advice?

Because they will certainly tell the OP not to arse about trying to refill bottles with amateur equipment ? Then they'll explain how there's no stock because nobody is returning bottles. Then OP will return here with the same issue...

 

[Ian_Edwards]

Because they will certainly tell the OP not to arse about trying to refill bottles with amateur equipment ? Then they'll explain how there's no stock because nobody is returning bottles. Then OP will return here with the same issue...

Exactly, I've emailed Calor, and got a call from Calor Aberdeen, they don't have stock of propane 3.9kg, no idea when they will get stock, which is telling in its own right. "Shortage of cylinders", Covid 19, all the usual excuses. We've had covid restrictions for approximately 2 years now, it's time Calor faced reality and upped their game.
I'm currently researching an electric oven (doesn’t need to be gimbled), and a DIY gimbled hob, I have a 5kVA generator installed, so be able to get something going over the winter, and get rid of gas all together.
Any links to suppliers of an appropriate hose?
or
Suggestions for a search term, I've tried "Calor propane to propane high pressure hose" and similar term with an luck so far.

 

[lustyd]

upped their game.

literally all they need to do is a cylinder amnesty. I bet a lot of people would return them for free, but offer £10 to return them and problem solved.

I searched "Propane gas bottle to bottle" and got the below (not a recommendation, just an example). Not terribly high pressure in the context of other gas systems. I used to fill emergency cylinders for diving and that was 232 bar. For your application I'd open the empty first and control flow from the full one, if anything bad happens hold your breath and close the full one then the empty, then go elsewhere to breath. The empty bottle will warm slightly and the full one will cool but shouldn't be too drastic as the pressure change won't be great.

Stork was right about the weight, I hadn't considered that.

REFILL LPG BOTTLE,TRANSFER GAS,PROPANE CYLINDER POL SWIVEL LPG 2METRE PIPE | eBay

 

[prv]

Any links to suppliers of an appropriate hose?

Don't know about a ready-made one, but BES will sell whatever parts you need.

Pete

 

[Boater Sam]

Fill then at a service station with a gas pump? My neighbour pretends to have a gas powered car, fills them in the boot with an adaptor he bought off ebay. Propane weighs 500gm per litre of liquid.

 

[Bran]

There is another option, you can fill these at fuel stations, would need to check the local fuel stations are happy with it, also it expensive to buy the bottle. Size wise they will fit within the 3.9 kg size.
Gaslow 2.7KG Refillable LPG Cylinder No1

 

[PetiteFleur]

On ebay if you are near Walsall... from Tent hire direct - must have empty bottle.

 

[duncan99210]

It’s been a problem getting hold of Calor propane cylinders for some time. 6kg are in very short supply, you can’t buy (rent) a new one and need an empty one to get a refill (if you’re lucky). We bought a campervan earlier this year: it has space for 2 x 6kg cylinders, it came with just the one. Couldn’t source a new one, so bought a 3.9kg one as that was available. The 6kg ran out in Tyndrum, where we lucked in and got the last refill in stock. Since then we’ve been watching out for a replacement 3.9kg when that runs out: rarer than rocking horse droppings. Dunstaffinage chandlers had a sign in the window “no gas in stock, no local stock, in fact none in Scotland….”
It‘s a weird situation: the shortage of smaller cylinders is well know and has been ongoing for a year or more. I’ve no idea if FloGas or others are in the same state or not.
Refilling cylinders large to small is a frequent task for long term cruisers and easy enough to do. The BES kit is popular and works fine. Do monitor the weight of the cylinder being filled and don’t overfill it: you need the expansion space above the liquid for safe working and to avoid running liquid gas into the regulator.

 

[Caraway]

There is another option, you can fill these at fuel stations, would need to check the local fuel stations are happy with it, also it expensive to buy the bottle. Size wise they will fit within the 3.9 kg size.
Gaslow 2.7KG Refillable LPG Cylinder No1

That looks like a great and dependable idea.
My pastime sport has a variety of special off-road vehicles using mainly LPG power. They range from proper installations with removable custom gas tanks which can be filled at service stations like the bottle in your link to home-brewers filling camping bottles from inverted mother-ship bottles in their garages. The home-brewers have the simple expedient of having a hole in the receiver tank with a threaded bung. When the liquid propane escapes they pop the bung in and they are at 80% volume.
Don't ask how or contradict the science. They've been doing it for over 20 years and it works. As far as I know no-one has blown up their neighbourhood yet. (Altough one guy from Bingley ought to have done!)

 

[V1701]

How about (assuming you can get one) buying the bigger bottle, extending the hose and sitting it outside strapped to the pushpit or something? I use a combination oven/grill/microwave more than my gas cooker now and also have a thing called a Remoska, lakeland used to sell them, got mine 2nd hand off ebay. It's a bit like a mini electric oven, makes good curries and good for cooking sausages or roasting chicken thighs, e.g.

 

[harvey38]

I use a refillable Safefill bottle, lightweight and cheap as chip to refill at Morrisons or most independent LPG outlets.

 

[chrishscorp]

literally all they need to do is a cylinder amnesty. I bet a lot of people would return them for free, but offer £10 to return them and problem solved.

Calor have operated for the last 2 years at least an amnesty scheme at a rate of £7.50 a bottle, no questions asked, I have returned 5 so far. You can only return 3 per year. The problem is still yet to be solved.

 

[lustyd]

can you post a link with details of that? might be a good thing to socialise on various forums

 

[chrishscorp]

Returning a gas bottle? All you need to know here

Its all at the bottom of the page not easy to find, you would think they would put it on the front of the website in view of the issues they are having.

£7.50 a bottle max 5 per year without paperwork or a £10 voucher with Go Outdoors if taken to one of their stores...... would suggest phoning either local Calor centre or Go outdoors first to confirm.

 

[Ink]

How about (assuming you can get one) buying the bigger bottle, extending the hose and sitting it outside strapped to the pushpit or something? I use a combination oven/grill/microwave more than my gas cooker now and also have a thing called a Remoska, lakeland used to sell them, got mine 2nd hand off ebay. It's a bit like a mini electric oven, makes good curries and good for cooking sausages or roasting chicken thighs, e.g.

I'm assuming for use in a marina /shorepower only?

Ink

 

[Ink]

I use a refillable Safefill bottle, lightweight and cheap as chip to refill at Morrisons or most independent LPG outlets.

Have you a link for the Safefill bottle? Is it a direct replacement for the blue butane 4.5kg Calor bottle?

Thanks
Ink