water in my oil

[Andy]

I am getting water in my oil (bmc 1.5 inbd diesel) but not losing any water from the fresh water heat exchanger!
I have checked the exhaust isn't running back.
It has no engine oil cooler.
It takes time to start but once running is ok.
Any ideas?

 

[chrisc]

CONDENSATION ?

 

[Trevor_swfyc]

Although you are not detecting a drop in the fresh water cooling header, I would suspect that this is the source of the water. Probably its not enough to notice a level drop, my first thought would be the head as the most likely cause.

It must be worth mentioning if it saves one person from this error, when running an engine ashore from a water supply NEVER connect the water direct to the pump supply. Use a reservoir (bucket) so the pump only takes what it requires. No I haven't done it but I know a man that did.

Good Luck
Trevor

 

[summerwind]

I agree that the head gasket is suspect. The difficulty in starting adds to my suspeicions.

Best of luck!

 

[longjohnsilver]

I would agree, either the head gasket or if you're really unlucky (as I was!) a liner could have split.

Whatever it is, you need to sort it out asap, could prove to be terminal otherwise.

 

[Andy]

Thanks for the replys.
today i have pumped out 1 pint of excess oil/water/fuel mix (whatever it is) from the sump and there is still the same amount of fresh water in the heat exchanger tank.

 

[mtb]

Yes the previous post's are correct ,these engines suffer from head distortions and cracks so before taking the head off get it compression tested .This is done by taking out the injectors ,WARNING make sure the diesel is disconnected and cant inject on to the person doing the test as the diesel will inject under the skin and could cause blood poisoning. You could also get an idea of which cylinder is down by cracking each injector nut in turn to see which one makes a difference to the idling speed ,give the engine chance to get back injector pressure before checking the next one, or the engine may cut out ,but dont forget the saftey stuff.
These do get a build up of condensation because the breather gets blocked ,but I dought that is the actual cause because oil emulsification is not the same as water in the oil .As long as the engine temperature is running at normal or was before the problem I would discount condensation.
Once the head is off get it skimmed also the valve guides / valves and also renew the glow plugs This is all well worth doing while the head is off
Cheers
Mick

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/boats
I want a big steel ex trawler / tug v/cheep or swap for tug

 

[boomer]

Andy

Have you actually confirmed that this pint of excess 'liquid' in your sump is in fact water? How? Could it be diesel? If so check your lift-pump, the diaphram could be split/holed, dumping fuel directly into the sump. This is a not uncommon fault with the small BMCs, and it nearly always presents with the 'difficult to start but OK when running' symptoms.

Dr Boomer

 

[longjohnsilver]

That makes sense Dr Boomer, could also check for scummy deposit on oil filler cap, another indication of water in oil. Also meant to say that it's worthwhile having the head pressure tested if you take it off.

Is there any sign of oily deposits in the header tank?

 

[mtb]

Yes ok, but I would expect the engine is going to airlock especially when not running, their buggers for air locking if there are any weak spots. and it would be a very quick end to the engine because the diesel would thin the oil .BD2 pumps are pretty good, actually I found a batch of new diaphragms the other day !! .
Mick

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/boats
I want a big steel ex trawler / tug v/cheep or swap for tug

 

[Juggler7823]

One suggestion not yet given is to check the water pump seals. Not familiar with the BMC 1.5 (depends on the marinisation anyway) but if they are standard 'marine' type pumps it could be the problem

Roy

 

[Trevor_swfyc]

Reil/water/fuel mix

Yikes this is more serious than we thought 1 pint is a lot.

Oil/water/fuel when mixed will give an emulsion which should settle out as oil/fuel is not miscible with water. Allow to settle out to give the true water contamination level. On my Volvo 2002 the water pump cannot let water into the oil as it has two seals an oil seal and a water seal with a drainage point between. Expect yours would be the same, it would be a crazy design fault otherwise. It would be helpfull to know if the water contains salt, a check with silver nitrate soln precipitates silver chloride if the water is salty.

Sorry that its still a mystery.
Trevor

 

[billskip]

Hi I found water in my oil..(perkins4108) the problem was the raw water pump..the pump is jbsco and the shaft had worn so both water and oil seals were letting by..there is a thrower ring but this did not give indication as would expect..the pump was mounted in a way so that a small amount of water could pass ..I fitted a new pump as the shaft and seals were almost the same price..problem solved

Bill
www.macsyachting.com
www.aegeansailing.co.uk

 

[vyv_cox]

If there really is no loss from the coolant heat exchanger the source must be from the raw water side. It is either entering via the raw water seals, as suggested elsewhere, or it is coming back from the exhaust side, flooding the manifold and entering via an exhaust valve. In some installations it seems to be possible for contraction of exhaust gases on cooling to pull water back from the trap and dump it in the engine. Make sure you have a siphon break in the exhaust if this is a possibility.

 

[Andy]

Thanks again for the extra suggestions.
The problem appeared to have started after i had removed the cylinder head due to shearing off a glow plug.After re-fitting head this liquid in the oil problem started.
I assumed i might have damaged the gasket or head so took the boat to a marine engineering company. They removed head, valves etc , pfd crack tested head , checked for any warp but nothing found.
The raw water pump can be ruled out as it is belt driven.
The oil i took from the sump looks like 'Baileys' and the rocker cover has cottage cheese inside!!!
i loosened the exhaust , ran the engine, stopped and pulled exhaust hose off but there was no run back.

 

[ParaHandy]

How long does it take to start - 30, 60secs? If too long, the water injection can "back-up" in the exhaust. (another theory around vyv-cox's). Try shutting the raw water feed off when starting (immediately open it again when running).

It might be useful to know what the poor starting is related to eg water being sucked in = clouds of white stuff in exhaust or the original repair to glow plug or something else entirely. Was it always a poor starter?

 

[PuffTheMagicDragon]

Just a thought - I went through this last month :>( If the gasket between the manifold / heat exchanger and the exhaust elbow is leaking there will not be enough pressure to blow the water out through the system. The raw water pump will continue to fill the line and, if yours is a sailing boat, the exhaust pipe will quickly fill up to the level of the manifold. I was fortunate in not getting any water into the engine (relatively new) but it could happen with an elderly one I think. Good luck.

Wally

 

[bob_tyler]

I recently had this problem in my car engine (petrol). After a 2 week idle period outdoors in the cold very damp weather which followed a period of short runs, I discovered mayonnaise on the dipstick and water droplets on the end.

Oil was also spraying out of the top of the dipstick hole and making a mess.

Had it drained, the breather pipe washed out and the engine run on flushing oil then drained and refilled.

Since refill - no problem!

Bob