VAT not paid - VAT claim

[luckybeanz]

Hi, I am sure there is plenty of discussion on here regarding VAT, but searing for VAT brings up no results so I wanted to put this out there.

I am looking to buy a boat 1987 in Greece, the boat was manufactured and first bought in the UK, is currently registered in Germany and has been in the EU for many years. The owner of the boat can not find any evidence of VAT being paid, although insists it has been paid, and as such I am going to be purchasing the boat as VAT not paid. I will be registering the boat in the UK ( I have not resided anywhere for the last 5 years, - of no permanent abode and intend to keep this lifestyle just on the water not land), so am open to registering the boat in the EU if it would be better.

What would people here suggest to minimize the VAT I need to pay? I am self employed and as such could register for VAT (although my income is below the GBP80000 tor require registration) , since I'll be using the boat as a home and an office/workspace (I am a travel blogger/photographer www.luckybeanz.com) would I be able to claim the VAT back. Has anyone got any experience with this?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

[colind3782]

The general consensus on these forums is that no-one will be interested in the VAT on a boat of that age.

 

[Champagne Murphy]

If you are an RYA member I’m sure their legal department can advise.

 

[luckybeanz]

Thanks for the replies. I do really hope that no one is interested, but judging by :
https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...ailing-your-pleasure-craft-to-and-from-the-uk

Certain vessels that were in use as private pleasure craft prior to 1 January 1985 and were in the EU on 31 December 1992, may be deemed VAT paid under the Single Market transitional arrangements. As Austria, Finland and Sweden joined the EU later, the relevant dates for vessels in these countries are ‘in use’ before 1 January 1987 and moored in EU on 31 December 1994.

I may be just out of luck and would rather consider the VAT unpaid than have a nasty surprise.

I'll try contact the RYA, thank you.

 

[lw395]

Unless your yacht is a proper profit centre, claiming any VAT back or other mixing of business and yacht is a red rag to a bull with HMRC.
If you are buying from an individual, there is no need to pay any VAT, any more than if you buy a car. There is no VAT to reclaim.
It would be good to have as much 'chain of ownership' showing it's been owned by private individual EU citizens for as long as possible and has not left the EU, changed hands and been re-imported, giving rise to a VAT bill.

 

[JumbleDuck]

I may be just out of luck and would rather consider the VAT unpaid than have a nasty surprise.

Nobody checks. Nobody cares. You won't get a nasty surprise. Rock up at Cowes in a million quids' worth of Morris Yachts elegance with a US flag and list it for sale and yes, HMRC ears may prick up, but otherwise you are simply throwing money away. Up to you if you want to do that, of course.

 

[Tranona]

Hi, I am sure there is plenty of discussion on here regarding VAT, but searing for VAT brings up no results so I wanted to put this out there.

I am looking to buy a boat 1987 in Greece, the boat was manufactured and first bought in the UK, is currently registered in Germany and has been in the EU for many years. The owner of the boat can not find any evidence of VAT being paid, although insists it has been paid, and as such I am going to be purchasing the boat as VAT not paid. I will be registering the boat in the UK ( I have not resided anywhere for the last 5 years, - of no permanent abode and intend to keep this lifestyle just on the water not land), so am open to registering the boat in the EU if it would be better.

What would people here suggest to minimize the VAT I need to pay? I am self employed and as such could register for VAT (although my income is below the GBP80000 tor require registration) , since I'll be using the boat as a home and an office/workspace (I am a travel blogger/photographer www.luckybeanz.com) would I be able to claim the VAT back. Has anyone got any experience with this?

Thanks in advance for any advice.

There is no mechanism for an individual like you buying a used boat that is in the EU with a history to demonstrate that. so, forget about it and buy it, getting as much history as you can of past ownership.

You do have a potential problem with putting the boat on a register which you will need to do. Your best bet if you are a UK citizen is to register it on Part 1 which is expensive because you need an official survey and evidence of secure title going back 5 years. Suggest you contact the Registry in Cardiff for advice as to whether it is possible.

As a person not resident formally anywhere you will find it difficult to register a boat because most national registers are resident or citizen based. There is no such as an EU register.

 

[maby]

Unless your yacht is a proper profit centre, claiming any VAT back or other mixing of business and yacht is a red rag to a bull with HMRC.
......

Definitely! We floated the possibility of making our boat a company expense and gave our accountant a heart attack. She claimed that she could get almost anything through as a company expense - apart from boats and horses. Any attempt to claim for either of those items is likely to have HMRC all over you like a rash!

 

[maby]

...

As a person not resident formally anywhere you will find it difficult to register a boat because most national registers are resident or citizen based. There is no such as an EU register.

Liberia seems to be fairly flexible!

 

[DownWest]

As he is not resident in any place.. One idea is to register in an offshore place like Gib with a company ownership. German friend did this to maintain the part one on his UK yacht before the EU mess. So I imagine it is still possible if one is not resident in UK for an SSR.
Any big yacht seems to fly the Duster as they are reged in UK offshore 'places'. Just needs a company with a couple of nominated directors . Owned a house under that regime in Iberia.

 

[Tranona]

As he is not resident in any place.. One idea is to register in an offshore place like Gib with a company ownership. German friend did this to maintain the part one on his UK yacht before the EU mess. So I imagine it is still possible if one is not resident in UK for an SSR.
Any big yacht seems to fly the Duster as they are reged in UK offshore 'places'. Just needs a company with a couple of nominated directors . Owned a house under that regime in Iberia.

You don't need a company if you are a UK citizen, just a representative in the UK. That is why I suggest he talked to Cardiff explaining his situation in detail. He does not tell us enough about himself to give more than general guidance.

 

[JumbleDuck]

As a person not resident formally anywhere you will find it difficult to register a boat because most national registers are resident or citizen based.

In practice, is anything more than a UK address required for SSR? Do "they" actually cross-check against the electoral roll? For that matter, could he not just get a friend in the UK to register it?

 

[DownWest]

In practice, is anything more than a UK address required for SSR? Do "they" actually cross-check against the electoral roll? For that matter, could he not just get a friend in the UK to register it?

Doubt it for the SSR, but a local Brit tried to renew his driving licence at 70, using a UK address and got a blank 'no, you don't live in UK.'

 

[sailaboutvic]

VAT as most have said it's not going to be a problem , it may became one when you go to sell it , but then as you got a good discount you could offer the same to a new owner .
Register the boat , I wouldnt go for off shore it could course you a more of a problem many many people are register they boats in Belgium and Holland , maybe worth looking into that ,
Same as the old SSR , fill a form pay your money and off you go .
If your in Greece have a chat with other Dutch and Belgium.

 

[sailaboutvic]

In practice, is anything more than a UK address required for SSR? Do "they" actually cross-check against the electoral roll? For that matter, could he not just get a friend in the UK to register it?

I think you find now you can only pay with a back account in the Name and address of the person who is registered it .

 

[JumbleDuck]

I think you find now you can only pay with a back account in the Name and address of the person who is registered it .

Sorry, I wasn't clear. Does it matter whether registration is in the name of O. Poster or A. Friend?

 

[sailaboutvic]

Sorry, I wasn't clear. Does it matter whether registration is in the name of O. Poster or A. Friend?

Make a change from me not making my posting clear .
He could get a friend to reg in his name but them that comes with problem , insurance would need to be in the name of the reg owner other wise when he visit other country and they ask from reg document his passport it's not going to match up .
Then he going to have to have. Letter stating he can use the boat , and so on , and IF they want to see prove of ownership i.e. Sales document , which so far I never been ask for , there anthor problem ,
Top it up if friend insurance it too and something happen , not sure the insurance company will pay out .
When they find out the boat doesn't belong to the insurances.
Best bet just registered it in another country and be done with .

 

[PaulRainbow]

Sorry, I wasn't clear. Does it matter whether registration is in the name of O. Poster or A. Friend?

Easiest way would be to use be to use the friends address. You can register on the SSR and pay online, giving a friend/family members address and the registration gets sent there.

 

[bigwow]

Definitely! We floated the possibility of making our boat a company expense and gave our accountant a heart attack. She claimed that she could get almost anything through as a company expense - apart from boats and horses. Any attempt to claim for either of those items is likely to have HMRC all over you like a rash!

You need to add racing cars to that list:disgust:

 

[sailaboutvic]

Easiest way would be to use be to use the friends address. You can register on the SSR and pay online, giving a friend/family members address and the registration gets sent there.

Paul as I said , they stop all that , now you have to pay by bank card , it as to be in the name and adress of the registered person . So if you now use a friends address as soon as the card don't match up with that address they won't issue the SSR. Plus it can be class as making a false statement.