Update on proposed marina at Fishguard, Pembrokeshire

Telstar26

Telstar26

Well-Known Member
Joined
23 Aug 2004
Messages
204
Location
Fishguard, Pembs
www.parkerseal.org.uk
Yesterday I went to a local meeting about the proposed Fishguard/Goodwick marina. Outline planning permission was granted for it last April - 450 berths, 253 apartments etc.

The meeting was organised by the Fishguard and Goodwick Bay Conservation Group. It was well attended, but there seemed to be more people opposed to the plans than supporting them.

The main objections were:
1. The plans include an extra 19 acres of reclaimed land for the commercial port - what will that be used for?
2. Who will live in all the apartments? Will they be separate or part of the community?
3. Will the marina and apartments cause pollution? (sewage)
4. Disruption during building phase
5. The marina at nearby Milford Haven has not been successful - all the shops are empty. But Neyland Marina has worked.
6. Destruction of medieval fish trap, loss of beach, effects on wildlife
7. Will it cause the harbour to silt up?
8. It will affect existing holiday rentals market

There were some positive points raised as well:
1. Good site for a marina: a day's sail from Milford or Aberystwyth, the only deep water port on this bit of coast, good rail connections
2. It will also encourage promising young dinghy sailors to stay in Fishguard (poor facilities at present)
3. Short and long term employment
4. The area desperately needs investment (any investment!)
5. Will add modern housing stock to the area
6. Will increase tourism

Personally I'd be interested to know who (else!) would keep their boat there. The developers (Conygar) must have done some market research to think 450 berths are feasible, but I'm a bit doubtful...
 
One positive point that you miss and which effort was made to identify was that the harbour must have some scope for development.

The issue with the current proposal is that the only possibly harbour related development (the platform) has no identified use, may be exempt from a future planning process even though it's use may not directly relate to the harbour and is the major component in the development plan.
 
We would definitely use it en route to Ireland, as I am sure lots of people would from the South.

My family come from this area, and some still live in Fishguard. I cannot believe there is still mo marina there. The area at Goodwick is perfect, which is where I assume it will be. It will enhance a fairly boring bay......what beach are they talking about? All I remember from windsurfing there 20 years ago are stones..........

However I am certain that 450 berths is way too many, and ditto 253 apartments. It is not the prettiest place in Pembrokeshire, even though the rail link is good.It is a fair old walk uphill into town and over to old Fishguard which is pretty. So I don't think its the honeypot site the builders may think it is.
 
I live near Cardigan and did keep my 37ft boat in Cardigan for a couple of years. However, since moving to Milford about 3 years ago I think that The Haven is fantastic. Fishguard although 35 mins driving time nearer, can't compete with The Haven so I would not be moving.
 
I sailed from the S Coast to Scotland last year and called in at Milford Haven and Fishguard. I will put some answers below from our point of view.

Telstar26 said:
Yesterday I went to a local meeting about the proposed Fishguard/Goodwick marina. Outline planning permission was granted for it last April - 450 berths, 253 apartments etc.

The meeting was organised by the Fishguard and Goodwick Bay Conservation Group. It was well attended, but there seemed to be more people opposed to the plans than supporting them. Nimbyism??

The main objections were:
1. The plans include an extra 19 acres of reclaimed land for the commercial port - what will that be used for? Whatever its used for it might bring some jobs to a deprived area of the UK...?
2. Who will live in all the apartments? Will they be separate or part of the community? I am Welsh and I sometimes despair at the parochialism of my fellow countrymen and women. The answer is that they will be part of the local community if they are made welcome!
3. Will the marina and apartments cause pollution? (sewage) No doubt the engineers will have though about this...
4. Disruption during building phase So what? Nothing much else happens in Fishguard if one is honest...Hopefully the disruption will be managed appropriately - but its a good question to ask.
5. The marina at nearby Milford Haven has not been successful - all the shops are empty. But Neyland Marina has worked. Milford Haven is not a very attractive town - why would you want to put your boat there? Its also easier to get to the Neyland side...
6. Destruction of medieval fish trap, loss of beach, effects on wildlife. Good question and hopefully they will have done their research etc.
7. Will it cause the harbour to silt up?
8. It will affect existing holiday rentals market. Uuh - why would it do that? It might actually increase holiday rentals I suggest.

There were some positive points raised as well:
1. Good site for a marina: a day's sail from Milford or Aberystwyth, the only deep water port on this bit of coast, good rail connections. I agree - I was amazed at the paucity of facilities when we got there.
2. It will also encourage promising young dinghy sailors to stay in Fishguard (poor facilities at present) Will it? How is that going to work then?
3. Short and long term employment Who knows?
4. The area desperately needs investment (any investment!) It certainly does...
5. Will add modern housing stock to the area. Not at prices the locals will pay I suspect...
6. Will increase tourism Yes it might...

Personally I'd be interested to know who (else!) would keep their boat there. The developers (Conygar) must have done some market research to think 450 berths are feasible, but I'm a bit doubtful...
Click to expand...
 
If outline PP has been grqnted.. then the NIMBY's are being just plain stupid, (as is their ususl want) to be objecting to principles such as building a marina in the first instance...

The next stage simply looks at finishes, and other inmprtant details which canaffect the operation and appearance... however, hothing that is done at the detail stage should interfere with the principle to build the marina and flats..
 
stayed there at anchor for 4 nights in the main harbour, horrible place, lovely folk, no interest from harbour master in commercial harbour and none at all from the very small yacht harbour when he discovered we were bigger than 20 feet and had a fin keel.
The place needs a face lift, but a marina, no.
 
ukmctc said:
......
The place needs a face lift, but a marina, no.
Click to expand...

Ah the old chestnut... how to get a facelift without doing anything..The only way to get a facelift is to bring in money from outside. That means people with money need a reason to visit which they could not find before.. Lets be honest, before the crash in 2008 we had the longest period of uninterupted growth in recorded history... yet even then places like Fishguard did not benefit and nothing changed.. indeed the place is slowly going downhill..

So yes the place needs a marina ...
 
Tomahawk said:
Ah the old chestnut... how to get a facelift without doing anything..The only way to get a facelift is to bring in money from outside. That means people with money need a reason to visit which they could not find before.. Lets be honest, before the crash in 2008 we had the longest period of uninterupted growth in recorded history... yet even then places like Fishguard did not benefit and nothing changed.. indeed the place is slowly going downhill..

So yes the place needs a marina ...
Click to expand...

No, not at all, if it didn't get it back then........it aint worth it now.
 
Telstar26 said:
Yesterday I went to a local meeting about the proposed Fishguard/Goodwick marina. Outline planning permission was granted for it last April - 450 berths, 253 apartments etc.
Click to expand...
I anchored there one night on the way back to Shoreham from Pwllheli. It's a nice anchorage and I think they should leave it like that.

Boo2
 
Dont need another marina here,cant see it bringing much to the local economy, like most marinas it would soon fill up with boats that would be left unused for most of the year.
 
Thanks for your views, john_morris_uk - pretty much the same as mine. Regarding dinghy sailing: at the moment there's nowhere to park them; the plans include a boat park and slipway, so hopefully we'd be able to keep them there.

ukmctc: as you discovered, Lower Town harbour isn't much good for fin keelers or anything over about 26'. And anchoring in the commercial port can be uncomfortable, a longish row ashore and no facilities. So I'd expect many more yachts to visit us if there was somewhere they could go.

chrishelen: yes, I suppose most boats in most marinas are unused for most of the year, but that doesn't stop marinas from being successful. And I would expect a definite improvement in the local economy - some of the empty pubs and shops might even re-open!
 
450 berths seem a lot to fill in these financially straitened days particularly when located so far from large populations and on poor roads. Milford marina has never been full and even established marinas such as Pwlhelli are no longer full and presently offering substantial discounts.
 
Boo2, UKMTC, chrishelen....

I think we will have to disagree on this one..

You seem to want to keep people who do not have much by way of wealth in the poor bin

I want to give everyone a chance to shRe in prosperity
 
Tomahawk said:
Boo2, UKMTC, chrishelen....

I think we will have to disagree on this one..

You seem to want to keep people who do not have much by way of wealth in the poor bin

I want to give everyone a chance to shRe in prosperity
Click to expand...

We can agree to disagree then...but i fail to see how an half empy marina can give "everyone" a share in the prosperity...for sure the only people to gain will be the marina owners and you only need to go down the road a bit and look at milford or even Swansea marinas to see the closed up waterfront shops and the empy cafes... i dont think we need another one at fg...i dont understand your "poorbin" comment...
 
A marina is a commercial enterprise just like a shop or a resturant... The success of the business is down to the skill and dedicationnof the staff... If the new businecss is half inteligent... and onec would suppose a modicum of that quality, given they are about to spend a lot of money.. they will get good people on bord to run it. They will market it to the best advantage and it will attract customers.... So it is not a forgon conclusion it will be half empty..

As to thie poor bin thinking... Fishguard, like all ports is surrounded by fish. Pretty obvious thought that, but now the fishing industry has mostly been destroyed by regulation and over production, it is no longer a great income earner for people.. Any normal enterprise such as manufacturing has to transport all its goods, and raw matereials past the competitioon further in land...Another economic burden.....That means the town has to find something else to trade on... It has some tourist activity, but not enough to attract visitors in sufficient quantity to make it wealthy... That leaves two optioons.. stay as is and poor or make some investments whichnattract visitors.. A marina is a good start..

It will also be useful to yaghties who want to stop on the way past ..
 
LOL....
I have nowt but my boat, but think regeneration of Fishguard should come from shops, housing and local govt not us poor sailors, build up what they have, improve what they've got, make local business pay, local people work voluntarily on it. Then they will all prosper, and others can then help.
If it fails then they learn a valuable lesson in life, it doesn't always work out!
If it works then they actually achieve something by working for it.

nothing is worth it, if its justed handed out on a plate.
 
Hi, I am just replying to everyone really...I am not against Nimbyism. I most probably am one but one thing that runs throught it all is that the marina isnt the problem its the unknown that goes with it. For those who have not seen the plans there is the issue of a 19acre development platform for the sole us of Stena Ports to do with as they wish and it is not covered by planning because under an ancient ACT of 1918 it gives the security of the port to the port authority and as such once it is fenced off it is their sole responsibility. Having an industrial development adjacent to a luxury development in my opinion does not add up and as such could see the marina side of it all fail. This is only my opinion. We own a boat and we sail here regularly but any serious sailing is done in Neyland and that area. I was at the meeting and I spoke to a man who was very keen to have the marina here for his power boat. I actually sail under "canvas" and he I believe has invested a lot of money in the area with the hope of the marina bringing in money to his business. He considers that the ladies will want retail therapy. Unlikely, as Milford Marina has shown. The canvas yachting people usually are happy with shorts and t shirts and when they are out sailing they are well equiped with the apropriate gear for getting wet under sail. The motor boat people are unlikely to come to this area in great enough numbers and with their Sun Seekers are likely to stay on the South Coast in easy reach of France where it is warmer. Here in Goodwick we do have better weather because it is sheltered but it is a million miles away from Salcombe where motor cruisers are moored in the estuary there and never move and are just used as holiday homes on the water. There is sufficient room behind Tescos and on dry land for the storage of boats and in the other areas of Goodwick that were once used for industrial purposes. We have a disused building on the sea front that was put up at vast expense using EU money and which due to a complete lack of commitment from the powers that be has been empty for years. Its purpose was for training young people how to sail. It has bunk beds, underfloor heating the works. That could be used to train young sailors. The thing is that people have got to want these things to happen. Comments were made on how the bay used to be full of sailors and regattas and all that...nothing has changed so why isnt it now?. As for jobs, who knows, maybe but if Milford is anything to go by then I wont hold my breath, closed shops no one there and the two cafes scratching a living out of who comes there, one doesnt even accept cards its so bad. Shops come and go with the seasons. Neyland is different its attractive, tidal and an interesting place for the tourists to visit not far from Pembroke and Tenby. BUT we have nothing here Fishguard is deserted no shops, cant even buy clothes...so I personally think that when the developers did their homework they got it wrong, Fail, concentrate on getting Fishguard and Goodwick up and running first and then you may be in with a chance for a commercially viable Marina, until that happens you can dream on.
 
The Marina would be at Goodwick see my other post when its gone through the moderator. The big issue we have and we have a boat in Lower Town Fishguard is the big question over the development platform for the Stena Port and the compatibility issue that could arrise from a mixed marina development next door to an industrial expansion platform of 19 acres. Personally, I believe there is enough hard standing off shore rather than to fill in the sea, disturb the wild life, restrict public access and basically make a modern nightmare out of what is a pretty little bay with good access to the front for people in wheelchairs etc....anyway to the point. Its not Salcombe and it never will be in my lifetime. If people want it to be like Salcombe then there has got to be millions spent by the Welsh Government, Pembrokeshire County Council, on upgrading the A40 transport link now only single carriageway from Carmarthen to Fishguard and that can add an hour onto a journey stuck behind tractors so everyone turns left and goes to Tenby Saundersfoot instead. There is nothing to bring people here that why there has got to be a massive investment in this area and being completely realistic about this not negative I do not believe there is the will or the understanding of the Tourism indistry and its needs in order to create the investment in the first place...
 
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