What size windless do I need?

[Jasonbbo]

Hi guys , I’ve been looking at windlasses and I’m trying to work out what wattage one I need I’m a bit confused about the calculations.
My boat is a feeling 1090 and the displacement is about 6.5 ton and length is 36.5 ft
I plan on getting 8mm chain 40m and then 40m of rope.. would I get away with a 1000w windlass ? there’s some good offers on them that won’t brake the bank or will I be wishing I had bought a 1500w one? There a lot more money which I’m hopping to avoid

 

[coopec]

Hi guys , I’ve been looking at windlasses and I’m trying to work out what wattage one I need I’m a bit confused about the calculations.
My boat is a feeling 1090 and the displacement is about 6.5 ton and length is 36.5 ft
I plan on getting 8mm chain 40m and then 40m of rope.. would I get away with a 1000w windlass ? there’s some good offers on them that won’t brake the bank or will I be wishing I had bought a 1500w one? There a lot more money which I’m hopping to avoid

My yacht is 43ft (read 38ft) and has 80m of 10mm chain. I have a Muir VRC 1250

Muir Storm VRC1250 Vertical Stainless Steel Anchor Winch/Capstan, $2,599.00 | Whitworths Marine

 

[Jasonbbo]

My yacht is 43ft (read 38ft) and has 80m of 10mm chain. I have a Muir VRC 1250

Muir Storm VRC1250 Vertical Stainless Steel Anchor Winch/Capstan, $2,599.00 | Whitworths Marine

Thanks , 80m of 10mm and 1200 watts, that’s a lot of chain and weight dose your windless have no problems lifting it into a breeze? Looks like a 1000w will suit me fine if that’s the case

 

[coopec]

Thanks , 80m of 10mm and 1200 watts, that’s a lot of chain and weight dose your windless have no problems lifting it into a breeze? Looks like a 1000w will suit me fine if that’s the case

Did you see the specifications?

The winch works but as the yacht hasn't been launched I can't comment on the performance. But Muir has a good name.

Muir Storm VRC1250 Vertical Stainless Steel Anchor Winch/Capstan
Our Price $2,599.00
Cat.No:

Specifications
Specifications

Vessel Length: 10 - 13m (32 - 42ft) Power Supply: 12V Motor Watts: 1000 Hydraulic Pressure: 8MPa (1160PSI) Hydraulic Flow: 15L/min (4gal/min) Max Load: 125kg (275lb) Work Load: 250kg (550lb) Amps Work Load: 100/60 Max Line Speed: 28m/min (90ft/min) Chain Size: 8mm (6mm and 10mm Gypsies can be fitted on request) Rope Size: 12 - 14 - 16mm (1/2" - 9/16" - 5/8") Net Weight: DC 23kg (DC/HYD 51lb)

 

[Refueler]

Having used them on others boats ... the use was controlled in that heave was only engaged when boat was moving to the chain. We stopped if boat tried to back away. That meant as with manual heaving - it was best to have boat engine slowly moving boat forward to reduce the load on the gypsy.

 

[Cspirit]

My Westerly Corsair has a 1000 watt Lofrans and 60 metres of 8 mm chain. We have spent 12 seasons in the Med anchoring most nights. No problems. Boat is 7 tons and fully loaded for long erm cruising.

 

[Neeves]

We use 6mm high tensile chain (that will give you something to think about) the chain has the strength of the 8mm chain it replaced. This is installed on a 38' cat, fully laden for a 3 months cruise, 7t.

We sail to Tasmania's west coast, think - Roaring Forties.

Tell me why you need 8mm chain. It costs more, its heavy, it takes up more room, it may tower in your locker,

8mm chain will be fine, but will reduce the performance of a lightweight yacht, compared to carrying 6mm. 1,000 watts is fine for the 8mm chain - but offers a bigger safety margin if used for 6mm. You certainly do not need a 1,500 watt windlass.


Your ground tackle is a combined bit of kit - it involves the anchor, chain, windlass, snubbers, shackles. To discuss 8mm chain and the size of the windlass is like discussing a sports car and ignoring the tyres and suspension.

If you keep your yacht for a few years the costs of the windlass, now, will be insignificant in the longer term.

Once you opt for chain size you are committed as changing chain - is extortionate. Relax sit back and consider a bit more deeply, open up your options.

Jonathan

 

[Mudisox]

My 10m cat has 75m of 10mm chain and 120m of 12mm octoplait. Often anchor and re anchor in 25m+ and also twice in 76m [don't ask why,]
My 1000w Lofrans has coped admirably.
It can also haul a reasonably medium sized person up the mast, [ but not me!]

 

[Tranona]

1000 watts and 8mm chain. Depending on where you anchor 50m is a good chain length. Consider adding rope as needed rather than splicing as it will rarely get used and will sit mouldering underneath wet chain moat od the time. Lofrans are probably the best value if the windlasses easily available in the UK.

 

[Neeves]

The amount of chain, or the total length of your rode (chain and rope) is determined by where you anchor or might anchor.

We were supplied at commissioning with 30m of 8mm chain and quickly 'upgraded' (?) to 50m. When we saw the light (call it advantages) of light chain we upgraded further to 75m of high tensile 6mm chain.

This is our old 50m of chain, top 2 drums, and our new 75m of 6mm chain, bottom 2 drums. each drum has the same potential capacity.



If your windlass cannot haul a reasonably sized fit adult up a mast - your windlass is too small. However a reasonably fit individual should be able to ascend a mast, without power assistance (jumars come to mind) and a manually powered sheet or halyard winch is possibly a safer bet - but that's just me as I climb masts frequently and prefer using manual labour.

Jonathan

 

[PaulRainbow]

Thanks , 80m of 10mm and 1200 watts, that’s a lot of chain and weight dose your windless have no problems lifting it into a breeze? Looks like a 1000w will suit me fine if that’s the case

A 1000w windlass will be fine.

DO NOT haul the boat along with the windlass. You gently move the boat forward under engine power, retrieving the slack rode with the windlass. Once over the anchor, the windlass will usually break the anchor out, if it doesn't do it easily, put the engine astern and break it out with the engine, then retrieve with the windlass.

 

[Graham376]

Hi guys , I’ve been looking at windlasses and I’m trying to work out what wattage one I need I’m a bit confused about the calculations.
My boat is a feeling 1090 and the displacement is about 6.5 ton and length is 36.5 ft
I plan on getting 8mm chain 40m and then 40m of rope.. would I get away with a 1000w windlass ? there’s some good offers on them that won’t brake the bank or will I be wishing I had bought a 1500w one? There a lot more money which I’m hopping to avoid

Our boat is 38ft, 8+ tons, with 10mm chain and 20kg anchor. 1000w Lofrans Kobra is plenty big enough. As others have said, hauling the boat into tide or wind on windlass will overload it.

 

[Neeves]

A 1000w windlass will be fine.

DO NOT haul the boat along with the windlass. You gently move the boat forward under engine power, retrieving the slack rode with the windlass. Once over the anchor, the windlass will usually break the anchor out, if it doesn't do it easily, put the engine astern and break it out with the engine, then retrieve with the windlass.

If your anchor does not release quickly then putting your engine in astern may simply set your anchor more deeply that's how anchors are set

Better - motor forward and retreive rode unit the rode is vertical and in tension. Be patient - the waves, or swell, or chop will lift the bow of your yacht slightly and the constant difting, vertically, will release the anchor.

Whilst the windlass makers invariably recommend motoring forward as you retreive your anchor - the implication being your windlass is likely to be damaged and has insufficient grunt to haul your yacht to the anchor. The tension necessary to move your yacht forward, in no wind, is insignificant in comparison to the specification of a 1,000 watt motor. Most people will anchor in places that are sheltered from wind - but in strong winds - motor into the winds you retreive.

Jonathan

 

[PaulRainbow]

If your anchor does not release quickly then putting your engine in astern may simply set your anchor more deeply that's how anchors are set

I know how an anchor sets, don't be condescending.

Better - motor forward and retreive rode unit the rode is vertical and in tension. Be patient - the waves, or swell, or chop will lift the bow of your yacht slightly and the constant difting, vertically, will release the anchor.

I said : "gently move the boat forward " and "Once over the anchor"

Whilst the windlass makers invariably recommend motoring forward as you retreive your anchor - the implication being your windlass is likely to be damaged and has insufficient grunt to haul your yacht to the anchor. The tension necessary to move your yacht forward, in no wind, is insignificant in comparison to the specification of a 1,000 watt motor.

Jonathan

If you think dragging a 20 ton boat along with the windlass is a good idea, crack on. Personally, i think it's dumb.

 

[shortjohnsilver]

1000 watts and 8mm chain. Depending on where you anchor 50m is a good chain length. Consider adding rope as needed rather than splicing as it will rarely get used and will sit mouldering underneath wet chain moat od the time. Lofrans are probably the best value if the windlasses easily available in the UK.

Incidentally and not wishing to highjack this thread, I have 45m of 10mm having reduced from 60m. I had wanted the extra scope but the additional weight was too much for the boat so I removed 15m to restore trim. However, my plan is to back up with 45/50m of octoplait rode.
But as mentioned, how often would I use the additional rode and not splicing it would mean I could store it conveniently elsewhere but not sat under wet muddy deteriorating anchor cable. So, what way to quickly attach to cable end that’s suitable to go over the windlass without issue as I had thought splicing would be best?

 

[Neeves]

I know how an anchor sets, don't be condescending.



I said : "gently move the boat forward " and "Once over the anchor"



If you think dragging a 20 ton boat along with the windlass is a good idea, crack on. Personally, i think it's dumb.

If you know how an anchors sets then do not suggest putting the engine in reverse in order to release the anchor - its dumb. If you put the engine in forward you will run over the anchor - and may, I stress the may, help to release it.

The OP does not have a 20t yacht, its 6.5t, and I think it dumb to use a windlass with a 1000watt motor on a 20t yacht (or even suggest 20t and 1000 watt in this context - people might take you seriously). However you run a business where recommendations of vessel size vs motor size is important so I am sure you often install 1,000 watt windlass on 20t yachts. You are obviously, as I can deduce from your comments, an expert and I bow to your greater knowledge. However you will excuse me if I say that if you are serious about installing 1000watt windlass on 20t yachts - the I would not want to use your services.

I looked at the specification of a Lofrans Cayman windlass with a 1,000 watt motor.

The working load of the windlass is 170kg and the maximum pull is 1,250kg. If this data is correct then the windlass should be able to pull the yacht forward against a gentle breeze. Obviously, unless you are going to sail your anchor out, you will have the motor running when you retreive (and yes it will not strain your windlass if you use your auxiliary engine) but if you are single handed there are times when using the windlass to gently move the yacht forward will be convenient (and a convenience many utilise - without stressing the windlass).

Jonathan

 

[coopec]

I know how an anchor sets, don't be condescending.



I said : "gently move the boat forward " and "Once over the anchor"



If you think dragging a 20 ton boat along with the windlass is a good idea, crack on. Personally, i think it's dumb.

Paul
What about giving it a break? What are you trying to prove?

 

[PaulRainbow]

If you know how an anchors sets then do not suggest putting the engine in reverse in order to release the anchor - its dumb. If you put the engine in forward you will run over the anchor - and may, I stress the may, help to release it.

If the chain is vertical from the bow you can't set the anchor, if you could you would be able to anchor in 10m of water with 10 m of chain.

Do you not know anything about anchors ?

FYI, i didn't say how big the windlass is on my 20t boat, just that dragging it along with the windlass is dumb, which it is.

 

[Neeves]

Incidentally and not wishing to highjack this thread, I have 45m of 10mm having reduced from 60m. I had wanted the extra scope but the additional weight was too much for the boat so I removed 15m to restore trim. However, my plan is to back up with 45/50m of octoplait rode.
But as mentioned, how often would I use the additional rode and not splicing it would mean I could store it conveniently elsewhere but not sat under wet muddy deteriorating anchor cable. So, what way to quickly attach to cable end that’s suitable to go over the windlass without issue as I had thought splicing would be best?

You could retrieve the rope portion and coil it separately and hang in your bow locker such that it allows the chain to be retrieved and the 2 components kept separately. Hanging the rope portion allows it to air and dry and it then does not constantly dampen the chain, acceleration corrosion. You can splice, and the chain/splice interface will result in the chain preferentially corroding. Chop the splice out when you deem it unsightly and make a new splice - you will lose 30cm of chain and 30cm of rope.

The process is not the most convenient - but it only takes time to move the rope away from the fall of the chain and you can neaten it all up at your leisure - later.

The best answer was to have used smaller chain in the first place - but unless you opt for smaller chain at commissioning or when you buy a new windlass - its an expensive exercise (gypsies are extortionate) and many have other priorities.

Jonathan

 

[Norman_E]

As an aside windlasses have become more powerful over the years. My old 45 foot boat of about 10 tons had a 1000 watt Lofrans windlass with 65 metres of 10mm chain and a 25Kg anchor, and it was quite pwerful enough. The recent versions of the same windlass are 1500 watts.