Wayplanner Alternative

[Ribtecer]

With my first channel crossing for quite a while coming up I have started to turn my mind to passage planning, When I used to do this before we had a simple programme called Wayplanner which used to calculate the tides and course, we simply put in the position of say the Needles and Bray harbour and it worked out the best time to leave and what course to steer.

What do people use these days? I still have a copy of Wayplanner (somewhere) but the whole world has changed since then and I am sure there must be something much better now like a simple app to run the numbers.

Thanks, I look forward to your advice.

Toby

 

[prv]

What do people use these days?

Almanac, tidal stream atlas, notebook, chart, pencil and Breton plotter, I'm afraid

Pete

 

[rosewood]

Almanac, tidal stream atlas, notebook, chart, pencil and Breton plotter, I'm afraid

Pete

+1. Although I do have a Neptune Passage planner software on my PC which is very very good

 

[Ribtecer]

Almanac, tidal stream atlas, notebook, chart, pencil and Breton plotter, I'm afraid

Pete

Do I detect a very small hint of sarcasm?

At first I used an "Almanac, tidal stream atlas, notebook, chart, pencil and Breton plotter" then I was introduced to Wayplanner which was more accurate, far easier and much quicker than using and "Almanac, tidal stream atlas, notebook, chart, pencil and Breton plotter"

I thought this was a place where one could use technology to ask advice and discuss best practise.

Perhaps this technological age has peeked and we are now going backwards!!!

 

[rosewood]

Do I detect a very small hint of sarcasm?

At first I used an "Almanac, tidal stream atlas, notebook, chart, pencil and Breton plotter" then I was introduced to Wayplanner which was more accurate, far easier and much quick than using and "Almanac, tidal stream atlas, notebook, chart, pencil and Breton plotter"

I thought this was a place where one could use technology to ask advice and discuss best practise.

Perhaps this technological age has peeked and we are now going backwards!!!

. Seriously look at the Neptune Navigation website

 

[James_Calvert]

+1 for the non-tech stuff.

But what I actually do (where possible) is look up in my old log books how I did the passage last time and see if something similar will work again.

Of course you do need to have kept a paper record of your old passages to be able to do this....

But, to be honest, if anyone knows of a good Android app that can do the job you want, I'd probably use that if it were easier...

 

[sailorman]

With my first channel crossing for quite a while coming up I have started to turn my mind to passage planning, When I used to do this before we had a simple programme called Wayplanner which used to calculate the tides and course, we simply put in the position of say the Needles and Bray harbour and it worked out the best time to leave and what course to steer.

What do people use these days? I still have a copy of Wayplanner (somewhere) but the whole world has changed since then and I am sure there must be something much better now like a simple app to run the numbers.

Thanks, I look forward to your advice.

Toby

I have only one waypoint for x channel crossings, A compass rose on the paper chart this makes for very easy plotting, just range & bearing from the compass rose. The course is compass allowing for tides to unwind.
If you fight the tide with straight waypoints, you will sail longer & a far greater distance

 

[Spirit of Glenans]

IMHO half the pleasure of a passage is in the planning.

 

[prv]

Do I detect a very small hint of sarcasm?

Not really - it was a straight answer to a straight question: "What do people use these days?"

I simply wrote down what I use, as requested.

I suppose answering questions literally is a common "failing" among software engineers like myself, but any sarcasm, disapproval, snobbery or anything else you may see in that answer is purely in your own head.

Pete

 

[prv]

I have only one waypoint for x channel crossings, A compass rose on the paper chart this makes for very easy plotting, just range & bearing from the compass rose. The course is compass allowing for tides to unwind.
If you fight the tide with straight waypoints, you will sail longer & a far greater distance

I think you've completely missed the point.

Pete

 

[Sea Devil]

Easy Navigation

I have just written a book called Easy Navigation available from http://www.gentlesailing.com/ and having done research I came to the conclusion there were no really useful IT aids to to tidal streams and currents linked to a tidal atlas. Clearly if you just follow the GPS track you will arrive at your destination. Now it's true you will have sailed a bit further because on a cross channel passage you will have a change of tidal direction and power every hour and over a 12 hour period the GPS will have compensated twice for keeping you 'on course'.

Of course it would be crazy to sail in tidal waters without knowing what the tides are doing and it is sad not to be able to work it out properly but in the end the GPS will get you there...

 

[Sandy]

Almanac, tidal stream atlas, notebook, chart, pencil and Breton plotter, I'm afraid

+1

 

[sailorman]

I think you've completely missed the point.

Pete

No, thats what i do for simple x channel trips. Why the need to go "looking " for buoys on the way
What point did i miss

 

[prv]

Why the need to go "looking " for buoys on the way

I have no idea what this is supposed to relate to, either in my post or the OP's.

What point did i miss

The OP is asking for software to calculate the efficient compass course for him, instead of working it out by hand.

You answered by telling him not to steer the rhumb line, and not to use multiple waypoints.

Since he never suggested doing either of these things, that's a bizarre non-sequiteur of an answer.

The most charitable explanation for it was that you had misread or misunderstood the question.

Clearer?

Pete

 

[Mudisox]

All aids are exactly that and need to be interpreted with current and past weather, pressure and a few things like leeway. This is impossible in IT situation and that is why I remain using the time honoured methods as it makes me think.
Team GBR and others spent hundreds of thousands on trying to forecast the tidal data in Weymouth Bay, and it didn't really alter the knowledge from my father's book dating 1942. In fact I crossed to Cherbourg last season without anything, except the log, having forgotten charts, tidal atlas, Almanac and GPS. [Boat had been in Race Committee mode]
Using the fact that it was a day after Springs [ Dover 1200 high tide] and a road map, funnily enough, we managed to make it there and back, almost directly. Do IT methods ensure that you arrive off, slightly up tide/wind ? I think not.

 

[rob2]

The typical cross channel trip really doesn't warrant the use of software to set the initial course (assuming the expected boat speed will give a duration of aournd two tides) just point directly at the objective and you'll get somewhere close to it. Where the power of computation would be helpful is in the revision of the course based on actual boat speed achieved and the actuall tidal vector against prediction. These can be extrapolated from a series of GPS readings which should mean that a suitable algorithm would continually improve the accuracy of the calculation to the point that you could sail into Cherbourg blindfold (rather than fogbound as usual). Really not difficult to write such a program (I don't do "apps") if the tidal data, GPS and boat instruments were all reliably supplied in only one format, but I suspect the various manufacturers' communication languages and data formats for tidal vectors would make it necessary to write the basic algorithm and a multitude of interfaces to suit different boat/instrument combinations.

I haven't done a channel crossing for some time, but I recall that we would plot the Decca (!) readings against the straight line on the chart and if wit were nearly on the line when halfway we left well alone. If not, we adjusted course to correct during the second half of the trip. Believe it or not, we didn't do too badly in these overnight passage races - after all getting placings just interupted a good evening's boozing. Better to remain in the front half of the fleet.

Rob.

 

[sailorman]

I have no idea what this is supposed to relate to, either in my post or the OP's.



The OP is asking for software to calculate the efficient compass course for him, instead of working it out by hand.

You answered by telling him not to steer the rhumb line, and not to use multiple waypoints.

Since he never suggested doing either of these things, that's a bizarre non-sequiteur of an answer.

The most charitable explanation for it was that you had misread or misunderstood the question.

Clearer?

Pete

An admiralty tidal atlas will give him the off-set that he needs in a trice.Then sail a compass course, quicker,shorter distance.
Why the need for software
KISS

 

[prv]

Really not difficult to write such a program (I don't do "apps") if the tidal data, GPS and boat instruments were all reliably supplied in only one format, but I suspect the various manufacturers' communication languages and data formats for tidal vectors would make it necessary to write the basic algorithm and a multitude of interfaces to suit different boat/instrument combinations.

Most if not all of these things are available in standard NMEA sentences.

I recall that we would plot the Decca (!) readings against the straight line on the chart and if wit were nearly on the line when halfway we left well alone

Which straight line?

The predicted track would have been curved so you can't mean that one. And if you mean the straight-line track from departure to destination, then being on it at halfway may not be right at all - it depends on time of day relative to tide. My last crossing, our ground track was a banana rather than an S, so we were ten miles away from the straight line at halfway.

Pete

 

[sailorman]

Most if not all of these things are available in standard NMEA sentences.



Which straight line?

The predicted track would have been curved so you can't mean that one. And if you mean the straight-line track from departure to destination, then being on it at halfway may not be right at all - it depends on time of day relative to tide. My last crossing, our ground track was a banana rather than an S, so we were ten miles away from the straight line at halfway.

Pete

And you dont need software to determine that event, going "on the tide" is the only way unless one is a numpty or like`s to travel the scenic route

 

[prv]

quicker,shorter distance.

Shorter than what?

Why the need for software

Well indeed, but that's a different question, and blathering about waypoints and sailing a straight ground track which nobody ever suggested is still not relevant to it.

Pete