Volvo MD1 Flywheel removal tool info Please

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astronomer2002

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Long story but basically I have a seized MD1 which I have decided to replace. Due to the weight and difficulty of getting it out I would like to reduce the weight at least by removing the flywheel as well as anything else I can get off.

I have removed the retaining nut already but can see a specialist tool is needed to get the flywheel bond to crack. Crack is what my old two leg puller did when I tried to use that.

I've searched on the web but cannot find the specification of the puller. Hopefully someone out there can help me.

What I need in particular is the hole separation in the plate and also it's thickness. I am guessing the four tapped holes in the flywheel are 8mm, but I do not know this for sure. I have lots of imperial bolts at hand but only 6 and 10mm metric!

I should explain the MD1 is in a Snapdragon 24 and access to the flywheel is somewhat restricted so measuring the hole centres is rather hit and miss. I would rather make a plate with holes in the right place first time as I am guessing the plate itself needs to be 12mm thick steel.

As an add-on question, has anyone taken off a MD1 gearbox in situ? I read that the gearbox shares oil with the engine so as I cannot seem to get the last half litre or so of oil out taking it off could be extremely messy.

Thankyou for any help.
 
It's many years since I removed my old MD1b, and the cuts and bruises I got doing it have long since healed, but if the engine compartment is even slightly like that of my Nic26, it's going to be impossible to strip in situ.

As to the flywheel, I tried clouting the crankshaft with a sledge hammer from the saloon after tapeing an oak offcut to the head of the hammer, cold and warm ( a blowlamp won't make the flywheel significantly hot ) to no avail.

It finally came out after I rigged a gantry over the main hatch and borrowed a chain hoist. Getting if off the boat and into my trailer was another problem, eventually solved by a "borrowed" JCB from a contractor working on site. A few beer tokens passed between us for that. I guess you won't have quite so far to lift it from a Snapdragon (or lower it), but with access being tight, there was no way the gearbox was coming off until the engine was out. Sorry to depress you, but unless there's a friendly neighbourhood Volvo specialist where you are, even getting the flywheel off is going to be a B*££@&.
 
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I should add that I have had the engine out before and put back. However, I am rather older now so a reduction in the overall weight is necessary.

When it came out before we did it by hand, struggling to manipulate it off the engine mountings and through the hatch. The flywheel was a real pain as it kept snagging on lips in the engine bay.

We got it from the cockpit to the ground by sliding it down an old ladder over the stern. Got it back the same way.

The MD1 weighs in at over 130Kg and I think the flywheel is about 20-30kg of that. I can get to the gearbox bolts, with some contortion, though I need to lift the back of the engine above the engine mounts to get to the bottom ones. I am just concerned about filling the inaccessible bilge with the remaining engine oil so would like to hear from someone who has actually taken the gearbox off a MD1.

I have the engine loose on it's bearers now so if I was a heavyweight lifter I might get it out as it is. Unfortunately I am not, and the passing years mean I doubt I can dead-lift it a few inches at a time whilst someone stacks wood under it, which is how we got it out 15 years ago.

I looked at those pullers on Ebay, but they are too small I am afraid. Also the threads on the provided bolts appear to be AF.

All I need is the hole centre distances on the flywheel so I can drill out a piece of steel to make my own puller. Confirmation as to what the thread is on the four flywheel puller holes would be helpful too. I am guessing 8mm as it is Swedish, but I have found odd bolt sizes on the MD1 before.

Ian B
 
VicS said:
Not that one.. It needs 4 equally spaced holes but that is the general idea

Volvo Penta tool 884078, which is now out of production, or a homemade copy is what is required. The same tool fits several of the old VP engines and is illustrated in the various workshop manuals
Click to expand...

Yes - that is what I need the details of. The bolt hole separation and flywheel bolt spec so I can get some. I have searched the web and found lots of images and links referring to the tool but no details of the hole layout or bolts.
 
From memory or was nearer 25 than 12 thick sorry can't help with bolt centres but you may get a drawing from VP site as they were used for mounting a pulley to drive an alternatorhttp://www.marinepartseurope.com/PentaPictures200/3859.jpg
 
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astronomer2002 said:
All I need is the hole centre distances on the flywheel so I can drill out a piece of steel to make my own puller. Confirmation as to what the thread is on the four flywheel puller holes would be helpful too. I am guessing 8mm as it is Swedish, but I have found odd bolt sizes on the MD1 before.

Ian B
Click to expand...

If no-one comes up with the answer, could you not measure the hole spacing, and gently try an 8mm machine screw in the holes?
 
I got the flywheel off an MD11 with a puller similar to the one suggested, probably just screwed into two holes...it was a while ago. The secret is to hit it: I don't think a puller like that will pull it off on its own. Once tensioned up as much as you dare, hit the central bolt head hard axially with a lump hammer. The resulting vicious shock wave will break the flywheel loose if you dare to hit hard enough. Beware though, if it comes off it will come with a scary bang and the flywheel is heavy enough to injure you if it gets out of control.

If you don't have room to do all that, my guess is that it will be easier to remove the engine with the flywheel in place.
 
I've just dug out my Md2b flywheel puller.
Steel block 100mm x100mm square. 25mm thick
Centre bolt diameter 17mm diameter.
4 pulling bolts 10mm diameter.
4 clearance holes for 10mm bolts to screw into flywheel, radially (not diagonally) 59mm (could be 60mm) centres
I can't part with it, as I've modified it for my Austin seven flywheels.
Not sure if it's genuine Volvo, but it has pulled the Md2b flywheel.
Slacken the centre nut a couple of turns. Do up the puller bolts hard tight and whack the centre puller bolt hard with a heavy hammer.
If you remove the flywheel nut, when the flywheel gives way, the flywheel will destroy anything in its path!
Fingers crossed!
 
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Thankyou for the replies.

As I said, I have already broken one traditional design puller so The four bolt anchor plate looks a better way to go. I think that if I use a 12mm plate it will be thick enough for a BSF or BSW thread in the middle.

I was hoping someone here had a puller or at least a MD1 flywheel they could get to easily to measure the hole separation. In the Snapdragon 24 I can see about half of the flywheel, maybe a little more, so measuring is hard and there's no swinging of sledge hammers to hit the central puller bolt as suggested above. If I use a 12mm plate I have enough clearance to get a spanner on the 1/2inch BSF bolt I plan to use, but I doubt I can get a socket on it. I can, and have, tried hitting the back, and front, of the flywheel with a 3lb club hammer. Just makes the whole engine sing.

I think the hole separation is 60mm, but that's mainly because I expect it to be round numbers rather than the 62mm I measured across one pair of holes. Of course, it might be imperial. I am also guessing the bolts are 8mm rather than 3/8 AF or BSF but there's so much paint and rust that it would be nice to be sure. Again, someone who has one or who has made one would know instantly. I simply cannot find anything on the web that does more than show images of what I want. I even have several links for the part number and on what other engine it is used. Very frustrating.

Although my wife would dearly love me to try a blow lamp on the engine whilst it's in the boat (so the damn thing would catch fire) this is simply not a practical option. Has anyone really ever used a blow lamp in the confined space of a small fibre glass cruiser engine bay to try and heat 30kg of cast iron flywheel?

Ian B
 
Major_Clanger said:
A normal 2-jaw puller should work. Put it on with some tension, then apply heat to the flywheel (not the crank). Once it's good and hot, hit the flywheel once smartly with a heavy hammer; it should come loose.
Click to expand...
Theory sounds good but in practice ??? and don't hit the flywheel plus that's a lot of metal to heat!
 
islecastle1 said:
I've just dug out my Md2b flywheel puller.
Steel block 100mm x100mm square. 25mm thick
Centre bolt diameter 17mm diameter.
4 pulling bolts 10mm diameter.
4 clearance holes for 10mm bolts to screw into flywheel, radially (not diagonally) 59mm (could be 60mm) centres
I can't part with it, as I've modified it for my Austin seven flywheels.
Not sure if it's genuine Volvo, but it has pulled the Md2b flywheel.
Slacken the centre nut a couple of turns. Do up the puller bolts hard tight and whack the centre puller bolt hard with a heavy hammer.
If you remove the flywheel nut, when the flywheel gives way, the flywheel will destroy anything in its path!
Fingers crossed!
Click to expand...

Just finished typing before seeing this. Thankyou!

The MD1 flywheel is surely the same, but the 10mm bolt I offered up wouldn't go in so I assumed they must be 8mm or 3/8. I shall look out a 10mm tap and see if I can make some inroads with that rather than the bolt.

60mm separation of the holes pretty well matches what I was thinking

25mm is very thick. Not sure I can tap that so going to try a thinner plate first. Even if I completely knacker it I only need to break the joint once. Never will I look at another Volvo again!

Ian B
 
astronomer2002 said:
Just finished typing before seeing this. Thankyou!

The MD1 flywheel is surely the same, but the 10mm bolt I offered up wouldn't go in so I assumed they must be 8mm or 3/8. I shall look out a 10mm tap and see if I can make some inroads with that rather than the bolt.

60mm separation of the holes pretty well matches what I was thinking

25mm is very thick. Not sure I can tap that so going to try a thinner plate first. Even if I completely knacker it I only need to break the joint once. Never will I look at another Volvo again!

Ian B
Click to expand...

Same part number for the puller.
 
astronomer2002 said:
Just finished typing before seeing this. Thankyou!

The MD1 flywheel is surely the same, but the 10mm bolt I offered up wouldn't go in so I assumed they must be 8mm or 3/8. I shall look out a 10mm tap and see if I can make some inroads with that rather than the bolt.

60mm separation of the holes pretty well matches what I was thinking

25mm is very thick. Not sure I can tap that so going to try a thinner plate first. Even if I completely knacker it I only need to break the joint once. Never will I look at another Volvo again!

Ian B
Click to expand...

I'll recheck the 10mm bolts tomorrow, and make sure that they bottom out.
 
Yes, engine and gearbox (if MS1) share oil and you will indeed create a huge mess, albeit not as huge as if you remove the gearbox then allow the coolant inlet to fill the hull up with sea...

You are welcome to borrow my chain hoist if you are local enough to Shoreham. I (most recently) used a big plank over the companionway to extract the engine then a halyard tied to the boom to swing it overboard. No real physical effort was required, just a few pieces of timber and ply to protect the interior.
 
First bit of advice is to only back retaining nut off maybe 1 or 2 threads, that will ensure bit does not fly and cause injury. Tighten up the puller until it is singing soprano, if nothing moves you need to hit it with a hammer, and I mean a hammer, not a toffee hammer, something of a 4lb lump hammer and indeed hit is the operative word not tap. The mass of the flywheel will absorb heat of a mere blowlamp, the only chance you have of temperature assistance is with a gas axe.
 
SAPurdie said:
Yes, engine and gearbox (if MS1) share oil and you will indeed create a huge mess, albeit not as huge as if you remove the gearbox then allow the coolant inlet to fill the hull up with sea...

You are welcome to borrow my chain hoist if you are local enough to Shoreham. I (most recently) used a big plank over the companionway to extract the engine then a halyard tied to the boom to swing it overboard. No real physical effort was required, just a few pieces of timber and ply to protect the interior.
Click to expand...

Thankyou for the offer of chain hoist loan, I am rather far from Shoreham I'm afraid.

Looking at the Snappy I am not sure I could get the engine hoisted high enough on the boom to lift it above the guard rails. I also have concerns for the 45 year old mast and boom with that 130-160kg on it. I know the wind forces can be greater, but they are different, and well.... it scares me. Might go this way for lifting the replacement Yanmar 1 GM10 on board as it is not much over half the weight, but it's a lot of faff putting up the mast just for this exercise. The boat is in my drive at home and has been there for 18 months. As it's been out of the water for more years that I like to mention we are going to replace all the standing rigging as well as the running rigging. To spread costs we planned to do this some time after the engine was in. This is a long project!

Ian B
 
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