VHF/DSC MMSI & call sign change!

pan

pan

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Hi, I am not sure if this has previously been covered before (someone no doubt will let me know where!) but I am having difficulty changing the registration details since buying off the previous owner. Unfortunately the broker & ourselves forgot about changing the registered details on the MMSI particulars of ships stations, when the boat was handed over! After enquiring with Spectrum licensing (who administer this) it seems the only way is for the original owner to surrender his licence and we apply for a new one (which presumably would create a new MMSI & call sign), when we contacted the original owner he could not remember his user name & log-in & now we cannot contact him at all, I have informed Spectrum, but they are insistant that either the previous owner surrenders or we apply for a new one (this part seems crazy to me, as there must be hundreds of craft registered, but now with different ships name or have been lost at sea etc)

Previous threads on here, seems to be quite a difficult thing to re-program into our VHF/DSC, so I would prefer just to change the registered ships name & contact details...

Hopefully someone can guide out of this bureaucratic nightmare... please!
 
You have to apply for a new one anyway. Anything else wouldn't make sense, as the license is issued to a person not a boat (a license is official permission to do something, in this case establish a radio station on a vessel, and you can't give an inanimate object permission). In theory the old one is meant to be surrendered, but I don't think not doing so prevents the issue of a new one.

When you take out the new license, there is a box to put in the existing MMSI and call-sign, so that you don't need to reprogram the radio. It's way simpler than you're worrying about :)

Pete
 
Thanks Pete, I get that, but then there would be 2 boats on the register with the same call sign & MMSI, as I said Spectrum suggest they cannot delete the original registration without owners requesting and they say they cannot contact them...
 
pan said:
Thanks Pete, I get that, but then there would be 2 boats on the register with the same call sign & MMSI, as I said Spectrum suggest they cannot delete the original registration without owners requesting and they say they cannot contact them...
Click to expand...

Well, I've done it...

I suspect when they get a request for a new license with the same MMSI as an existing one, they discreetly cancel the old license. It must happen all the time.

Anyway, if they'll issue you a license with the existing MMSI and call sign, everything's sorted from your point of view. Try it now and find out, takes a couple of minutes online and doesn't cost anything. If this results in their database being polluted with old entries then that's their problem, not yours. But I bet it doesn't.

Pete
 
And BTW, there's no such organisation as "Spectrum", outside 70s spy thrillers :). You're talking to the Spectrum Licensing department of Ofcom, ie the people who license the use of the radio spectrum.

Pete
 
pan said:
Thanks Pete, I get that, but then there would be 2 boats on the register with the same call sign & MMSI, as I said Spectrum suggest they cannot delete the original registration without owners requesting and they say they cannot contact them...
Click to expand...

But there is only one boat - yours now. The previous owner cannot transfer the MMSI to his new boat (if he has one). Just register as new although you still have the problem of reprogramming your devices if you can't use the old number. That is what I did when I bought my boat and was not sure the previous owner had surrendered his number.
 
When I bought my boat, Spectrum Licensing were very helpful in obtaining the MMSI code and call sign. When it subsequently turned out that the boat's MMSI had been incorrectly programmed with the wrong MMSI number, the original installer who'd I'd brought in to add AIS simply reprogrammed with radio without additional charge.

In many respects, I guess it's not just about the information registered with Ofcom, it's also ensuring you've got up to date information on the CG66.

Darryl
 
prv said:
And BTW, there's no such organisation as "Spectrum", outside 70s spy thrillers :). You're talking to the Spectrum Licensing department of Ofcom, ie the people who license the use of the radio spectrum.

Pete
Click to expand...

Hmmm, this is the organisation who have been replying to me, spectrum.licensing@ofcom.org.uk, which was the email address shown on the website. Anyway can you direct me where I make the application, I can't seem to find it, the replies I have had say that I have to register as a new user, before I can apply?
 
Tranona said:
Just register as new although you still have the problem of reprogramming your devices if you can't use the old number. That is what I did when I bought my boat and was not sure the previous owner had surrendered his number.
Click to expand...

So did it let you re-use the number? Because in both my cases, I doubt the old license was surrendered. One previous owner was completely disengaged, we never had any communication with him whatsoever, and the other was lovely to deal with but not at all technical and seems unlikely to have thought of surrendering the radio license. In fact, I think I may have looked in MARS and seen the old details there before I took out the new license.

Strictly speaking, the number identifies the boat for radio purposes (including MF/HF, Inmarsat, and possibly others, not just VHF) and is meant to stay the same throughout its life. So a new license with the same number is absolutely the right thing to be doing, and not just because it saves taking the VHF in to the dealer. I'm surprised that Ofcom don't have a process for cancelling old licenses without the holder's input when the boat has been sold, unless the de facto solution is allowing new licenses with the same number and overwriting the existing details in MARS as I suspect (whether or not they also formally cancel the old license in their own records).

Pete
 
pan said:
This is the website that I have been using to check the register & can't find how to register a new licence? Each time I email them, I get an immediate auto reply, then a detailed reply a week later! http://www.itu.int/online/mms/mars/ship_search.sh
Click to expand...

That site is the International Telecommunication Union's public list of ship radio stations. It's useful for looking up details since Ofcom don't publish their records directly, but they are not the people in the UK who issue your license.

Ofcom's self-service licensing system is here: https://services.ofcom.org.uk/ . You'll need to start with the "register as new individual user" link near the top. Afraid it's so long since I did that that I can't remember what happens next, but I don't remember it being difficult.

Once you've been through that and logged in, you will see a list of your licenses (will be empty) and a dropdown box at the bottom to "Apply for a new license". You want a "Ship radio license". It will then go through a series of pages asking you for all sorts of details, and at the end will spit out a PDF document for you to print and keep on board.

Make sure you put the existing MMSI in the relevant box when it comes up.

EDIT: Here's a screenshot of the main licensing system page:

screenshot10_zpseoivo31u.png


You can see I have three licenses, one for the main boat, one for a Zapcat-like catamaran RIB I have a part-share in, and one for my handheld which is licensed separately for use on any boat. The dropdown for starting a new application is at the bottom.

Pete
 
Last edited:
Thanks chaps, very helpful, now if someone could direct me where to apply for this, that would be brilliant!.... got it thanks Pete, this forum is excellent..:encouragement:
 
If it's a ship's radio you cannot transfer the licence to you. The vessel is registered with the radio not you. I have just undergone the exact same issue. A simple call to OFFCOM notifying them that you are now the owner of the vessel and you will need to create a new ship's licence in your name while they notify and delete the old account. Took all of 5 minutes. And I did not know the PO. I bought the boat direct from a broker stock.

useful link to determine previous PO / Callsign etc details - http://www.itu.int/online/mms/mars/ship_search.sh
 
Note also the "Terms and conditions" link in the menu bar on the left. This contains a static PDF with the actual terms of your license, and strictly speaking you're meant to print it out as well. It's a bit like an insurance contract, where there's the fixed "policy wording" booklet and then a "policy schedule" with your actual details on. In this case the main online system generates pages 1 and 2 of your license, and pages 3 to whatever are in the static PDF. The license as a whole consists of both parts.

Pete
 
Just apply for a new licence using the current MMSI number.

When I changed boats 2 years ago, I checked Mars, it was there with the previous owners details.

I filled in the Ofcom online thing with my details and the current MMSI. Printed the licence.

A few weeks later Mars showed my details.

That's what I did and it worked OK.

It is a bit scary to think that someone could hijack your boat radio licence without you knowing??????? But I guess what would there be to gain???
 
Alpha22 said:
It is a bit scary to think that someone could hijack your boat radio licence without you knowing??????? But I guess what would there be to gain???
Click to expand...

Never mind the radio license, you can apply for an SSR certificate for any boat you like the look of :). I know it says "not proof of ownership" right at the top, but a lot of people do seem to treat it as proof of something or other despite the fact that you just have to fill in a Web form and pay £25.

Pete
 
pan said:
Hi, I am not sure if this has previously been covered before (someone no doubt will let me know where!) but I am having difficulty changing the registration details since buying off the previous owner. Unfortunately the broker & ourselves forgot about changing the registered details on the MMSI particulars of ships stations, when the boat was handed over! After enquiring with Spectrum licensing (who administer this) it seems the only way is for the original owner to surrender his licence and we apply for a new one (which presumably would create a new MMSI & call sign), when we contacted the original owner he could not remember his user name & log-in & now we cannot contact him at all, I have informed Spectrum, but they are insistant that either the previous owner surrenders or we apply for a new one (this part seems crazy to me, as there must be hundreds of craft registered, but now with different ships name or have been lost at sea etc)

Previous threads on here, seems to be quite a difficult thing to re-program into our VHF/DSC, so I would prefer just to change the registered ships name & contact details...

Hopefully someone can guide out of this bureaucratic nightmare... please!
Click to expand...
I have the same problem I have the call sign for the boat and the mmsi number
The previous owner said they are not transferable but they are ?

So I will just use it in emergency call cannot see what the difference is as its registered to the correct boat with a different owner ?
 
The mmsi and call sign should stay with the boat.
Apply for your ships radio license in your name using the Ofcom website.
 
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