Yacht ownership in Edinburgh

mcanderson

mcanderson

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My wife and I are seriously considering buying a 35 ft (ish) yacht for the two of us and keeping it at Port Edgar.

My questions are numerious but to start off:

1. What is the sailing like in the Forth? I realise the West Coast is more popular, but I don't fancy a 2 hour drive to go sailing.

2. How are the facilities at Port Edgar? I have gone for a wander down and they look basic, but clean and not to hard to find a berth.

3. Any one know when construction on the new Granton Marina is likely to start?

4. How are the other smaller ports in the Forth for overnight stays?

Thanks for any replies.

McA
 
Hi McA

Though I work during the week in Edinburgh, I live on the Clyde.

I used to keep my Laser at Port Edgar and found it a great facility but getting there is not always easy. My idea was that I could nip down there after work and get some sailing in the summer evenings. However traffic can be bad and it would often take over an hour so I eventually moved my Laser home to the Clyde.

I found the Forth "OK" for sailing but that was all. You note that the West Coast is more popular but consider this...... around one hours travel to an "OK" sailing location or two hours travel to a world class location.

Even without leaving the Clyde you have some superb, relatively sheltered sailing waters that will keep you happy for years then it is a short hop thorough the Crinan Canal or round Mull of Kintyre and you are on the West Coast proper.

Just my tuppence worth

Regards
Cameron
 
[ QUOTE ]
My wife and I are seriously considering buying a 35 ft (ish) yacht for the two of us and keeping it at Port Edgar.

My questions are numerious but to start off:

1. What is the sailing like in the Forth? I realise the West Coast is more popular, but I don't fancy a 2 hour drive to go sailing.

[/ QUOTE ]
Dear McA
You can have a lot of fun sailing in the Forth. Forgive me if I have misread your text but I speculate that you don't have very extensive experience? If that is the case you will learn a great deal from sailing on the Forth. The tides are significant and there's plenty of opportunity to put pilotage and collision avoidance into practice.
[ QUOTE ]
2. How are the facilities at Port Edgar? I have gone for a wander down and they look basic, but clean and not to hard to find a berth.

[/ QUOTE ] Port Edgar is OK. There are plans to redevelop some aspects so there will be some nice new buildings appearing over the next year or two. As to berth availability you need to apply and you will go on a waiting list but they seem to be able to accommodate most of the demand.

[ QUOTE ]
3. Any one know when construction on the new Granton Marina is likely to start?

[/ QUOTE ]
No idea. No doubt someone will be along soon to tell us.
[ QUOTE ]
4. How are the other smaller ports in the Forth for overnight stays?
Thanks for any replies.

McA

[/ QUOTE ]
The main question is whether the boat can take the ground. There are quite a few places worth visiting in the Forth but remember the prevailing wind is from the W and combined with significant tides the sail back from say Dunbar or Anstruther can be a bit of a long slog but if you are willing to do that there's quite a bit of cruising potential. There are also quite a few pleasant anchorages if you can't or don't want to spend a night sitting on your keel.

You are welcome. If you would like to come for a sail before you spend loads of money on a boat PM me and I'll see you in April.
 
Hi there,
.....and another twopennuth.....
Get the boat and if you don't like the first choice of cruising areas, move it.
I would chose the west as, while not necessarily closest from an 'evening jolly', for me it would be far better for the weekend.
 
1. What is the sailing like in the Forth?

You've been told about the tides, the shipping - I'll add the mud - one annoying feature of which is the grey deposit on the loo bowl. Cruising is what you want to make of it, but not many places where you can drop anchor and go to a pub. Racing at Port Edgar is keen and with the tides and short course legs boat handling skills get a work-out. Lots of seals and birds, occasional dolphins and whales - a small pod of Orca stirred up the seals a tad last winter but not returned.

2. How are the facilities at Port Edgar?

Antiquated but, as has been said, there are improvement plans (can't remember when there weren't!) but they have slipped continuously since the last fanfared unveiling. One problem is mud - the navy dredged the whole harbour to 3m below chart datum when they were there but years of minimal maintenance mean the pontoons are aground at low springs and boats, depending on berth and draft, can be well and truly stuck. There is some dredging going on. PEYC are a very friendly bunch (particularly for Edinburgh). Marina will hum and haw about berth availability and suggest you should take out a year's contract, just to be sure. I have no knowledge of anyone being turned away.

3. Any one know when construction on the new Granton Marina is likely to start?

Nope and there's not much movement at Bo'ness either.

4. How are the other smaller ports in the Forth for overnight stays?

Others have answered that.

If your intended boat has a draft around 1.5m, there is the Forth/Clyde canal - BW say 1.8m, but they are lying barstewards - takes 2 days and you're on the west coast - makes a fortnight's cruise very possible (and the canal is cheap as chips).

However after all that, I kept my boat at PE for all 2006, spent April - Sept 2007 in the west, and returned for the autumn/winter race series at PE, and am heading off again at the end of March. I seem to day sail on the Forth but cruise on the west coast.
 
The sailing on the Clyde about 1000 times better than the Forth.......take the 90 minute or less drive over to Troon and really enjoy the sailing.....the Clyde and the West coast offer the best sailing in the world!!!
Paul.
 
We're about 2¼ hours from our mooring, and about a ½ hour from Port Edgar. Each to their own, but I could never see us swapping the excellence of sailing in the west for the convenience of Port Edgar.

I know that the Forth has its aficionados, particularly for dinghy and daysailing, but, for the life of me, I just cannot see its attractions in comparison to the west. The paucity of decent interesting anchorages is a big turn off. I accept that the Fife harbours are delightful wee places, but they're pretty shallow, or dry out, which kind of restricts your access, and probably your choice of boat.

I'd be interested in the views of cruising sailors on the Forth, but, sorry, it wouldn't be for me..
 
[ QUOTE ]

I would chose the west as, while not necessarily closest from an 'evening jolly', for me it would be far better for the weekend.

[/ QUOTE ] Another thought. Friends of friends moved their boat from the Forth to somewhere on the West coast a couple of years ago, but have now put the boat up for sale. Ther reason being that they feel obliged to go to the boat every weekend (otherwise why have it?) and when they do go, much of their time is spent doing the kind of maintenance that easily fits around evenings and daysails when the boat is close at hand but is not so easy or convenient when what you really want to do is spend your precious weekend sailing.
 
I've sailed extensively on both the Forth and Clyde, both are lovely, but the Clyde wins hands down. On the Forth a dinghy or dayboat will be sufficient to see everywhere, a 35 footer will be a liability, unless you just want to race locally. In addition Port Edgar is not quite a world class marina, it is open to swell, has strong tides and is run down.
 
Well, I learned to sail from Granton in the Forth (admittedly 25 years ago!). I work 2 minutes from Port Edgar and it takes me 2 hours to get to my boat on the west coast. Would I swap my boat's location? Not in a million years.
 
I bought my boat in Ipswich. Before signing on the dotted line I phoned Port Edgar and asked for a quote. thinking it would be great to have the boat close at hand. "Hold on - I'll call you back" she said, and did. Confirmed the dates, size of boat etc and gave me a price. I gulped and went ahead and purchased. The following weekend, went in to the marina office. "I'm here to confirm my booking" I said. "What booking?" she said. "I called you last week about it" I said. "Oh yes, I remember" she said. "I thought you were just comparing prices. We don't have any room. We can put you on the waiting list for next year".
I felt like a pilot who had taken off and been told his wheels have fallen off!.
I now keep the boat South of Oban - and wouldn't change the location for the world. Yes, the commute is a bit of a pain, but the scenery is wonderful and the sailing is fantastic.
Port Edgar is tatty in the extreme. They have been talking of upgrading it since I was a boy but I wouldn't hold my breath. It's about to become a building site with the new bridge. You will see there are very few boats over 30 foot there. Depending on the weight of your 35 footer, it may be too much for the yard crane which means you would have to hire one in for lifting out. It's not even cheap.
Having said that, I was brought up racing out of Granton. I always used to think the Forth was ghastly for cruising - until I came into the Forth on the Superfast Ferry from Zeebrugge. It looked fantastic - lots of islands and wonderful views on both sides.
Whatever you decide, good luck.
 
[ QUOTE ]
4. How are the other smaller ports in the Forth for overnight stays?

Thanks for any replies.

McA

[/ QUOTE ]

If you are going to enjoy going places in the Forth, you have to be able to take the ground, and you don't want to have too big a boat. I have a small boat which my family have been sailing round the firth for 70 years or so. about 20 years ago I decided that we should visit a harbour every year that the boat had never been to before, and we have managed it so far. This suggests that in a small boat with a little imagination, you can find some interesting adventure in the place. Not so good though if you are a marina hopper or you need to stay afloat. Your options become distincly limited. Before you buy the boat spend a few quid on the east coast of Scotland pilot from Forth Yacht Clubs Association to see the sort of places you can go.

I live 5 minutes from the boat and take full advantage of the 5 hours of summer sailing that is available in the evenings when I get home from work. I never seem to have a problem borrowing a boat or acting as crew in the west when I fancy it.

Horses for courses, and I live down at the sandy bit. Don't think I would be quite so enthusiastic about Port Edgar mud.

Good luck

R
 
Dont know much about the Forth, but the previous owner of my boat lives in Doncaster, a 4 hour drive away, and kept it on the Clyde, along with many many others from along the East coast, Does that not tell you something?
Good luck.
 
[ QUOTE ]
You will see there are very few boats over 30 foot there. Depending on the weight of your 35 footer, it may be too much for the yard crane which means you would have to hire one in for lifting out. It's not even cheap.

[/ QUOTE ]

The number of boats over 30' is increasing. My Contessa has been demoted from the "fast" fleet thanks to the number of 30'+ AWBs and there have even been 2 flight starts, i.e. > 18 boats.
The yard crane is limited to ~4.5tons - just lifted me out today - but the yard organises a mobile crane at the same sort of price (only since Apr '07) and even throws in a free(?) lift if you're on a yearly contract.

I'm not trying to promote the place - compared to modern marinas it's a slum - but as a place to access your boat from Edinburgh (~30mins cycle and avoid the Bridge traffic) and then get away from, it's no too bad. .... but I'm still going west at the end of March.
 
[ QUOTE ]
"I'm here to confirm my booking" I said. "What booking?" she said. "I called you last week about it" I said. "Oh yes, I remember" she said. "I thought you were just comparing prices. We don't have any room. We can put you on the waiting list for next year".
I felt like a pilot who had taken off and been told his wheels have fallen off!.


[/ QUOTE ]
Unfortunate. However it's often said that it takes two to communicate. I imagine two conversations - one that went on in your head where you asked about price and availability, said that sounds fine I would like to book a berth to which the other person said certainly sir I'll just take some detials. The other conversation was the one you actually had where you asked about prices and said thanks very much and hung up....

[ QUOTE ]

Port Edgar is tatty in the extreme. They have been talking of upgrading it since I was a boy but I wouldn't hold my breath. It's about to become a building site with the new bridge. You will see there are very few boats over 30 foot there. Depending on the weight of your 35 footer, it may be too much for the yard crane which means you would have to hire one in for lifting out. It's not even cheap.


[/ QUOTE ]
Well I'm not an apologist for Edinburgh Leisure either but if you had been there recently you would see that the average size of boats is now probably about 30'. Cheap is relative and depends where you are etc etc. I think it's good value.
 
Ans1. The sailing is v good. It is as good as the Solent but uncrowded. (spoiled Scots always refer to the fantastic west coast) If you have a fin keeler you will quickly brush up on your drying-out-against-a-wall skill. Most of the islands offer shelter at anchor. Most islands can be explored. Isle of May (Kirkhaven) can be entered occasionally when seas and weather permit. This nature reserve is fascinating. The more hostile Bass Rock is awesome to sail close-to. Most harbours are drying, think about: Brucehaven, Cramond, Aberdour, Dysart, Fisherrow, Elie (note. Tell ‘em you are 28 foot), St Monance, Anstruther, Dunbar and Crail.

2. Port Edgar is old fashioned but fine. Club bar, café, chandler, supermarket and restaurants in S Queensferry 0.5M.

4. All the abovementioned ports are ok for an overnight. Dunno about Kirkcaldy. Two other grot places I will mention because of the kindness of the locals. Grangemouth – you will sink into bottomless mud alongside your pontoon - The clubmember’s are great. Methil, I once put in there when I was in trouble as my wife was unwell – the motorboat boys couldn’t do enough for us eg. ‘don’t worry about your boat, I’ll look after it. Take my gate key and get yourselves to the doc.’

Conclusion. Give the Forth a try for a season.
 
Hi,
My Hanse 311 Laura Katie is at Port Edgar and has been there for past 4 years.
For the costs the facilities are good and staff there are always helpfull.
Good chandlers as well as electronics and marine engineers on the site are very good.

Sailing is reasonable and gets better as you head East out of the Forth. Worst part is to clear the bridges and then it opens up well. Few real hazards and local knowledge is easy to aquire.
Marina berths are reasonable though condition of pontoons is only fair. Crane on site is old but good for upto about 4.5 tons or its a mobile crane.
I pay about £1200 per annum for my Hanse.
Incidently she is now up for sale and maybsuitb your requirements.
She is just out of the water and on her cradle at Port Edgar.
see details on this site under private boats for sale.
Any questions then e-mail me.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Ans1. The sailing is v good. It is as good as the Solent

[/ QUOTE ]

My sympathy for the poor benighted southerners knows no bounds. Is the Solent really that good?

Here's 2 wee pictures of my boat racing - which do you think I enjoyed most?

mickery2.jpg


P6300020.jpg


Thanks to the photographers.
 
Both pics look equally grey and drab. But if forced to choose I'd say you enjoyed the Scottish venue more cos the competition was weaker and you appear to be close to the front of the fleet. Whereas down south the competition was stiffer you were coming 3rd out of 3 in this pic. So obviously less enjoyable.
 
Nope, not down south - the buildings in the first pic are part of the gentrification of Leith docks. The other is the north end of the Sound of Mull.

... and that was the start of the race and I was in pole position!
 
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