Wiring Lofrans Cayman- help!

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CJ13

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I plan to replace my Lewmar Pro Series Anchor Winch with a Lofrans Cayman.
The Lewmar has a 700w motor & the Lofrans a 1000w motor. The boat is pre wired 35mm2 which I think is adequate for the bigger motor.
To minimise the work involved I had hoped to fit the new windlass using the existing wiring & perhaps even the existing control box, however the wiring is slightly different.
The Lewmar connects positive and negative in and out of the control box. The Lofrans connects positive in & out of the control box, but the negative direct from battery to windlass with a separate (negative?) M2 from control box to windlass, so there are 3 wires into the windlass. So what do I need to change in my existing wiring?

In addition the Lofrans has what looks like control wires connected to the Circuit Breaker, which the Lewmar doesn't have. What purpose do they serve?

As you can tell I'm not a electrician, so advice phrased accordingly would be appreciated.

http://www.sailkerkyra.com/media/Pro20Series20Owners20Manual2005.pdf
http://www.imtra.com/Collateral/Documents/English-US/Products/Cayman_Tigres_Falkon_manual.pdf
 
Is your existing control box rated sufficiently for the 1000W motor?

Is your existing circuit breaker rated sufficiently too?
 
The existing control box is probably only rated to 700w- the Cayman comes with a new box, so not really a problem.
I definitely need a new Circuit Breaker, though I'd hoped to use a Blue Sea CB, which is much cheaper than the Lofrans version.
Using new kit is fine, but I'm confused at the difference in the wiring. What does the 3rd input into the windlass achieve- presumably I need to run a new 35mm2 cable for the 3rd wire? & why the control wires to the circuit breaker, which seems to exclude using a 3rd party unit.

John.
 
They're different types of motor. On your old Lewmar, the motor could be reversed simply by swapping the pos & neg wires, this is what the control box does. With the Lofrans motor, the negative is permanently connected, and if you apply positive to one terminal it goes up, if you apply positive to the other terminal it goes down. These wires to the windlass motor all need to be heavy enough for the max current.

If you're getting a new control box and a new breaker, just follow the Lofrans instructions.
 
As to the 35mm2 cable: its ampacity should be enough for the Lofrans motor, but you'll need to satisfy yourself that the voltage drop isn't excessive over the cable run in question. It may well not be, but windlasses get slow and sulky with big voltage drops.
 
You obviously need to change the breaker and the contactor/control box. I would suspect your cables will be fine, suck them and see.

Wiring, your existing battery positive goes to the controller, same as before. The existing 32mm 12v negative now has to go to the windlass, not the controller.

The smaller gauge wiring is for the control buttons, foot switches etc. These can all stay in place. The light gauge negative wire in the Loffrans diagram does not have to come all the way from the battery, it can some from the windlass negative. The positive wires can be fitted to the controller as they are now.

If the existing negative cable won't reach the windlass, which is likely, fit a heavy negative post :

http://www.12voltplanet.co.uk/negative-power-distribution-post-large-base-8mm.html

Fit it near the controller and take the light gauge switching negative for the controller from this too.
 
Hi Paul,

That's really helpful.
Just to confirm, you're saying that the negative cable from the control box to the windlass is a control cable (ie not 35mm2). Can you suggest what size cable I should use? - the length will be 7-8m.
Also Lofrans show control wires between their Circuit Breaker and the Control Box- do you know what they do & are they nessecary?

Thanks for your help,
John
 
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JFowler said:
Hi Paul,

That's really helpful.
Just to confirm, you're saying that the negative cable from the control box to the windlass is a control cable (ie not 35mm2). Can you suggest what size cable I should use? - the length will be 7-8m.
Also Lofrans show control wires between their Circuit Breaker and the Control Box- do you know what they do & are they nessecary?

Thanks for your help,
John
Click to expand...
Hmmm, not quite.

You need three heavy gauge cables from your relay (or control) box (that is the Lofrans one with three large terminals on top of it plus three spade terminals one the side). These three cables carry the power to the windlass: negative, positive up and positive down. You take the negative cable from the battery/negative bus bar straight to the windlass. The positive lead goes from the battery/positive bus bar to the control/relay box, via a circuit breaker or fuse whilst the two positives (up and down) go onto the remaining two heavy duty terminals.

There are then three lightweight wires from your switches or hand controller: negative, positive up and positive down. These wires energise the relays, switching the heavy current to the appropriate side of the motor. You can tap into the heavy duty negative to provide the negative pole, so if your control/relay box is sited away from the batteries there's no need to run an additional cable to provide the negative feed.

If you current set up has the control box some distance away from the windlass and you wanted to avoid having to run an additonal cable for the whole length, you could resite the control box closer to the windlass using the two existing cables, leaving you with a short run with three cables from the control box to the windlass.

Note that the circuit breaker referred to in the installation link you gave in your post is also a switch, which is why it also has the control positive linked to it.
 
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This is how the Lofrans windlass is wired up.

quickwiring.gif
 
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Duncan & Roger,

Thanks for your advice- I'm beginning to understand what's required.

Nigel,
A customised version of the wiring dig, would be very useful if it's not to much trouble.

Thanks,
John
 
In the battery compartment on the negative side I have a 10mm diameter terminal post & a 6mm shunt. Can i take the negative feed to the windlass direct from the 10mm terminal post or must it come from the shunt? If from the shunt which side?

Thanks,
John
 
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JFowler said:
In the battery compartment on the negative side I have a 10mm diameter terminal post & a 6mm shunt. Can i take the negative feed to the windlass direct from the 10mm terminal post or must it come from the shunt? If from the shunt which side?

Thanks,
John
Click to expand...

You currently have a 35mm negative cable connected to the contactor, you take that cable to the windlass.
 
JFowler said:
Just to confirm, you're saying that the negative cable from the control box to the windlass is a control cable (ie not 35mm2). Can you suggest what size cable I should use? - the length will be 7-8m.
Click to expand...

This concerns me. I can't see why you want to put the control box so far away from the windlass. Remember that you need 2 x 35 sq mm positive cables going to the windlass from the control box, but only one 35 sq mm positive cable going from the battery to the control box. So the closer you put the control box to the windlass, the less cable you'll have to buy. In most installations, the control box is mounted within 0.5m of the windlass.

Follow the wiring diagram in the Lofrans manual - this indicates which are heavy cables and which are light cables. The diagram Rogershaw has posted may confuse you, because it doesn't distinguish between heavy and light cables.

For the heavy cables, use 35 sq mm (which you say you already have. For the light cables to the switches, use 1.5 sq mm cable.
 
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PaulRainbow said:
You currently have a 35mm negative cable connected to the contactor, you take that cable to the windlass.
Click to expand...

I plan to use the existing neg from control box to windlass as one of the new pos wires. This leaves me the choice of extending the neg input to the old control box to the windlass - about 6.8m new cable (as your diagram) or running a new cable direct from the battery- about 8.2 total. The advantage of a new cable from the battery is it avoids a connection & I've found a relatively easy route that is shorter than the existing.
Hence the question re where to take the new cable from.
 
JFowler said:
I plan to use the existing neg from control box to windlass as one of the new pos wires.
Click to expand...

Nothing wrong with this, in principal, but you obviously need to mark the cable to avoid confusion with the positives.

This leaves me the choice of extending the neg input to the old control box to the windlass - about 6.8m new cable (as your diagram) or running a new cable direct from the battery- about 8.2 total. The advantage of a new cable from the battery is it avoids a connection & I've found a relatively easy route that is shorter than the existing.
Hence the question re where to take the new cable from.
Click to expand...

It's not really a significant advantage avoiding the connection, it's there at the moment, on the contactor. Are you sure it wouldn't just be easier to take the two 35mm negative cables off of the contactor and connect them together on a post, then fit one new positive from the contactor to the windlass ?

If you do decide to run a negative cable all the way to the windlass, connect it to the negative terminal on the battery.
 
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