Why two different inshore forecast formats?

[Anonymous]

Can anyone tell me why there are two different formats of inshore waters forecast, from the Met Office? The 'usual' one, on the www.metoffice.com website, is for 24 hours and, for the south of england, covers North Foreland to Selsey Bill then Selsey Bill to Lyme Regis. The other version, which is published on the WAP service and here on YBW.com, covers North Foreland to St Catherine's then St Catherine's to Lands End and is only valid for 18 hours. Why do we lose the extra areas and validity of forecast when we access via WAP and some other sources?

 

[Evadne]

There is a third one, sometimmes. On the TV (Ceefax) you often get a 12 hour forecast, issued at 0600 and 1800. I think this becomes 24 hours at a weekend but I'm not certain, so I suspect it has more to do with the hours worked by the people posting it up than the forecast itself.

 

[Oldhand]

Dunno, but why not ask the Met Office?

 

[danera]

If you look at the BBC weather site, you'll find both: the inshore waters forecast (upto 12miles offshore & 24h), and the coastal forecast (more detailed &18h). I guess the latter is aimed at dinghys, surfers, etc.

 

[Anonymous]

That's interesting, thanks! It's a THIRD variant of the 'IWF'. If you go to www.metoffice.com, under 'leisure' you have what they call the IWF and the Shipping Forecast. If you get the IWF via mobile phone or WAP - also from the Met Office, you get a different version. Now this BBC one makes three. The BBC one seems the best - certainly for around the Solent.

As a slight digression, I am amazed at the number of marinas that put out a 3 day forecast on a Friday and don't update it over the weekend - when you ask, they point out that it does give the forecasts for Saturday and Sunday as well. What use is a weather forecast unless you know when it was issued? I wouldn't sail off into the open sea with a met more than 12 hours old (at least not if there was any alternative). As a matter of interest, it's against the law to take off an aeroplane without a valid met.

 

[pappaecho]

The other day the ordinary forecast was for 4/5 for the Solent area. We came back in a 6/7 with gusts to 8, according to Bramblemet, which is placed plonk infront of Soton water.
On looking at the BBC inshore forecast this was also 4/5 but then updated to 6/7. They seem to do 6 hour chunks and so presumably they are updated 4 times a day. The current forecast at 1600 is to force 5/6. Bramblemet agrees, with gusts up to 7

 

[Anonymous]

[ QUOTE ]
The current forecast at 1600 is to force 5/6. Bramblemet agrees, with gusts up to 7

[/ QUOTE ]Which is why I'm sitting in Chi Marina talking about weather forecasts instead of sailing to Weymouth /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

[eyupdougdown]

I prepare myself and my boat for dealing with a Force 10, this stops me having to hang on to weather forecasts or use them as a excuse why not to go out. People give up before boats so I know I will be ok out there. Francis Drake never had no forecast - he just got on with it. Don't miss out by waiting around with a head full of duff gen. No, sorry, be afraid and stay at home - there's more sea room for me.

 

[Anonymous]

[ QUOTE ]
I prepare myself and my boat for dealing with a Force 10, this stops me having to hang on to weather forecasts or use them as a excuse why not to go out. People give up before boats so I know I will be ok out there.

[/ QUOTE ]Yer, goforrit batman /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[alant]

More to the point, with all the current technology, there is still often a wide variation between forecast & actual.

Sailing from Falmouth to Gosport last week, setting off Tuesday am. Wind NE as forecast. Called into Dartmouth, mainly due to crew feeling ill but also because v. light evening wind & forecast was for SW wind on Wednesday, so may as well rest & pick it up later.
However, Wednesday was light E/SE going up to a stronger SE, even though most of the day there were forecasts of this veering to S, with strong wind warnings of F6 from S/SW.
All way into Gosport it stayed at best more SE/SSE than S.

Even taking into consideration the timings & difficulties in predicting the progress of a system, the repeating of the Met Office ~0500hrs forecast throughout the day, with no reference to actual conditions being experienced can be frustrating. Surely if they can include the advertisement for yachties to fit DSC, they could also include actual conditions outside the CG's window in most routine broadcasts.

 

[Anonymous]

[ QUOTE ]
Even taking into consideration the timings & difficulties in predicting the progress of a system, the repeating of the Met Office ~0500hrs forecast throughout the day, with no reference to actual conditions being experienced can be frustrating. Surely if they can include the advertisement for yachties to fit DSC, they could also include actual conditions outside the CG's window in most routine broadcasts.

[/ QUOTE ]I experienced the same discrepancies last week and, as you say, it can be very inconvenient. You feel like tearing your hair out when they continue to broadcast a weather 'forecast' that is clearly wrong. I suspect that it is in part due to the Met Office wanting to get people to use revenue-generating services rather than using publicy available and funded forecasts. Maybe I'm cynical, but I do believe that the UK public weather service is now as bad at they come and I doubt whether that is due to the skills of the forecasters or lack of equipment - though who knows? Maybe they have dumbed-down the Met Office staff, along with GCSEs and A levels?

 

[Anonymous]

[ QUOTE ]
.....if they can include the advertisement for yachties to fit DSC,........

[/ QUOTE ]I haven't heard these. Are they on Ch16?

 

[alant]

No, Ch 16 is only used to announce which channel to switch onto for the routine weather forecast channel. Its at the beginning of this forecast information. This takes up a lot of air time & whilst having some relevance, can be a nuisance when waiting for the main message.
On most sailboats the VHF cannot be heard in the cockpit even on full volume (dont know why decent cockpit radios are fitted on all boats. If only person on boat or only one on watch, it means spending to much time below, changing VHF Channels or just listening. A handheld in the cockpit doesn't have the range. Usually it means dashing below, switching channels, going back on deck, trying to listen to the forecast & then back below for switching to 16 -unless on dual watch).

 

[BrendanS]

It depends on your cruising range. A good handheld can pick up coastguard forecasts from a decent area outside solent/south areas. even to more than halfway across channel. It cuts down on having to go below to hear forecasts that are within range of expectation. I'd rather have a fixed set down below if not single handing tho. A handheld does at least alert you to forthcoming coastguard weather forecasts, giving you more than enough time to get to fixed receiver ( alerting and forecasts can be received a long way off via coastguard transmitters, which are quite powerful, compared to transit range of a hand held)

 

[Anonymous]

All of my sailing is single-handed as my wife prefers not to get involved in things and I have no problems with the main set below and a handheld above. It's easier now that we have a deck saloon but even with a conventional yacht I never had problems in the Channel. Falmouth to Channel Islands was my regular area, so about as far as you get from land in the Channel.

I'm still confused about the "advertisement for DSC" that you were referring to. Are you saying that the practice of announcing the safety and weather info on Ch 16 before making the transmission amounts to an "advertisement for DSC"? You can dual watch on most sets which might be one answer although there is a limit to the number of weather reports I want during a typical Channel passage. Strong wind warnings are always announced on Ch 16 in any case.

I shall certainly not be buying a DSC until they allow me to set alert volumes to an acceptable level - I don't need to be aware of distress traffic five or ten hours travelling distance away from me when in a busy area like the Channel. Trans-ocean, yes, but that's Sea Area 2, outside VHF coverage.

 

[alant]

Re: DSC advert on CG weather alerting

I'm still confused about the "advertisement for DSC" that you were referring to. Are you saying that the practice of announcing the safety and weather info on Ch 16 before making the transmission amounts to an "advertisement for DSC"?
___________________________________________________

No.
Safety & weather is announced as usual on 16.
However, when you switch from Ch 16 onto the appropriate Channel that your weather info is going to be broadcast on, there is a fairly long script about 16 not being a preferred emergency calling channel etc & that all yachts etc should be fitted with DSC.
After all this comes the weather etc.
I'm all in favour of a the DSC system that gets my 'emergency' message out easily, without user panic & is ungarbled either by signal or weather. Its got to be better than voice.
However, I find that its difficult to read the very small screens on most sets, either for the message or on-screen instructions & there seems little uniformity or commonality in the actual of operation of these sets.
You need a manual each time you get on a different boat. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif Even the RED panic button is accessed diferently. Look great in a chandlers, but hardly user friendly.

 

[Anonymous]

Re: DSC advert on CG weather alerting

I haven't heard those transmissions about fitting DSC sets...I don't think that Solent can be doing it at the moment and they are the only UK CG that I have used for some months. I wish they would put more effort into getting us accurate timely weather forecasts, broadcast at 'friendly' times.

I agree with you about the complexity of sending a distress alert; my Simrad 'semi-DSC' is much easier but I instruct crew to consider the GPS EPIRB to be the first action in the case of MOB or other distress.

 

[alant]

Re: DSC advert on CG weather alerting

Heard on Falmouth, Brixham, Portland & Solent last week.

 

[LeonF]

Thames coast guard always end their 4 hourly broadcasts with their actual conditions at Walton. I find their weather broadcast pretty reliable, except for last year when the strong wind warning was put out when I was half way south across the estuary!!