Which language

[forestay]

I was chatting to someone that is about to go cruising and she was saying that she is learning French as a second language and her logic was that there are more French cruisers out there than Spanish, German or Portuguese. So what is your choice of a second language and why?

 

[tcm]

my 2nd is french - tho in atlantic spain they aren't very english speaking and you miss a lot with no spanish. But spanish are more forgiving than french about lack of their language, arm-waving etc imho. Antibes for example, they are a bit bloody on vhf - non non francais sil vous plait...

More languages the better, of course, thankyou: servash verfor, por fevor, s'ilvous plait, bitte, per favare erm that's it....

 

[forestay]

After swallowing a case of beer I can speak fluent Swahili. She said I wouldn't find many Swahili speaking cruisers. I beg to differ.

 

[daveyjones]

I definitely agree with tcm that Spanish is more useful than French, taking the world as a whole. If you have English , Spanish and French you are pretty well covered. It is also true that Spanish people are more forgiving of poor speakers of their language, if my experience living in those two countries is anything to go by. The idea that there are more French sailors, so it's better to learn French, is a curious one. Although it is nice to communicate with other boats, the most important use for a foreign language will be in dealing with customs oficials and the like, and a knowledge, however cursory, of their language can make all the difference, especially when you consider that learning a language also involves learning a different point of view. In my opinion there is no excuse for not learning at least a few phrases and polite forms of address in the language of each country you intend to visit, as a way of showing respect to the locals. There are plenty of good tapes and books to while away a long passage!

 

[forestay]

[ QUOTE ]
The idea that there are more French sailors, so it's better to learn French, is a curious one

[/ QUOTE ]You spend more time with them than the locals.

 

[TonyD]

I have no problem with learning a few phrases of a foreign language. The problem starts when I use them! They then expect me to understand what they say. Now learning a few phrases is one thing, but understanding the response I get is quite another.

I learnt French some years ago (even got an 'O' level in it), can read French well enough to get by and can speak French well enough to say what I need to say. However, I cannot understand ANYTHING a French person says to me - it's totally incomprehensible. I've listened to French radio and TV, visited the country on several occasions and spent evenings listening to conversations, but I am totally unable to separate the sounds they make into comprehensible words.

Am I alone with this difficulty? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

Tony

 

[tcm]

ah well, the thing is tony, you need to put yourself in a position where you HAVE to speak the lingo and they HAVE to uinderstand you.

Try (as i did, inadvertently) walking out on on franch zebra crossing and look the wrong way. You will be quickly flipped ovber the bonnet of real french car drive by real french person who is instantly in the poo cos it's your right of way. I did this when wandering around with busted battery trying to find a new one for a motorbike, and the frenchie was v helpful since it was shattered and hissing ion the pavement, offering to go and buy a new battery provided i didn't take things furthr since i was otherwise ok. Much french and armwaving, smiles, and the next day having swaopped passports for security (his idea) he returned having driven 50 miles each way for a new 6v battery for a royal enfield ahem. My french improved considerably such that i was even together enuf to answer his inevitable question (in french) er why on earth were you carrying the battery around? to which i answered "pour immobiliser le moto!" which he thort an excellent reason, and presumably lots of frenchies think we brits a v canny lot wansdering around with the flippin battery so nobody can nick the car/motorbike...

 

[BrendanS]

Nope! I can understand several languages in writing - enough to get by. I have no ear for languages at all. Like you, I can repeat parrot fashion a few phrases that will get me by. If someone speaks anything at me though, I'm totally lost. It rather embarrasses me, as I've always at least made the effort to learn the language of the places I visit, but I just cannot distinguish the sounds in my head.

and if you think French is bad, you ought to try Mandarin Chinese dialects, where there is a tonal element to pronunciation - still, it used to keep my hosts amused for hours getting me to try to copy them, while I was apparently saying all sorts of amusing things

 

[Sybarite]

Hakuna matate ....

 

[hylass]

As a Frenchman living in a Spanish country.. If I will have to choose? I will FIRST learn Spanish and then English and French in only the third position..

Bye now.. I am going to my English lesson.. :0)

 

[pragmatist]

You could try the phrase HWMBO used over dinner with a French client some years ago. What he _meant_ to say was "Plus lentement, Jean-Claude" -but in his somewhat flustered state (and I can vouch for the fact that said Jean-Claude used to speak any of his 5 languages at machine-gun speed !) he said "Plus chaud, Jean-Claude" - which caused a riot /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[daveyjones]

When I lived in Italy my French improved a lot, mainly because I was driving an old banger to and from England, and when it broke down in France I had to explain the problem to the local mechanic. It's amazing the language you can remember in extremis!
Speaking as an ex-TEFL teacher, the best ways to learn a language are, in order; 1)Sleep with your teacher, 2) Teach English abroad (not only are you living in the country but the students often answer in their own language before giving the English version, so you get to pick it up as you go along), 3) Hitch-hike around the country - this is brilliant as you have repeated one-to-one conversations, and if you take a grammar book you can swot up while waiting for the next lift. And it's all free!
I do understand the problem about comprehension, but I think that it is down to exposure time and to necessity (as in the car breakdown scenario). In my opinion, anyone who goes to live in a foreign country, away from other english people, will speak to a good conversational level in six months.

 

[TonyD]

I don't need to become fluent in French, just get by on the few occasions I go there, and deal with the awkward people that TCM referred to in Antibes. As I don't get more than a few days exposure, my comprehension of spoken French does not improve. Hence I don't speak it in case I get a reply in French! Progress is non-existent!

Sleeping with my teacher doesn't appeal. He was old and smelly 40 years ago! Now if you could recommend a teacher who might be more appealing....
Now would my wife swallow the excuse of "French lessons"? Hmmm, another challenge! /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Tony