two all round lights at or near the top of the mast

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sailor211

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We (SWMBO) are thinking of putting the additional sailing nav lights, two all round lights in a vertical line at or near the top of the mast. Research says these should be 1m apart.
I can fit an all round red at the very top but for the green I need two 180 degree lights one each side of the mast.

Anyone know a supplier?

Chandlers via (e-mail) do not appear to grasp my requirement (sell too much clothing)
Google search for Aqua Signal directs me to Chandlers!!

The crew on big yachts, that have them, do not know the source and I do not fancy a trip up a 100 ft mast to read the makers name particularly as crew may not let me down
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In short, there are no makers of this type of light. I know because I've looked. I need something like that as I have a rotating mast so can't use a tricolour.

The only solution I have identified is a pair of steaming lights fitted with green theatrical gels (filters).

I have had cause to look at them on a square rigger. The solution they use is to mount them on top of the mast above all stays and attachments and support a short bit of mast and the red on a thin cage that surrounds the all-round green. They also have a lower red so they can show NUC.
 
From (distant) memory, the sail training vessel I used to sail on had a pair of all-round lights on each side of the mast. I guess from a distance ahead or astern they looked like one light as they were effectively only about a foot apart.
 
I assume you are referring to this rule:

(c) A sailing vessel underway may, in addition to the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) of this Rule, exhibit at or near the top of the mast, where they can best be seen, two all-round lights in a vertical line, the upper being red and the lower green, but these lights shall not be exhibited in conjunction with the combined lantern permitted by paragraph (b) of this Rule.

There is a reference in the regs to a 1m vertical separation but I believe this is for power vessels/ships and not intended to apply to masthead lights on a sail boat.

Perko does a 'double stack base mount' light, their ref. 0200GRBDP1 which allows you to place all round red over green in a neat package. It's the only one I've seen but can't believe there isn't a European manufacture of such a light.

I don't know why you want this solution rather than a masthead tricolour, unless you have a rotating mast.
 
I thought perhaps aquasignal did them in there range of commercial stuff but I cannot find any.
[ QUOTE ]
two 180 degree lights one each side of the mast.

[/ QUOTE ]
You could adapt port/starboard lights from say the series 40 range by removing the shields from the lenses that control the angle of visibility (Its just a lttle bit of aluminium that will pull off IIRC) and then fitting them in pairs either side of the mast. Taking those shields off will give the 180 degree visibility from each lantern that you want.
 
[ QUOTE ]
There is a reference in the regs to a 1m vertical separation but I believe this is for power vessels/ships and not intended to apply to masthead lights on a sail boat.

[/ QUOTE ] And that is for vessels under 12m . Different for vessels 12-20m

I can't see any specified separation for the allround red and greens.

[ QUOTE ]
I don't know why you want this solution rather than a masthead tricolour

[/ QUOTE ] The tricolour is only allowed for boats up to 20m so presumably they are for a boat over 20m.
 
You could just put 2 all-round greens (Agua signal, and others make these) on small brackets on the side of the mast.

The rules (annex I, para 9) say: "If it is impracticable to comply with paragraph (b) (i) of this section by exhibiting only one all-round light, two all-round lights shall be used suitably positioned or screened so that they appear, as far as practicable, as one light at a distance of one mile."

I think the mast will provide sufficient screening, if not then some foil will do the job.

If I were doing this I would probably go the whole way and mount the red in the same way.

J
 
Actually there's a section in the detail regs defining what is meant by vertical separation of lights under various circumstances and I think this may be where the original poster may have found the reference to 1m vertical separation.

Yes, I'd assumed the original poster had a vessel under 20m! The r/g all round combination is allowed as a substitute for the masthead tricolour, and cannot be used in conjuction with it, so I assumed it also applies to vessels under 20m. Perhaps not.

Does the forum seem clunky and slow today, or is it me?
 
"Red over green - sailing machine"
Lopolight do LED 180 degree lights.

http://www.lopolight.com/

200-018.jpg
 
Rule 25
(a) A sailing vessel underway shall exhibit:
(i) sidelights;
(ii) a sternlight.
(b) In a sailing vessel of less than 20 metres in length the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) of this Rule may be combined in one lantern carried at or near the top of the mast where it can best be seen.
(c) A sailing vessel underway may, in addition to the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) of this Rule, exhibit at or near the top of the mast, where they can best be seen, two all-round lights in a vertical line, the upper being red and the lower green, but these lights shall not be exhibited in conjunction with the combined lantern permitted by paragraph (b) of this Rule.

Annex I
2. Vertical positioning and spacing of lights
(i) When the Rules prescribe two or three lights to be carried in a vertical line, they shall be spaced as follows:
(i) on a vessel of 20 metres in length or more such lights shall be spaced not less than 2 metres apart, and the lowest of these lights shall, except where a towing light is required, be placed at a height of not less than 4 metres above the hull;
(ii) on a vessel of less than 20 metres in length such lights shall be spaced not less than 1 metre apart and the lowest of these lights shall, except where a towing light is required, be placed at a height of not less than 2 metres above the gunwale;
 
Any special reason you want them?I have seen them but only on tall ships and very large yachts. Could you mount them on a stainless pole attatched to the mast head.A small diameter pole wouldnt shield the light too much.
 
Thanks for the input so far. Very useful

It is an option which may increase visibility (and can be used on any sailing vessel) and SWMBO is keen.

I had not thought of paying LED prices, this would be the same cost as having a AIS transmitter for use in situations where the lights would be used, that is night, close to big shipping of concern, which is only a few dozen hours a year!!

Yes we are less than 20m infact 10.5m. Older cruising boats often used this light option and a number of bigger yachts have them. they may be two all round lights.

My understanding is that the Tricolour was a allowed on sailing boats less than 20m to save power as only one bulb was required in the days of 50 Ah batteries and dynamo charging!
 
[ QUOTE ]
Buy nav lights and remove the metal screen that makes them 120 (ish) degree instead of 180.

[/ QUOTE ] If you take an aquasignal series 40 side light
5S301302.jpg


You will find that there is a small screen on the front of the lamp which limits the visiblity to dead ahead and other screen round the back of the lens that limits the angle of visibility to 22.5 degrees abaft the beam. If both of these are removed the result will be a lantern with more than 180 degree visibilty. For the application proposed it wont matter than each is more than 180. An advantage if anything.

This is what I was suggesting earlier

Where do you get 120 ish from?
 
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