Would you buy a raspberry Pi based multiplexor/datalogger if it was easy?

[GHA]

Morning campers. I've been fiddling with my Pi PLC design past little while & thought it would be nice to spread the love a bit. Pi's get mentioned on here now and then, but I think most people think it's just s step too far into geekyland and is difficult to do. So thinking is.. there's a great company called jlcpcb and sister company easyeda. Easyade have a good online circuit design resource, yu draw up the board then jlcpcb builds it with components soldered on and sticks it in the post. So, design a board so anyone can click & buy. They do surface mount and through hole plus 3d printing so should provide a one stop shop, in the post a little box and you add a Pi zero. (which are like hens teeth atm but that will change.) Shouldn't cost much, min order is 5 boards

What it will do is take pretty much any data you can get to it, send it out again over wifi or usb, record to a database so you can see changes in wind, speed, whatever. Gold dust that is. It can do soo much more.

It would be useful just to get an idea if anyone actally would be interested, and would need to be as simple to get going as possible.

I really think openplotter/signalk is such a powerful tool for a boat and would be so much more popular if there was an easy way in and if the fear of the unknown amongst less techy sailors was less, so a little effort to bring it all within easier reach of the masses can only be a good thing.

Anyone interested feel free to come over to discord for a chat, techy threads on here tend to veer off into personal opinions so quick these days on here, not the best place to discuss anymore sadly. Doubt if I'll be in here much.

Join the Raspberry Pi boat monitoring Discord Server!

Ideas for inputs / outputs. Forgot to add 24v/12v power, switches & digital inputs for when bilge pumps etc are running.

https://imgur.com/mlSIwJ9

And very good YT channel

 

[Stingo]

Does "GHA" stand for Geek Here Alert?

Asking for a friend

 

[GHA]

Does "GHA" stand for Geek Here Alert?

Asking for a friend

Generally helpful attitude, think you'll find ?

 

[GHA]

Interesting. Signalk can do pretty much anything with data. One thing mine does is record the distance from the GPS of every class a and class b target coming in to a database, gold dust for antenna tweaking. And changes constantly.
So in heavy rain today max distance for class b is really short with no class a at all. Oh look, rain must diminish propagation distance. Well l sort of. Quick look at marine traffic and the class a fishing boats that are normally out there must be tucked up in port. Shipping lanes are about 30Nm out which will easily be picked up on a warm sunny day. Not today.
Few class b about either.

Reality is in the data ?
Plotting really opens the doors to see small trends and blips no way would anyone pick up just looking at numbers on a display.
Can be done cheaply with a pi zero

 

[ylop]

I have a pi on board (running openlotter/SignalK/openCPN). It’s not my first encounter with a Pi so I’m not your target demographic. However, I’m pretty sure you are totally missing the point. IMHO Either people enjoy the geeking/fiddling and incredible flexibility that the current situation offers OR they want a ready made solution from a reputable supplier with good support, clear instruction, a warranty, a helpline to call, etc. a solution that lets you connect some bits to some otherbits you have to buy separately and then download/install software yourself is not really a solution to the reticent pi user.

As an actual pi user a standard interface board might be helpful, but I’ve got Seatalk1, NMEA0183 and some USB stuff as well as a DaisyHat. I don’t have any nmea2000, or a victron so don’t want to pay extra for that functionality. I have some cheap1 wire temp sensors to add, and might add engine tachometer (but you probably aren’t going to have a trivial plug and play solutions for that - my engine is mainstream but old school). I’d like to add battery monitoring and tank levels but the hard bit seems to be understanding what I already have and interfacing with it not the physical connections to a pi.

you are proposing an E paper display and I might have gone that way if there was a bundled kit but I’ve got a long thin display because It would fit nicely in a space I had, and being colour, touchscreen etc gave me other options.

now about this gold dust you promise. I’ve got all my data in SignalK and use it real time for repeaters etc (longer term plan to go PyPilot!) but I could link easily to MongoDB atlas or similar. but why? What am I going to do with GB of wind speed, heading, tank level, temp data etc? If I as a geek who plays with tech for a living hasn’t got an obvious use then I don’t see the reluctant pi adopters wanting to track data?

Are you just trying to find a fun thing to do that might be useful? Or are you hoping to create a little business? If the former it’s often struck me that “HATs” are kind of all or nothing. They occupy the entire GPIO header often really only for three or four wires actually being used. A mini hat (a beret perhaps!) that used just a few pins and provided sensible connectors might actually be useful. All the better if they had 4k7 pull ups or optical isolation built in. I’m thinking aloud here and it may be the pattern of the pins isn’t actually useful to have gpio + 5v + gnd all in a Lego brick style you could move along the header and add another one beside when you need to. Bearing in mind how cheap breakouts are you’d not be getting rich even if it works.

 

[[194224]]

.......................
So in heavy rain today max distance for class b is really short with no class a at all.
.............

Given that class A transmitter power is higher than that of a class B device I don't understand why, under any meteorological conditions, class A would not be received but class B might be. I'm happy for my misunderstanding to be corrected though.

 

[Refueler]

I find this a hard one to consider as everyone has their idea of what they want.

I have a Multiplexor ... cost me about 50 euros incl shipping. WiFi2NMEA (eBay seller ,... he now offers the WiFi4NMEA unit )..... the only item it does not have - NMEA2000.

No programming needed ... I just connected gear and it outputs WiFi and USB as well as NMEA0183. I accept that being 0183 and only the 2 version - I will not have temp .. fuel gauge ... wind etc integrated, but really at end of day - do I want a screen populated by so many boxes ? I sit at helm and glance down at fuel gauge ... I glance up at wind indicator ... I feel cold or warm .... my Tablet and plotter have AIS / GPS with all the relevant data of speed, dist run, DTG, BRG, position, time and battery voltage ............

Not knocking Rpi or setups with all the data etc. It comes down to what a person wants.

 

[GHA]

Given that class A transmitter power is higher than that of a class B device I don't understand why, under any meteorological conditions, class A would not be received but class B might be. I'm happy for my misunderstanding to be corrected though.

Maybe wasn't very clear but the post was meant to point out why it's dangerous to leap to conclusions without digging deeper. No class a was received cos the fishing boat traffic that's usually out there stayed at home today.
Though ducting is interesting when it warms up. From plotting the data it turns on and off very quickly. From 15 miles to 500 in minutes.

 

[[194224]]

Ah thanks, I hadn't realised that fishermen don't go out when it's raining.

 

[Refueler]

Ah thanks, I hadn't realised that fishermen don't go out when it's raining.

But they never stop fishing even alongside !!

 

[st599]

One item that is missing with Raspberry Pi is a safe shutdown routine. Fine if you always send sudo shutdown -h now, but on a boat that has multiple users, many just yank the power which can corrupt the SD Card.

Would love a little battery board that recognised power loss and initiated an immediate safe shutdown.

 

[ylop]

No programming needed ...

Refueler - I'm pretty much in agreement with you, but I think this is worth highlighting for anyone considering a RPi approach. OpenPlotter requires zero programming to do all that is described - at most you turn on some features, but no need to write any code etc.

I just connected gear and it outputs WiFi and USB as well as NMEA0183.

one feature that the OpenPlotter community doesn't make much noise about (and which I think is a useful thing worth highlighting) is that it can be configured to act as a repeater for wifi. So arrive in marina - connect the pi to the wifi, now everyone on the boat (who has access to the pi's network) has access to the internet - much simpler than connecting everyone's device separately.

I accept that being 0183 and only the 2 version

I think that is a headache GHA would continually have. Whichever interfaces he supports today, next month someone will want something new. Next year someone will have another stupid standard and his boards are out of date.

- I will not have temp .. fuel gauge ... wind etc integrated, but really at end of day - do I want a screen populated by so many boxes ? I sit at helm and glance down at fuel gauge ... I glance up at wind indicator... I feel cold or warm .... my Tablet and plotter have AIS / GPS with all the relevant data of speed, dist run, DTG, BRG, position, time and battery voltage ............

you are absolutely right that adding screen clutter is not useful, however whilst it seems lazy I can see the benefit to be able to check the fuel level without opening the companionway, going up to the cockpit and removing the binacle cover (and I always seem to want to consult it / engine hrs at the end of the day just after the crew have helpfully put it all away). My battery voltages are the otherway round - they are displayed at the chart table - and it might be useful to see if its worth running the engine for an hour to give them a boost. At the helm, its awkwardly positioned below my knees. It can be useful to compare actual windspeed/direction to forecast before leaving anchorage, similarly seeing depth, GPS etc can be reassuring that you are not dragging. In terms of temperature its not been the air temp that interested me but engine room or exhaust temp.

Not knocking Rpi or setups with all the data etc. It comes down to what a person wants.

I do think if someone wants a data logging solution based on a pi - its already available. Perhaps some better tutorials would be good - but there's no money to be made selling tutorials rather than circuit boards!

 

[ylop]

One item that is missing with Raspberry Pi is a safe shutdown routine. Fine if you always send sudo shutdown -h now, but on a boat that has multiple users, many just yank the power which can corrupt the SD Card.

Would love a little battery board that recognised power loss and initiated an immediate safe shutdown.

That's a good point. I've wired a switch to a GPIO pin to initiate a shutdown, but a little UPS that managed it for you would be nice (I think I say a price for one which was more than the rest of my pi bits put together!)

 

[ylop]

Oh and @GHA -- even as a geek I don't use discord. If you are looking for people who want pi functionality but don't want to set up a pi - I think you've probably picked the wrong platform.

 

[GHA]

Ah thanks, I hadn't realised that fishermen don't go out when it's raining.

Pretty gusty though. Important thing imho is keep looking and keep an open mind.

 

[Refueler]

Refueler - I'm pretty much in agreement with you, but I think this is worth highlighting for anyone considering a RPi approach. OpenPlotter requires zero programming to do all that is described - at most you turn on some features, but no need to write any code etc.

When you say Open Plotter ... are you referring to OpenCPN ? I have OpenCPN - its great for what its designed for.

one feature that the OpenPlotter community doesn't make much noise about (and which I think is a useful thing worth highlighting) is that it can be configured to act as a repeater for wifi. So arrive in marina - connect the pi to the wifi, now everyone on the boat (who has access to the pi's network) has access to the internet - much simpler than connecting everyone's device separately.

The WiFi2NMEA also acts as a repeater for any WiFi it picks up - you just tell it the Password and it will literally act as a router.

I think that is a headache GHA would continually have. Whichever interfaces he supports today, next month someone will want something new. Next year someone will have another stupid standard and his boards are out of date.

But that is way with electronics ... buy a computer today and tomorrow there's a better one. I bought the WiFI2NMEA and within a matter of few weeks WiFi4NMEA was offered. No good crying about my choice ...

you are absolutely right that adding screen clutter is not useful, however whilst it seems lazy I can see the benefit to be able to check the fuel level without opening the companionway, going up to the cockpit and removing the binacle cover (and I always seem to want to consult it / engine hrs at the end of the day just after the crew have helpfully put it all away). My battery voltages are the otherway round - they are displayed at the chart table - and it might be useful to see if its worth running the engine for an hour to give them a boost. At the helm, its awkwardly positioned below my knees. It can be useful to compare actual windspeed/direction to forecast before leaving anchorage, similarly seeing depth, GPS etc can be reassuring that you are not dragging. In terms of temperature its not been the air temp that interested me but engine room or exhaust temp.

I have a panel just inside that has an A .. Off ... B battery switch and meter .... so I can check each battery ... but agreed - it might be handy to be able to check without head in the companionway.
But I have a 25ft motorsailer - so limited space to add gear.

I do think if someone wants a data logging solution based on a pi - its already available. Perhaps some better tutorials would be good - but there's no money to be made selling tutorials rather than circuit boards!

Pal of mine is heavily into Arduino and Rpi gear ... if I was to delve this way - he would be a constant companion !!

 

[ylop]

When you say Open Plotter ... are you referring to OpenCPN ? I have OpenCPN - its great for what its designed for.

OpenPlotter (and apologies to the OpenPlotter afficianado's I am about to offend with my description!) is a family of software that has all been configured to play nice together and be really easy to install on a Raspberry Pi to provide various functions. It included:

- the OpenPlotter Operating System - which is a version of Linux adapted from the standard Raspian OS to make users' life easier and lend itself to boat stuff with minimal knowledge.
- OpenCPN (which you know) is a chartplotter / planning software
- SignalK - which is in simple terms a way of bringing together lots of different data sources into one place and passing on the relevant bits to other places (like OpenCPN)
- NodeRed, Graphana, KIP and other display / graphing packages to show your data either on the PI's own display or do any mobile device connected to the Pi.
- PyPilot - an opensource autopilot controller

In essence its the software part of what GHA is describing. You still need to do the hardware part of wiring a pi to the sensors etc which I think is what he was proposing.

 

[Refueler]

Tks 'ylop' for the details ....

I think I may not be only one wondering about that .... there are so many 'Open xxxxx' apps / items out there - sometimes its nice to understand what is being referred to.

Cheers

 

[Sandy]

I prefer to go sailing. There is enough work with boat maintenance not to go down this particular rabbit hole.

 

[GHA]

However, I’m pretty sure you are totally missing the point. IMHO Either people enjoy the geeking/fiddling and incredible flexibility that the current situation offers OR they want a ready made solution from a reputable supplier with good support, clear instruction, a warranty, a helpline to call, etc. a solution that lets you connect some bits to some otherbits you have to buy separately and then download/install software yourself is not really a solution to the reticent pi user.

IMHO t's better to ask. Hence the question.

As an actual pi user a standard interface board might be helpful, but I’ve got Seatalk1, NMEA0183 and some USB stuff as well as a DaisyHat. I don’t have any nmea2000, or a victron so don’t want to pay extra for that functionality. I have some cheap1 wire temp sensors to add, and might add engine tachometer (but you probably aren’t going to have a trivial plug and play solutions for that - my engine is mainstream but old school).

Easiest solution will likely be just deselect the bits you don't want in the BOM in jlcpcb.

The rpm works already apparently. Last board I had included about 50cents of components, someone else used it and seems to work just fine off the w terminal.

you are proposing an E paper display and I might have gone that way if there was a bundled kit but I’ve got a long thin display because It would fit nicely in a space I had, and being colour, touchscreen etc gave me other options.

Not proposing anything, that a scribbled gathering of ideas.

now about this gold dust you promise. I’ve got all my data in SignalK and use it real time for repeaters etc (longer term plan to go PyPilot!) but I could link easily to MongoDB atlas or similar. but why? What am I going to do with GB of wind speed, heading, tank level, temp data etc? If I as a geek who plays with tech for a living hasn’t got an obvious use then I don’t see the reluctant pi adopters wanting to track data?

Indeed why woud you mess about with mongodb these days when influx exists??
Openplotter sets it all up with a click, signalk-influxdb app writes the data. More why wouldn't you. The user won't even know the database exists. Don't ever look at it then fine. No downside, it's free.

Influxdb will only save as much as you want it to, mine is set for a week. And so far often it's what you weren't looking for that can be more interesting. My battery voltage was going a tiny bit lower in the mornings even though the logged temperature was fairly constant. , quite a linear decrease over a few weeks which turned out to be fixed with just a good clean of the terminals even though they looked ok. Don't look you won't see.

Or are you hoping to create a little business?

Absolutely 100% opensource. Completely free. If someone gets some value somehow then great, if not one person benefits then nothing lost, at least I tried & will learn along the way.
And tbh inspired with posts similar to this, a fair bit of misinformation and negative opinions which just scares people off even more.
It's sadly very common on ybw nowadays. Much less so elsewhere.

Mark Twain nailed it so well. You only regret what you didn't do, not what you did.