Urgent advice needed... GIBSEA 84. Can she take the ground on hard sand?

[Sardinianwave]

Hello
After long search I think I found a new boat that meet all my criteria. It's Gibsea 84 lift keel.
Issue is that the mooring I have available at present is a river mooring (Exe) on hard sand.
Do you have experience on how well does she takes the ground?
Many thanks

 

[Stemar]

IIRC, the keel lifts into a stub that projects below the hull, so good for shallow water, but not to take the ground without leaning over a long way.

Yes, according to this:

GIB'SEA 84 - sailboatdata

 

[Sandy]

Not really...

I have had my Gib'Sea 96 fin keel alongside at Topsham quay and on her side for a night on a mooring on the Exe.

Personally, I'd be looking for a deeper mooring. I left the Exe as I felt that it is silting up.

 

[fredrussell]

I think many/most of the French built lift keel boats of that period are as Stemar describes. For drying out on hard sand I’d be looking for a bilge-keeler or a British lift-keeler such as a Hunter, Seal or Parker and a few others.

 

[Charlie Boy]

They can get stones caught between the stub and the moving keel. This happened to us when we had a Gibsea. It was a one off

 

[Overandunder]

I've had 2 lift keel boats, and the flexibility they offer I think is hard to beat. Not always as good to sail as a deep fin perhaps - but better than most bilge keelers (ducks for cover ). If drying out on hard sand I would also buy a set of legs (a lot of lift keel boats of that age had the mounting plates factory installed).

My current boat has a different take on it as it has twin rudders and is designed to dry out using them. It only draws .75 metre - or 1.8m with the plate down.

Lots of plus points - having a plate down means if you do stray out of a channel when tacking - you merely wind the plate up and gybe off the bank. Shallow anchorages / moorings are also available that deep keelers can't entertain. This help keeps costs down to as you are less dependent on marinas too. Lift keelers are always popular in places like Poole harbour.

The French use these designs to good advantage in drying harbours and dodge hefty marina fees of course (although marina prices there are usually kinder than ours !).

2 issues can occur though - if the sand is really hard then depending on how exposed the harbour is, I would be cautious. If it sits in mud - this can push water, stones and mud up the keel case as the boat settles. If I had a choice I would choose a shallow mooring that rarely if ever dries. The boat will usually dig itself a hole to sit in anyway and will be fine.

 

[Refueler]

On hard sand ... not a good idea .... as she takes or lifts - she will be bouncing / grinding that keel stub .. and possibly then lean over as she settles.

If the bottom is soft mud - then no problem.

My Father had a lift keel Snapdragon ... she was moored but in reasonably soft mud ... and had a longer semi keel ... we used to dry out on beaches / hard ground and she would stay upright - but as I say - she had a longer semi keel than the Gibsea.

 

[Overandunder]

On hard sand ... not a good idea .... as she takes or lifts - she will be bouncing / grinding that keel stub .. and possibly then lean over as she settles.

If the bottom is soft mud - then no problem.

My Father had a lift keel Snapdragon ... she was moored but in reasonably soft mud ... and had a longer semi keel ... we used to dry out on beaches / hard ground and she would stay upright - but as I say - she had a longer semi keel than the Gibsea.

Yes I agree re: hard sand - but that won't be a problem for this type of keel as it's iron and pretty long, it won't wear away. The potential issue is with any chop present while it's lifting / falling on the tide, hence my caution. In a reasonably sheltered harbour it would be fine - but on an exposed estuary mooring I wouldn't be very happy. Beaching legs keep them upright of course - as can be seen on many boats in French drying harbours.

 

[mrming]

I believe most French swing keel designs from the 80s and 90s exist because of a need to get over shallow bars on certain parts of their coastline. They’re not usually designed to take the ground, with a few exceptions such as the Beneteau 311. I had a swing keel First 235 and would never dry out on hard sand without beaching legs. A British bilge keeler would likely do the job. Have a look and see what other designs are in the moorings, preferably still afloat.

 

[jwilson]

Really not designed for what you have in mind. Any swell/waves as she settles aground or lifts from heeled over and hull side on bottom and you are bumping much of the weight of the hull on a bit of quite thin curved GRP hull side, not an iron keel.

 

[Overandunder]

I believe most French swing keel designs from the 80s and 90s exist because of a need to get over shallow bars on certain parts of their coastline. They’re not usually designed to take the ground, with a few exceptions such as the Beneteau 311. I had a swing keel First 235 and would never dry out on hard sand without beaching legs. A British bilge keeler would likely do the job. Have a look and see what other designs are in the moorings, preferably still afloat.

Not without legs no, but in a sheltered area it would work ok.