Colinl
New member
Can anyone tell me the advantages of the Yeoman system over a Chartplotter
Thanks in advance
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Thanks in advance
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Yeoman or Chartplotter
- Thread starter Colinl
- Start date
philip_stevens
Active member
If the electronics go tits-up (even the Yeoman) you still have the marks of your last position on the Yeomans paper chart - or you should have. The chart plotter will be blank!!
I have both, and update the Yeoman every hour with a position mark, and also enter it into my log book - even if I can see land.
<hr width=100% size=1>regards,
Philip
I have both, and update the Yeoman every hour with a position mark, and also enter it into my log book - even if I can see land.
<hr width=100% size=1>regards,
Philip
ex-Gladys
Well-known member
I think the Yeoman is the ideal link between electronics and traditional nav, as said by other respondent
<hr width=100% size=1>Larry Botheras
Anderson 26 "Amber"
<hr width=100% size=1>Larry Botheras
Anderson 26 "Amber"
Robin
Well-known member
The Yeoman is an excellent device, highly underated IMO, we have one permanently fitted at the chart table, with the most used (Western English Channel) chart in place on it under a perspex cover that can be drawn on. Larger scale charts are clipped on top of the perspex as required, the clips held in place with blue tack. The Yeoman takes very little battery power, make sure the GPS which it will be used with can both send AND receive data to/from the Yeoman, so that waypoints can be loaded straight from the chart.
Chart plotters require the additional purchase of chart cartridges, which though expensive contain detail charts of the areas covered probably many more charts than you would buy if in paper chart format, you can therefore zoom right in to individual fingers on a marina pontoon. Position and other information is continuosly displayed on the chart, even shown as a boat shape pointing in the right direction, or it can be set up to display navigational & instrument data such as COG, SOG, BTW etc. Power consumption on small ones now is low at say 600ma (0.5A) but bigger ones can be double that.
We carry Yeoman for paper plotting plus a large B & W plotter at the chart table but now also have a small Navman 5500i colour plotter with integral GPS up top. On a small boat if money and power consumption were not the main consideration I would have both a Yeoman and a small plotter like the Navman.
<hr width=100% size=1><font size=1>Sermons from my pulpit are with tongue firmly in cheek and come with no warranty!</font size=1>
Chart plotters require the additional purchase of chart cartridges, which though expensive contain detail charts of the areas covered probably many more charts than you would buy if in paper chart format, you can therefore zoom right in to individual fingers on a marina pontoon. Position and other information is continuosly displayed on the chart, even shown as a boat shape pointing in the right direction, or it can be set up to display navigational & instrument data such as COG, SOG, BTW etc. Power consumption on small ones now is low at say 600ma (0.5A) but bigger ones can be double that.
We carry Yeoman for paper plotting plus a large B & W plotter at the chart table but now also have a small Navman 5500i colour plotter with integral GPS up top. On a small boat if money and power consumption were not the main consideration I would have both a Yeoman and a small plotter like the Navman.
<hr width=100% size=1><font size=1>Sermons from my pulpit are with tongue firmly in cheek and come with no warranty!</font size=1>
Marsupial
New member
Colin
I've had a yeoman sport since 1998, I think it is by far the best bit of plotting kit around, it works with any mercator chart or map anywhere in the world. Like all the other respondents I can reccommend this device.
I have two "Yeoman Sockets" around the boat, one at the navtable and one on deck in the cockpit, so I can navigate and take fixes without going below. I have found that the system works best with "simple" GPS systems like the Garmin 128, my present boat has a raymarine chart plotter - user friendly its not, more on that later perhaps - but it does OK with the Yeoman for positional info COG, SOG and Time to Go, it will also calculate distance and bearing to any pouint on the chart. it wont let me upload a waypoint into the plotter, the Garmin did.
The BIG PLUS - if the sparks give up you have an accurate last position on a paper chart.
The Next BIG PLUS - the sport model is portable from boat to boat, a four wire socket is all you leave behind.
Talk to John Hadfield at Precision Navigation - they have just bought YEOMAN (the company from Simrad), try www.precisionnavigation.co.uk or something like it!
Cheers
David
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I've had a yeoman sport since 1998, I think it is by far the best bit of plotting kit around, it works with any mercator chart or map anywhere in the world. Like all the other respondents I can reccommend this device.
I have two "Yeoman Sockets" around the boat, one at the navtable and one on deck in the cockpit, so I can navigate and take fixes without going below. I have found that the system works best with "simple" GPS systems like the Garmin 128, my present boat has a raymarine chart plotter - user friendly its not, more on that later perhaps - but it does OK with the Yeoman for positional info COG, SOG and Time to Go, it will also calculate distance and bearing to any pouint on the chart. it wont let me upload a waypoint into the plotter, the Garmin did.
The BIG PLUS - if the sparks give up you have an accurate last position on a paper chart.
The Next BIG PLUS - the sport model is portable from boat to boat, a four wire socket is all you leave behind.
Talk to John Hadfield at Precision Navigation - they have just bought YEOMAN (the company from Simrad), try www.precisionnavigation.co.uk or something like it!
Cheers
David
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philip_stevens
Active member
Robin,
You mention the 5500i. I have a 5500. You also mention about uploading from the Yeoman to the Chartplotter - have you found a way to do it from the Navman?? I cannot.
I contacted the Yeoman people, and they could not do it either. In fact, they had problems even getting the 5500 to talk to the Yeoman. Mine will send to the Yeoman, but I can't read anywhere (in the 5500 manual) about uploading waypoints into the 5500.
I also contacted Navman in Kiwiland about 2 weeks ago with this same point, but have not had a reply from them.
The 5500 is a good bit of kit though. Mine has just had to go back to Navimo (Plastimo) to have the software updated - to software version 1-5-6.
<hr width=100% size=1>regards,
Philip
You mention the 5500i. I have a 5500. You also mention about uploading from the Yeoman to the Chartplotter - have you found a way to do it from the Navman?? I cannot.
I contacted the Yeoman people, and they could not do it either. In fact, they had problems even getting the 5500 to talk to the Yeoman. Mine will send to the Yeoman, but I can't read anywhere (in the 5500 manual) about uploading waypoints into the 5500.
I also contacted Navman in Kiwiland about 2 weeks ago with this same point, but have not had a reply from them.
The 5500 is a good bit of kit though. Mine has just had to go back to Navimo (Plastimo) to have the software updated - to software version 1-5-6.
<hr width=100% size=1>regards,
Philip
Talbot
Active member
concur abt Navman 5500, a superlative piece of kit.
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Robin
Well-known member
Sorry Philip, our Navman is a total standalone, not connected to the instruments, pilot, radar or Yeoman, it is even on a separate battery bank. We run the Yeoman from a Shipmate GPS and our Raytheon plotter below runs from a separate again Raystar WAAS/EGNOS GPS. I didn't say I uploaded to the plotter, only to the GPS, in this case the Shipmate. In this instance the Shipmate is so user unfriendly I don't use it except as an engine to run the Yeoman and the DSC VHF, though I can upload WPTs from Yeoman to Shipmate easily enough straight into a route - doing that manually without the Yeoman requires a lot of time, not least thumbing though Shipmates manual!
Why would you actually need to load a waypoint from Yeoman to Navman plotter? I am wary about that since apart from not seeing a reason to, not all paper charts are yet on WGS84 datum, not least in my folio, and you would then have to remember to reset the plotter datums accordingly.
Why did your Navman need the software update?
Robin
<hr width=100% size=1><font size=1>Sermons from my pulpit are with tongue firmly in cheek and come with no warranty!</font size=1>
Why would you actually need to load a waypoint from Yeoman to Navman plotter? I am wary about that since apart from not seeing a reason to, not all paper charts are yet on WGS84 datum, not least in my folio, and you would then have to remember to reset the plotter datums accordingly.
Why did your Navman need the software update?
Robin
<hr width=100% size=1><font size=1>Sermons from my pulpit are with tongue firmly in cheek and come with no warranty!</font size=1>
Chris_Rayner
New member
Absolutely.
I have had a Yeoman for about 8 years. At first it was my sole electronic navigational system, interfaced with an early Garmin. A backup to my usual navigational practices of looking out the companionway hatch and seeing if I could see anything familiar. I used to sail in Chichester Harbour and the Solent more or less exclusively.
I thought it was a magic addition to the boat, and kept it but not the Garmin when I sold the boat and bought another boat with the aim of cruising further afield. The boat I bought, a Hunter Pilot 27, came with all singing all dancing Raytheon/marine radar chartplotter etc. etc. Nevertheless I bought a cheapo Garmin to interface with the Yeoman and wired it into the boat completely separately. I must say that the Raymarine stuff is brilliant, everything talking to everything else etc. I got the display, a black and white RL70 I think, updated to HSB2 specification as this adds MARPA to the radar, which seemed a worthwhile addition.
This summer we went foreign for the first time. Chichester Cherbourg. Very exciting. Maintained plots on both paper and electronically and recorded lat and long in the log at (minimum) hourly intervals. Down to Alderney with a RYA cruise (see elsewhere on this site) to Guernsey, Jersey and Iles Chausey. Reversed the route to get back. As we left St. Peter Port up the Little Russel my missus asked me what the Speed over ground was. So I pressed the relevant buttons on the plotter and was rewarded with a frozen screen. Shortly it switched itself off and restarted. From then on it wouldn't work. Vis was good, and the leading marks in the Little Russell were easy to follow, also there were several other boats on the same passage with greater draught than ours, so we tucked in and followed the traditional practices of using landmarks and bigger boats in front. The passage to Cherbourg via the Alderney Race was boringly uneventful and the return to Chichester was only remarkable for a squall in the race off St. Catherines when everything disappeared into the murk for a few minutes. The Yeoman was used for navigation throughout both passages with ease. If the battery had gone belly up then I would still have had me hand-bearing compass, paper charts and Breton Plotter.
Oi rests me case Oi duz.
Chris Rayner
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I have had a Yeoman for about 8 years. At first it was my sole electronic navigational system, interfaced with an early Garmin. A backup to my usual navigational practices of looking out the companionway hatch and seeing if I could see anything familiar. I used to sail in Chichester Harbour and the Solent more or less exclusively.
I thought it was a magic addition to the boat, and kept it but not the Garmin when I sold the boat and bought another boat with the aim of cruising further afield. The boat I bought, a Hunter Pilot 27, came with all singing all dancing Raytheon/marine radar chartplotter etc. etc. Nevertheless I bought a cheapo Garmin to interface with the Yeoman and wired it into the boat completely separately. I must say that the Raymarine stuff is brilliant, everything talking to everything else etc. I got the display, a black and white RL70 I think, updated to HSB2 specification as this adds MARPA to the radar, which seemed a worthwhile addition.
This summer we went foreign for the first time. Chichester Cherbourg. Very exciting. Maintained plots on both paper and electronically and recorded lat and long in the log at (minimum) hourly intervals. Down to Alderney with a RYA cruise (see elsewhere on this site) to Guernsey, Jersey and Iles Chausey. Reversed the route to get back. As we left St. Peter Port up the Little Russel my missus asked me what the Speed over ground was. So I pressed the relevant buttons on the plotter and was rewarded with a frozen screen. Shortly it switched itself off and restarted. From then on it wouldn't work. Vis was good, and the leading marks in the Little Russell were easy to follow, also there were several other boats on the same passage with greater draught than ours, so we tucked in and followed the traditional practices of using landmarks and bigger boats in front. The passage to Cherbourg via the Alderney Race was boringly uneventful and the return to Chichester was only remarkable for a squall in the race off St. Catherines when everything disappeared into the murk for a few minutes. The Yeoman was used for navigation throughout both passages with ease. If the battery had gone belly up then I would still have had me hand-bearing compass, paper charts and Breton Plotter.
Oi rests me case Oi duz.
Chris Rayner
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stevebirch2002
New member
Being an Electonics nut I love all the bits. I have a Garmin GPS (128 & III), A Yeoman, PC Charting software (SeaPro) and a Garmin Chart Plotter (2006 Bluechart). They all connect together via a socket system and all work well but I would never be without my Yeoman. Real charts but has the extra of GPS. A much underated bit of gear. My samll yacht (Vega 27) seems overloaded but it is part of the enjoyment.
<hr width=100% size=1>Albin Vega "Southern Comfort" V1703
<hr width=100% size=1>Albin Vega "Southern Comfort" V1703
duncan
Active member
At the slight risk of not completely agreeing ......I will start with the rested case!
Clearly an appropriate chart should be on board and used - in this context the marking of position will be made at time intervals appropriate for the waters being navigated.
Whilst a Yeoman interfaced with a GPS makes this easier (and therefore more reliable) it still relies on the GPS. Having the GPS battery powered goes some way to improve things but having 2 independent units, one of which is battery powered, probably represents the appropriate level of redundancy for most leisure craft.
However, accepting the reduced risk of error from an interfaced Yeoman, there is nothing to prevent you from plotting on your paper chart the position given from your GPS (plotter).
My observation is that Yeoman owners will do it all the time, cruising yatchtsmen will do it on passage and powerboaters, especially planning craft, probably the least.
However getting back to the original question Yeoman or chartplotter - if you have a good supply of charts, and an existing GPS unit, then the Yeoman would be a good investment. If you don't have a GPS and expect to spend your time in one cruising area then an integrated GPS Plotter (such as the Navman mentioned) would be ahead of the Yeoman in my list - especially as charts and smaller plotters have come down in price so much. However you should of course still transfer your position to the paper chart !
<hr width=100% size=1>madesco madidum ..../forums/images/icons/smile.gif
Clearly an appropriate chart should be on board and used - in this context the marking of position will be made at time intervals appropriate for the waters being navigated.
Whilst a Yeoman interfaced with a GPS makes this easier (and therefore more reliable) it still relies on the GPS. Having the GPS battery powered goes some way to improve things but having 2 independent units, one of which is battery powered, probably represents the appropriate level of redundancy for most leisure craft.
However, accepting the reduced risk of error from an interfaced Yeoman, there is nothing to prevent you from plotting on your paper chart the position given from your GPS (plotter).
My observation is that Yeoman owners will do it all the time, cruising yatchtsmen will do it on passage and powerboaters, especially planning craft, probably the least.
However getting back to the original question Yeoman or chartplotter - if you have a good supply of charts, and an existing GPS unit, then the Yeoman would be a good investment. If you don't have a GPS and expect to spend your time in one cruising area then an integrated GPS Plotter (such as the Navman mentioned) would be ahead of the Yeoman in my list - especially as charts and smaller plotters have come down in price so much. However you should of course still transfer your position to the paper chart !
<hr width=100% size=1>madesco madidum ..../forums/images/icons/smile.gif
Chris_Rayner
New member
Restless case
Hard to disagree with that. My point is that you need to use paper charts as even the best electronic kit may pack up leaving you all at sea. I fear that the migration to all electronic solutions for leisure navigation may leave others in the position I found myself in without the fallback of paper charts. I wish the Yeoman were a little cheaper, as then the argument would not need to be made, but at least if it fails you have a decent chart. Trying to read a CD ROM or C-Map chip without electricity. Also if I'd been getting the position from the Raymarine GPS I would have been out of luck as it wasn't telling me. Small handhelds are so cheap nowadays that there is no point in not having one. The Yeoman of course needs 12v to drive it, and if properly interfaced this will also run the handheld GPS. If you lose 12v then you're down to pencells or whatever for the GPS and pencils to put it on the chart. Next stop down handbearing compass and sextant. Does anyone carry RDF any more?
Incidentally I have spoken to Raymarine since I took the plotter in for their assessment. Apparently I had version 4.9 of the software which is known to fail sometimes on that unit, they've upgraded it to 4.10. Wish they'd told me or issued a notice to Raymariners or something. If I'd been in fog in the shipping lanes when it failed I'd've been mightily pissed off. They have waived any charge for upgrading. Only reasonable it seems to me.
Chris Rayner
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Hard to disagree with that. My point is that you need to use paper charts as even the best electronic kit may pack up leaving you all at sea. I fear that the migration to all electronic solutions for leisure navigation may leave others in the position I found myself in without the fallback of paper charts. I wish the Yeoman were a little cheaper, as then the argument would not need to be made, but at least if it fails you have a decent chart. Trying to read a CD ROM or C-Map chip without electricity. Also if I'd been getting the position from the Raymarine GPS I would have been out of luck as it wasn't telling me. Small handhelds are so cheap nowadays that there is no point in not having one. The Yeoman of course needs 12v to drive it, and if properly interfaced this will also run the handheld GPS. If you lose 12v then you're down to pencells or whatever for the GPS and pencils to put it on the chart. Next stop down handbearing compass and sextant. Does anyone carry RDF any more?
Incidentally I have spoken to Raymarine since I took the plotter in for their assessment. Apparently I had version 4.9 of the software which is known to fail sometimes on that unit, they've upgraded it to 4.10. Wish they'd told me or issued a notice to Raymariners or something. If I'd been in fog in the shipping lanes when it failed I'd've been mightily pissed off. They have waived any charge for upgrading. Only reasonable it seems to me.
Chris Rayner
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johna
New member
<my present boat has a raymarine chart plotter - user friendly its not,>
David
I have a Raymarine 520 at the chart table and a Raymarine combined radar/plotter in the cockpit. In what way do you find the plotters are not user friendly?
john
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David
I have a Raymarine 520 at the chart table and a Raymarine combined radar/plotter in the cockpit. In what way do you find the plotters are not user friendly?
john
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ChrisE
Active member
I have a Yeoman for sale
See the For Sale board
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See the For Sale board
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philip_stevens
Active member
The system would randomly freeze, whereby I would have to remove power from it by tripping the circuit breaker. Powering up again, and all was OK.
The other problem was that it was not reading all the info on buoys and lighthouses, etc properly. It would omit the first letter of any item. eg, Can Buoy would read as "an ouy".
I contacted Navman Kiwiland, who bounced it to Plastimo France, who bounced it to Navimo UK, who said send it back for an update to the software.
I don't really need or want to upload from the Yeoman to the 5500, it was just an exercise to see if it would work. Apparently not.
<hr width=100% size=1>regards,
Philip
The other problem was that it was not reading all the info on buoys and lighthouses, etc properly. It would omit the first letter of any item. eg, Can Buoy would read as "an ouy".
I contacted Navman Kiwiland, who bounced it to Plastimo France, who bounced it to Navimo UK, who said send it back for an update to the software.
I don't really need or want to upload from the Yeoman to the 5500, it was just an exercise to see if it would work. Apparently not.
<hr width=100% size=1>regards,
Philip
jon
New member
The Yeoman is excellent, especially avoiding rocks around the Isles of Scilly!
Word of warning about buying second hand, they can go wrong.
I noticed my Sport was not as accurate as when I purchased it, as much as 10mm out. The resolution should be 2mm, or the diameter of the plotting hole in the mouse.
I took mine to Tinley Electronics in Lymington who found the mat to be inaccurate, they replaced it with a re-conditioned unit, replaced the battery, upgraded the charts and software, cost £135!
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Word of warning about buying second hand, they can go wrong.
I noticed my Sport was not as accurate as when I purchased it, as much as 10mm out. The resolution should be 2mm, or the diameter of the plotting hole in the mouse.
I took mine to Tinley Electronics in Lymington who found the mat to be inaccurate, they replaced it with a re-conditioned unit, replaced the battery, upgraded the charts and software, cost £135!
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pb2004
New member
Having just returned from Channel Islands cruise with just partner on board its important to consider just how simple the Yeoman is.
She can plot our position, note the lat long in the log and plot it on a standard UKHO/Stanfords Chart. It offers piece of mind especially as the crew can see visually the CMG over the ground and begin to appreciate the strong tidal affects by comparing true course steered and COG which in the Yeomans case is so easy to visualise.
Long life the Yeoman
Pete
<hr width=100% size=1>partner in 33 footer sloop based at Chichester.Coastal skipper.
She can plot our position, note the lat long in the log and plot it on a standard UKHO/Stanfords Chart. It offers piece of mind especially as the crew can see visually the CMG over the ground and begin to appreciate the strong tidal affects by comparing true course steered and COG which in the Yeomans case is so easy to visualise.
Long life the Yeoman
Pete
<hr width=100% size=1>partner in 33 footer sloop based at Chichester.Coastal skipper.