webesto experts on here?

[Ian MacAulay]

Morning

I'm currently running a hot water tank on my boat just off the port engine with no immersion heater.

I'm toying with changing over to a webasto diesel water heater so I can have hot water in the marina and on anchor.

I know a little about eberspacher heaters and such like but what I'm after knowing is a few things about the webasto water heaters found in range rovers and such like that can be sourced quit cheaply online.

so firstly do they regulate their own tempature and switch off at a given tempature or do I need a thermostat/ tempature sensor to control it?

Also when they are taken from a range rover or such like they just have a couple of multiplugs on them. Now are they ECU controlled or can I just supply it with a 12v supply ?

Are they as simple as I'm hoping to convert or am I going to be faced with loads of challenges?

regards

Ian

 

[matt_lake]

I think your biggest challenge is going to be the exhaust as I think the marine kit is different for the truck version.

 

[Mr Googler]

This is a big subject!

If you want to take a thermotop v and pop it in a boat you have a few challenges.

It will run without an ecu but you can't just put 12v to it. You need to buy a webasto timer (1533) as it needs the "right" signal sent to turn it on. You will also need the inline dosing pump. When it starts, it talks to the dosing pump and increases the pumping rate as the heater ramps up.

You will need to wire in an obd2 connector so you can use a laptop as you need to change settings in the unit telling it that it has now become a water heater!

Have a look on the discovery 3 forum. Loads of info on there as doing a remote start is a popular modification and covers the timer/start issue.

You also need to think about exhausting the thing out through the hull.

You can get a kit as below using a thermotop C.

http://pbautoelectrics.co.uk/shop/w...ter-heater-kit-with-seven-day-timer-41k5037c/

 

[Ian MacAulay]

wow thank you.

so a vevo is out the question... would a top c be the same situation?

thanks again

Ian

 

[Mr Googler]

Not sure what a vevo is

The top V is designed for cars where as the top c is found in trucks, motorhomes etc and is set up to be a "park heater" as they term it.

 

[Ian MacAulay]

Must be a land rover term. thermotop vevo is printed on the labels.

will the thermotop c need a controller and a ECU update?

thanks

Ian

Not sure what a vevo is

The top V is designed for cars where as the top c is found in trucks, motorhomes etc and is set up to be a "park heater" as they term it.

 

[Mr Googler]

It will need a timer but shouldnt need plugging in. Lock out faults can be cleared with the timer from memory.

You only need to plug in the top V as it's set up for being used in a car.

I think (could be wrong) the top c has a bigger built in water pump too. The top v one is tiny but then it only has to push 12 odd litres around.

That said, the PC software is free and well worth having. Wiring in an obd2 is very easy and then you need a USB to obd2 again very cheap. The kit I linked to is not cheap but everything is there. Make sure you get a diesel one if buying second hand as they do a petrol one too!

 

[Ian MacAulay]

Thank you.

I keep my eyes open for a top c model then.

thanks

Ian

 

[Ian MacAulay]

Will a top c run and fire without a timer ? ie can I just put it on a switch and will it kick in and out to maintain a tempature and cut out once its reached it?

 

[Mr Googler]

I don't think so. It needs a "special" signal. When in a car that comes from an ecu. You can bet your bottom dollar webasto charge for that coding!

 

[David2452]

I have read the foregoing with some amusement. Firstly all Thermo tops require only a 12v + signal to operate, that can come from a vehicle ECU or a simple switch or timer, + 12v on the Webasto ECU pin 1 = go, remove the power and the unit ramps down. The 1533 timer is a simple make and break switch. There are different ECUs that also will not work when the temperature is above 5 deg, have no output for the circulation pump etc, these are auxiliary heaters with no integral circulation pump and are not really suited to stand alone install in a vessel. Get a Thermo Top C universal kit with associated wiring and other parts required as a kit cheaply from Ebay or you could wind up paying through the nose for all the bits you need. The Vevo (short for 5 Evo) you mentioned would probably be suitable but is restricted to operating for one hour only, and unlike the E & C it is embedded in the ECU.

 

[Mr Googler]

I wasn't trying amuse, only help.

When I modified the thermotop V (a VEVO i assume) on my disco, you could only get it to go with a 1533 timer sending the right signal.

You are obviously expert in this field so I'm glad the op is getting the advice they need.

 

[David2452]

I wasn't trying amuse, only help.

When I modified the thermotop V (a VEVO i assume) on my disco, you could only get it to go with a 1533 timer sending the right signal.

You are obviously expert in this field so I'm glad the op is getting the advice they need.

Yep, the V Evo is W bus unlike the ubiquitous Thermo Top

 

[Ian MacAulay]

Good evening.

Thank you both for the help and support. So am I right in saying avoid the v version and buy a c version? With the c version I should pretty much be able to plumb it in and just give it 12v on a on off switch?

Thank you both

Ian

 

[David2452]

Good evening.

Thank you both for the help and support. So am I right in saying avoid the v version and buy a c version? With the c version I should pretty much be able to plumb it in and just give it 12v on a on off switch?

Thank you both

Ian

Yes, but you will need the plugs and loom, PM me if you want a workshop manual with wiring schematics which will make it all much clearer. Personally for your use I would have thought the lower output TTE would be better suited but that's another discussion.

 

[TwoHooter]

That said, the PC software is free and well worth having.

I was told we would have to pay £280 + VAT for the software for me to perform my own diagnostics on our Webasto Thermo 90 Pro hydronic heater (which currently ranks as No. 2 on the list of things that have caused hassle and expense since we bought the boat). At the moment we haven't even got a flash code output therefore I am trying to wire this in myself.

 

[Mr Googler]

Google webasto thermotest.

This was a wiki for my disco http://www.disco3.co.uk/wiki/Webasto_Thermo_Test_Setup

I've no idea if it will work with your model but I wish you luck

 

[Mr Googler]

Just checked and you can't download it from webasto FOC anymore! I've not had much luck on this thread

There are other sites on which version 2.16 appears or no doubt Dave2452 can assist.

 

[TwoHooter]

Just checked and you can't download it from webasto FOC anymore! I've not had much luck on this thread There are other sites on which version 2.16 appears or no doubt Dave2452 can assist.

I will be very pleased if Dave2452 can assist. I would not recommend Webasto heaters at the present time, based on my personal experiences; perhaps he can persuade me that I have just been unlucky. I actually take great exception to being told I must pay for the software necessary to maintain my own heater when my boat is in a location where no service engineers are available - it's like the car companies charging a fortune for the software to mend their products when they go wrong. The heater is a vital piece of equipment on our boat and so far I am not impressed.

 

[David2452]

I will be very pleased if Dave2452 can assist. I would not recommend Webasto heaters at the present time, based on my personal experiences; perhaps he can persuade me that I have just been unlucky. I actually take great exception to being told I must pay for the software necessary to maintain my own heater when my boat is in a location where no service engineers are available - it's like the car companies charging a fortune for the software to mend their products when they go wrong. The heater is a vital piece of equipment on our boat and so far I am not impressed.

You do know the Pro 90 cames with a three year on board warranty don't you? Must be a hell of a size boat to warrant a Pro 90, unless the usual over specifying has been done, I can let you have a copy of the software if you wish, just drop me an email address. It is different to the old versions and gives a huge amount more info as the Pro series are a lot more complex tan the old 90 & 90ST, with internal exhaust temperature sensors etc which adjust the burn rate so servicing and adjusting is nothing like as simple as the earlier models. What you will need to buy is the interface hardware which I am sure nobody would expect for free. On the plus side you will be pleased to learn that Pro series parts are notably less expensive than earlier models.