What to do with keen helpers on the pontoon

[BelleSerene]

So I come alongside in another marina today, me, wifey and some friends and a cockpit full of kids.

The plan is for wifey to tie a bow line ashore, walk aft and take two loops from me to place over a cleat by the stern. I then have control of both from the cockpit, one as a stern line and the other, lad through a midships fairlead, as a spring.

A helpful yacht owner behind the position we're taking up asks if he can help. I thank him and ask him to take the two loops and put them over that cleat right there. Then my wife has only the bow to worry about.

I must have had to ask the poor chap seven times, encouragingly, to put the loops OVER the cleat and just leave them. He started to tie the lines on to the cleat despite my repeated and very simple and clear requests, then worried that the lines were slack because I hadn't yet taken in the slack, so started to pull the lines from the boat. I could have asked 'which part of 'just put the loops over the cleat' don't you understand?'! Anyway, my wife walked up and helped this poor boat owner to put a loop over a cleat.

There's clearly a lesson that if you have a competent crew, don't accept help from strangers even if there seems an advantage - in this case it was that by not having to walk away from a swiftly secured bow line, by wife could adjust the line correctly.

But it's a situation that happens a lot: you accept someone's kind offer of help and ask them to do something very simple ('if you could just put this loop over that cleat that would be great. Yes, just OVER the cleat. Great. Er - OVER the cleat - please don't pull it from me - just OVER the cleat please...'), and they go all deaf on you and start to run some plan of their own of how to tie your boat up.

What would others do?

 

[photodog]

I always say "Thanks .. but we need the practice!" in a very friendly laughy way so as not to cause offence....

Of course there are quite a few times when its a very handy thing to have peeps ready to take lines!

 

[toad_oftoadhall]

You could try: "No help thanks - we need the practice!" which shouldn't cause much offence.

Mind you, there's a certain type of sailor who is going to 'help' even if you ask him not to. God know's why sailing attracts them.

 

[l'escargot]

It's just one of those things. I have had the reverse as well. If I offer to take a line, I usually ask what they want done with it. Sometimes the response is just a blank look, so a couple of suggestions perhaps "Made off?" or "Round the cleat and back to you?" eventually followed up with "OK, I'll just tie it round the cleat until you make your mind up". Just so I can go back and get on with what I was doing.

 

[peter radclyffe]

So I come alongside in another marina today, me, wifey and some friends and a cockpit full of kids.

The plan is for wifey to tie a bow line ashore, walk aft and take two loops from me to place over a cleat by the stern. I then have control of both from the cockpit, one as a stern line and the other, lad through a midships fairlead, as a spring.

A helpful yacht owner behind the position we're taking up asks if he can help. I thank him and ask him to take the two loops and put them over that cleat right there. Then my wife has only the bow to worry about.

I must have had to ask the poor chap seven times, encouragingly, to put the loops OVER the cleat and just leave them. He started to tie the lines on to the cleat despite my repeated and very simple and clear requests, then worried that the lines were slack because I hadn't yet taken in the slack, so started to pull the lines from the boat. I could have asked 'which part of 'just put the loops over the cleat' don't you understand?'! Anyway, my wife walked up and helped this poor boat owner to put a loop over a cleat.

There's clearly a lesson that if you have a competent crew, don't accept help from strangers even if there seems an advantage - in this case it was that by not having to walk away from a swiftly secured bow line, by wife could adjust the line correctly.

But it's a situation that happens a lot: you accept someone's kind offer of help and ask them to do something very simple ('if you could just put this loop over that cleat that would be great. Yes, just OVER the cleat. Great. Er - OVER the cleat - please don't pull it from me - just OVER the cleat please...'), and they go all deaf on you and start to run some plan of their own of how to tie your boat up.

What would others do?

swear at them in russian

 

[photodog]

hahahahahaha...

Я думаю, что Вы сойдетесь прекрасный где-то здесь...

 

[Squeaky]

Good evening:

I don't know the location where this incident happened but is there a possibility that the man did not speak English? There still are a few in this world who haven't mastered it yet!

Cheers

Squeaky

 

[puddock]

I would definitely go for the "We need the practice " option.
I would also, make sure that I thanked the said helper (no matter how much the plan went astray). The guy meant well, was not familiar with your technique and possibly panicked a little........
Not everyone has the same docking plans.
If any blame is to be laid, I would rest it squarely on your shoulders - you accepted his offer AFTER you had made your plan. Management of change, I think they call it in that far off planet in the Health and Safety World...........

 

[sailorman]

Dover Fuel Berth

i had to be quite sharp with the "Over helpfull" fewl attendent. he tried to get my transom up onto the pontoon

 

[Kilter]

i had to be quite sharp with the "Over helpfull" fewl attendent. he tried to get my transom up onto the pontoon

I haven't heard that euphemism before!

 

[jimi]

Not me

.. I never get offer of hep, spectators seem amazed into immobility by my consumate boathandling skills .. or, more likely,petrified they'll get squashed if they venture closer!

 

[peter radclyffe]

hahahahahaha...

Я думаю, что Вы сойдетесь прекрасный где-то здесь...

amazing, you can actually swear in russian, what are the profanities

 

[Elessar]

What would others do?

I agree it is a real problem. The simple way it to not throw any lines until you've safely stopped the boat and are happy to be tied up. You can always rejig the lines later. It only goes wrong when well meaning helpers try and stop the boat for you. Often I stop the boat, my wife lassoos the forward cleat and I step ashore with the stern line - the helpers then just have a nice chat as there is nothing left to do, and it has never offended to my knowledge. Stop the boat using wind tide and engines, use the lines only to stop it blowing away again.

 

[photodog]

Actualy I said something to the effect of...

"I think you will fit in just fine around here..."

 

[Giblets]

i had to be quite sharp with the "Over helpfull" fewl attendent. he tried to get my transom up onto the pontoon

Most commendable. With the boat tilted more fewl could be loaded hence more money for him!

 

[Wansworth]

steaming in to littllehampton against the tide and the engine goes dead so we ferry glided to the pier side where I encouraged a passing tourist complete with ice cream tio pass my rope round the nearest anything to stop us going backwards!Its amazing how simple spoken english is insufficent to explain what would seem obvious..I did it myself!

 

[Searush]

I have found "please just hold it for a moment until I can get ashore & decide what is best to do" to be quite effective. They feel they are helping, yet have no tricky task to perform or instructions to interpret. I have time to climb the ladder, thank them politely then take the warp & set it up as I need it.

I love it when people ask "Where have you come from?" and I can reply "That mooring over there!" When you actually do arrive from distant parts, no-one ever asks or cares.

 

[John100156]

Wow, thats precisely what happened to me last week!

We returned to our marina after a delightful few days away. We were aware a storm was brewing, so left in good time.

27NM of a 28NM trip went just great, then as we approached our marina we saw a few white horses with increasing intensity, yes you guessed it, storm arrived 6 hours earlier than predicted, northerly building to 25+ knots. Had SWMBO and some novice, but able and willing crew on board. Prepared them well as we approached, for what I thought would be a difficult, but not too difficult berthing. All quite calm and relaxed.

We are located on the end of a pontoon with an open finger berth, easy, just slip up bow out quite wide and ferry glide onto the berth, wheel over, sterndrives at the ready and bow thruster on, well fendered, piece of cake. Wind will bring bow in quite nicely, not much grip on the water on a T34.

It was coming in just right with no adjustment necessary, just a blip on the throttle to keep the sterm in line with a faster moving bow. We will slip nicely on, where I have a permanent line attached to forward and stern cleats on the finger berth, with an alpine butterfly on a bight (loop in the middle) which I just slip over the cleat on my port beam, another crew member just slips a bow line from the stern over a cleat on the pontoon. We can then relax and secure other lines.

Then, a helpful and thoroughly nice chap from a few berths away races up to assist us, and before I know it, novice crew dont know what they should do, he asks for a line from the port bow, SWMBO correctly says no, just loop the line on the pontoon over the central cleat as we close, I was concentrating on keeping the boat nicely in line, he calls again for the port line from the port bow, SWMBO throws it, and before I know it he pulls the bow over, wind catches it, I counteract with a blip on the throttle to bring stern in whilst trying with the other hand to bowthrust the bow away, he pulls even harder, I dont have a second to shout PLEASE GO AWAY and we bumped much harder than we needed too.

The conditions were quite bad, but it was just ferry gliding in so nicely, if he had done nothing, the boat would have berthed itself!

OK, I have now learned a very valuable lesson from the above threads, I will advise my crew to say, 'NO he needs the practice' - I like that!

As the chap walked away he said, 'you have a bit of fender rub on your blue gelcoat, dont worry, it will polish out'..... Grrrrrr

Fortunately it was nothing though !

 

[AndieMac]

What about when well meaning strangers try to help, when fending off a yacht coming alongside, by grabbing hold of the top of the stanchions and pushing as hard as they can.......Oops that is a massive bend!!

Can't see how 1" SS upright tapered tubing, screwed into the deck, looks like a strong point?

Could be just me though...........

 

[[2574]]

Basic competence please!

Well this discussion is all very well but..............

At the weekend we were locking through in to our home port. A busy lock and rafting is necessary. We come in first and get alongside the pontoon and tied up fine. Then chaos ensues. Boats come in to the lock completely unprepared; no fenders out, no lines on the boat. Or, as happened to us they come alongside far too fast and essentially "land" on our starboard side; much straining of lines and fenders as they "land". Why do they have to go so fast? This is not the bloody M25! The skipper then bungs me a spaghetti of rope from his stern cleat so that I can tie his boat up, thanks very much! They only have bow and stern lines on, can't be bothered by springs so I have to say "skipper please add a spring as the water surge will push you back at speed" so the idiot puts a spring on but puts it on backwards! Oh pleeeese! By now I'm beginning to despair. Too late, the sluices are opened and the surge of water sends him back and forth alongside our starboard side like a bloody great sheet of wet 'n dry. Lovely job. The guy was a complete plonker. So if he's saying to me "no thanks I need the practice" as suggested hereabouts then I'm saying "go and practice on somebody else's boat, not mine!"

Why oh why can't people think, learn and practice some basic skills. The lock through that I experienced Saturday was an utter shambles; with no more than two or three of the boats in the lock being adequately skilled/prepared. It has to be seen to be believed. I really don't mind if people want to cock up out at sea where they can't damage anyone else but utter incompetence in close quarters is unforgiveable. People should make sure they have the very basic skills before they commit themselves to what can be tricky tasks such as transiting a busy lock. I feel for the lockkeepers; they must watch in amazement.

So, if an owner is making a complete balls of it and is endangering my crew and or boat then I for one am not being fobbed off by "we need the practice"

rob