Used boat prices

[Guest]

How much should I spend on my first boat, Quite like the idea of a trailer, lowcost to start with, and as I mentioned in previous post, want to go to France with it (when I have the experience) for weekenders.

please email me your thoughts. I'm thinking along the lines of a 28ft Bayliner/ sundancer type thing. (used, say upto 10 years old)

What is the life expectancy of a motorboat? Does GRP etc wear out, or break down?


Many Thanks

Jonathan

 

[Guest]

I started with a Shetland Family Four 25hp which we trailed to Poole/Plymouth River Avon/Severn.
Just moved up to a Cruisers International 224 Holiday..24' long Volvo V8 (which we trail about with a Discovery..you'll need something equally as meaty!)hot water, shower standing headroom, 4-6 berth, lots of teak.
See previous posts on discussions between Bayliners/224s.
224 is brilliant sea boat (MBM report)
Max

 

[hlb]

Cant email you with our thought. Cos our thoughts are property of IPC. It says so and so does Kimatolah. If we send emails, they can not be Kimerised and our thoughts can therefore not be rearranged. Besides, you have not left your address.
Anyway you seem to know what you want. So thats OK. Suppose GRP does wear out eventualy. More to do with how good it was in the first place and how well its treated.

No one can force me to come here-----------
----- I'm a Volunteer!!!

Haydn

 

[longjohnsilver]

Towing?!

IMHO 28' boat far too large to trail, maybe once a year for a few miles to and from the water but not much more.

Once had a 21' boat on a purpose built Bramber 4 wheel trailer and even that was a pain in the a##e. Not even sure something of that size would be road legal. Much better to start of with something smaller to see if you like it, then move bigger and keep it somewhere you like.

 

[hlb]

Good thinking John. I'd missed that bit. No you cant go around towing that thing about. The law is very strange where trailors are concirned. But forgetting that. It's to much to tow about with a big 4x4.

No one can force me to come here-----------
----- I'm a Volunteer!!!

Haydn

 

[Guest]

Bayliner 2855 (28ft) is illegal to tow (too heavy/too wide). You can tow a Bayliner 2655 behind Disco/Landcruiser etc.

Searay Sundancers are nice boats and are a big step up from bayliners in terms of quality and price. They are heavier than bayliners foot for foot so the biggest sundancer you can tow will be the 240.

I believe towing a boat gives you excellent flexible cruising, but if you have never towed anything before a 26 sportscruiser is not the place to start. They are massive behind even the biggest 4x4 and require experience and total concentration.

Try starting a bit smaller.If you have to have 4 inside berths try an early 90's Bayliner 2255. One in nice condition with trailer should be about 12-15k. Or for another 3-5k a Sealine 215/218. If you dont need the berths try a 20ft cuddy. This section of the market is relativly new so theres not many cuddys out there over 7 years old. With these boats best idea is to get out there and see which ones suit you. Try Four Winns, Chapperal,Mariah, Glastron or Rinker. (Not in any particular order.)

You will get lots of advice about diesel for running cost,reliability and safety. But in this size and price range petrol is the only viable alternative.

All IMHO of course

Hope this helps.

 

[lanason]

Hey - join the HOLIDAY CLUB.

You can get a really nice early '80's Fairline Holiday 23 foot for well under £15k. Four berths inside. nice size, and towable, but everyone is right you do need to be an experianced tower. I have been towing caravans (p.s. I've heard ALL the Caravan jokes - so guys spare your effort!!!)
for years.

I found about 25 of em for sale earlier this year before I bought mine.

What Car do you have now ???

Adrian

Any jobs going ??

 

[coliholic]

Or you could try one of these:

http://home.hvc.rr.com/k2ds/images/george.jpg

No need for a trailer all self contained and ready to go.

 

[kghowe]

We jumped in at the deep end and went for a Targa 27 for our first boat.

This has been an excellent all rounder with plenty of entertainment room in the cockpit for those heady days of summer (we use to get...??) but also with a good turn of speed and safe if situations get tricky. She's an excellent sea boat too. We have a young family so two engines were a major consideration in choosing a boat. We liked the solid build and Peters are just down the road from where I live. She also has the potential of going cross channel if you wanted to.

The only thing we ever trailed around was a jet ski which, behind our Shogun was a doddle. I wouldn't like to pull a 2-3 ton boat behind us. We've had big caravans before and they can somtimes get err.... interesting, especially in the wet, down hill with your foot off the gas pedal, never mind 2-3 ton boats. Makes jelly look like a sound solid substance.

I was down at Peters today and they have a particularly nice T27 for sale at the moment IMHO.

All down to size of pocket and the type of cruising your planning on.

Good luck
KGH

 

[Col]

And so stylish too......NM

.

http://www.arweb.co.uk/argallery/album02/

 

[gjgm]

I ve just been looking into the towing aspect myself, and as far as I can tell NO ONE can get to the bottom of it. Even the Police said, blimey.. this is tricky. Main points-I think- are width of trailer 2,30m plus about 30cm either side, length of trailer 7m (but its not defined which part of the trailer counts), and towing capablility of the vehicle. Then theres never ending detail on lights, boards, overhangs and different laws for how much etc etc. By the time you are up to about 24ft, I d think you are getting very close to wrong side of your insurance company-even if no one is quite sure why. Unless you use a commercial vehicle.. then its all different again. Trailers... make sure its UK legal.. and yes there are plenty of rules there.. almost certain an older USA trailer wont be. Bear in mind the actual frame is almost free;hitch,axles,drums,shoes,suspension cost all the money. I was recently estimated 1500stg to sort out a US trailer FYG. And do remember that if you put your trailer into sea water, all those parts are going to get ruined. Flush it, of course, but bear in mind you will need to budget for servicing and repairs. When it comes to budget, have a look at trailer sailing to keep those marina costs down. Have a look how much a 28ft boat is going to cost you kept in the water, lifted out, antifouled stored ashore...Just might influence just how large a boat you really want. Lastly, however much care you take in choosing your first boat, remember you will want to change it. Fact of life. Wrong shape, wrong colour,wrong layout,wrong engine.. something !! Dont buy something you cant sell. Then you will find out the really expensive aspect of boating !! Have alot of fun...

 

[tcm]

Re: first boat rules

1. Underspending can be as big a problem as overspending. Overspend, you'll at least have a fab boat, and a large mortgage. Underspend, and you (or wife etc) won't want to go.
2. Underspend II. You will eventually sell the first boat. But you can delay this by buying a boat to which the phrase "dip toe in water" can't applied.
3. Decide what you want the boat to do, and and get one that's good at that. River, Coastal, Med, Trailer all different, and then extended trips/weekends and how many people?

Seprtetly, I think 28 foot trailerboat is a bit huge unless you are v good at driving articulated trucks and are already Caravan Parking Hero Man. There are good 23/24 footers with kipping spaces, good to trailer and maybe sleep aboard, maybe get hotel. 28footer is mucho more than 23 - compare the cubes of 23 and 28 for a more realistic idea of the difference. But there those that do it.

Boats can theoretically be kept going a long time (20yrs plus) and modern mat'ls may make basic elements last even longer. Note that the yanks are better at engineering to a price, so some items (er lots of deck gear and most of the interior) won't be repairable but starts needing replacing after 10years. Otherwise depends on how much time you are willing to spend fixing instead of using the boat.

 

[hlb]

Re: To Sum It Up

You can have a boat on a trailer and poodle about up rivers or just around the coast on a good day. But not going to far. else you will run out of juice or nowhere to sleep. You can have a Binliner. Big for the money but with petrol engines and fall to bits in big waves. Or buy a British or euoropean boat with two diesels. Pay more money. But then go to France no problem. Course if your going from Dover you can go in a rowing boat. So that depends to.

No one can force me to come here-----------
----- I'm a Volunteer!!!

Haydn

 

[Guest]

Ah, yes. The 28 footer on a trailer. Let's assume it'll fit legally (which I doubt). So then you've got your boat in the water and it's time to go home. A 28 footer probably displaces something like 3.5 tonnes, and draws 3' of water. So you need to get your trailer into about 5 foot of water to get it under the boat. Now set to with the hand winch, pulling those 3.5 tonnes up the STEEP slope. It's steep, remember, because otherwise, the roof of your car is under water...

Towing anything over 20' is a pain in the arse. Towing and launching anything over 23-24' is impossible, IMHO. Towing anything for more than 50 miles is also a real bummer, so think about where you live and where you want to go boating, as well.

 

[sjnewport]

Agree with everyone about towing 28 footer around,but don't let others put you off of 23-24 footer to tow.
We changed last year to smaller boat to tow around [sealine 218] Best thing we have ever done.
Still have shower,cooker,fridge,sleeping for family etc[obviously smaller space so slightly more cramped].
Lots more options available with towing as access to new waterways quicker by road than water.
Thinking of taking boat to western isles of Scotland in August from Bristol.
Hours by road,days by water!!1
Towing no problem. Both me and my wife tow the boat and she drives whilst launching with me on the winch.
Never had a problem launching or recovering her,on any slipway.
We tow behind Shogun,no problem and have regularly passed police cars and they don't give us a second glance,so I presume we are legal!!
One thing though if you or partner are unsure about boating and whether you will enjoy it a smaller boat can put more of a strain on things,especially if it's piddling down!!!
we have benn boating for 15 years so knew we liked it before we took plunge from 29 feet down to 22!!
Go for the trailable boat....Good luck!

 

[Guest]

Graham, last weekend due to unforseen circumstances (SWIMBO had a massive hangover and refused to help) I both launched and recovered our 28ft, 3000kg sportscruiser on my own.

It just requires organisation and practice. The slip I used had room for 2 boats at a time I cleared the slip by the time the 4 lads with a 15ft sports boat next to me were still trying to line the trailer up.

I also towed the boat 2000 miles to menorca last year and it was that hard i'm dreading doing it again this year,and next, and next .......

All IMHO of course

 

[tcm]

tellus more

This sounds a mighty trip. How long does it take, wot ferry do you use, etc??

 

[Chris771]

Re: Used boat prices & Towing

Obviously I have towed too many boats too far, as I cannot agree with some of the scary posts. I have always kept to around 24' and towed it behind a 4 x 4. As far as I know the max width permitted is about 8.5' and all up load about 2.8 tonnes, with wide load signs you can go about a foot wider.

With a decent purpose built trailer and larger 4 x4 it has never presented me with any real problems. When I first bought the big trailer I was not accustomed to towing, so a spent a Sunday afternoon reversing around a deserted car park until I had got the hang of manoeuvring it all. Since then it has never been a problem, though common sense needs to be employed, the bigger they get the slower they tow.

I previously had a 25' boat which weighed about 2.5 tonnes all up. That towed safely at about 40 mph, though it was better with empty tanks than full. Half full (unbaffled) tanks were worse, where slopping liquids could cause snaking at around 45 mph.

The boat I've had for the last few years is a 23.5 ft Skibsplast with an all up weight of just on 2 tonnes. On a rollercoaster trailer, properly set up and balanced she tows in a very stable manner at 50-55mph. Obviously you do need to look well ahead and slow gradually, but the rig has survived a couple of emergency stops without undue drama.

I have towed her from Lancashire to the South Coast several times and to Pwllheli last weekend. The last tow was a pain on the Welsh lanes because it was pouring with rain and it was near impossible to see anything in the nearside mirror, which was a bit worrying with high stone walls as I had to guess how far off the wall the trailer was.

I have just ordered a new trailer from SBS for my new boat (Antares 760, coming next month) which at 2.6 tonnes and 27ft overall is just pushing the limit and will have to be towed "dry" to be legal. As this lacks the aerodynamics of Polar Fox I expect the maximum safe towing speed to be in the region of 40 mph and she will need wide load signs at 9ft beam. The intention is just to tow her a few miles to and from the boatyard at the beginning and end of season. I would consider this rig too big for regular long distance towing.

Having towed several boats thousands of miles I would consider about 24 ft to be a practical and safe maximum. Up to 27ft is safe only for a few miles at slow speed behind a large 4 x 4. Any larger and you need specialist transport. Behind a car I would say 21ft is the absolute maximum, even then a car with it's high first gear will really struggle on a slipway. With a 4 x 4 it is simply low ratio first, drop the clutch and away you go up the slip at 2 mph. With a car it will be lots of revs and a hot slipping clutch.

Have a look at the link and you will see what I have been towing comfortably for several years.

Chris

www.impact-computers.net/boat/cruiser.htm

 

[david_e]

Re: [url]www.impact-computers.net/boat/[/url]

1. Can't quite see the rag & stick you are towing up the Ribble, any other piccies that show it?

2. Is that a totally blind or partially blind bend you are parked on?

3. Assume that because you are on double yellows (as well as the bend) that you must have been in distress - waiting for a tow)

 

[lanason]

Re: Used boat prices & Towing

Great pictures of the boat (bloke inside well .... ;-)))
What is the Towcar is it a Ssasyong ??




Adrian

Any jobs going ??