Trojan, Varta, or El Cheapo - a no brainer?

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dom

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Just replaced house batts. I need about 450Ah for summer and 600Ah in winter averaging 40+ discharges cycles p.a. (capacity based on an average 50% DD)

Simple cost/benefit analysis:
1. El Cheapo 12V: £0.80/Ah = £360. Good for circa 120 cycles (as many caravaning mags attest)

2. Varta, or similar 12V: £1..05/Ah = £470: 200 cycles to 50% DD.
https://www.varta-automotive.com/en-gb/products/varta-professional-dual-purpose

3: Trojan T-105 6V: £1.30 Ah (@12V): around 1,100 cycles at 50% DD, and 850 cycles at 70% DD.
http://www.windandsun.co.uk/media/172100/Trojan-T105-datasheet.pdf​

Trojan's like a proper charging regime, need to be watered, and they are a tad bulky and too tall for some battery compartments. Aside from that, the cost benefit analysis seems a no-brainer: 6-10 times the life for a premium of 25-60%.

The exception being lightly used boats, or boats returning to a marina most nights. I'm guessing that the relatively niche nature of the likes of Trojan suggests that most UK boats fit into this category.

Or am I missing something?
 
I'm suspicious of any expectation of more than 5 years' life.
I'd be looking at the cost-benefit of using all those Ah.
And trying to sail more than 40 cycles a year...
 
A lot of us will easily beat 40 cycles a year but hopefully few of them anywhere near 50 percent.

Batteries seem to last almost forever for me and I’ve only changed them when I’ve let them discharge completely somehow after a few months away in the Winter and even then I don’t usually have to change them the first time that happens.

So I buy deep cycle but whatever is good value and in stock in whatever chandlers is attached to the marina I happen to be in. So that’s once in 9 years so far.
 
RupertW said:
A lot of us will easily beat 40 cycles a year but hopefully few of them anywhere near 50 percent.

Batteries seem to last almost forever for me and I’ve only changed them when I’ve let them discharge completely somehow after a few months away in the Winter and even then I don’t usually have to change them the first time that happens.

So I buy deep cycle but whatever is good value and in stock in whatever chandlers is attached to the marina I happen to be in. So that’s once in 9 years so far.
Click to expand...

I paid less than half the cost of a Lifeline 110AH AGM for a Chinese spiral wound technology AGM.

Three and a half years on its as good as the Lifelines that were changed at the same time.

Only 4 Lifelines were available, so I thought I would give the El Cheapo a go.

No regrets so far.
 
I always use cheapo batteries until a year ago ,
For around £100 a touch if they lose me three years that's was fine , that's using the. Every day all year round four house batteries 420AH over thenthree years working out £130 PY .
But the last lot we brought one died within a year and didn't do the others much good before I realised what was happen ,
Ended up given the other three away and buying Trojan set of four given me 490AH
But they stand me €900 with delivery , so in reality they need to last 7 years to come out at the same cost as cheapo at to day prices .
I let you all know in seven years if it was worth buying them .
 
Interesting answers - just to clarify, 40 days is an estimate of times discharged to roughly 50%; calm sunny days can be a lot less.

Another consideration with El Cheapos is a concern going well below 50% of stated capacity for fear of trashing the battery. I've also noticed that the voltage can tail off quite rapidly below 50% of stated capacity even with newish batteries.Obviously it's a bit of lottery with cheap batts and one can really luck out!

Trojans ability to happily go below 50% allows speccing a slightly smaller bank, which makes them only a little more expensive than the others.

Re lifespan: agree that 7-years is about the expected limit, but the way I see it, I'm quids-in by quite a way at the first replacement date of their comparators?
 
lw395 said:
I'm suspicious of any expectation of more than 5 years' life.
I'd be looking at the cost-benefit of using all those Ah.
And trying to sail more than 40 cycles a year...
Click to expand...

Battery cycling varies wildly when comparing marina day sailors with the occasional night on the hook v well used liveaboards on anchor or mooring.

When boat in use, our Trojan T125s cycle 24/7 for 6 - 8 months p.a. liveaboard, charged mainly by solar. They're about 6 years old and still going fine. Having said that, I've never seen them below 65% early morning according to BM1, usually still around 85 - 90% when I turn in, generally about 0130 hrs.
 
Seems to me, 'cheap' batteries have got dearer over the past few years?
I'm sure Trojan used to cost a bigger % premium?
 
TQA said:
My Trojans get cycled daily all year round. I get 3 to 4 years out of them.

I have 6 x T 105s and could get by on two but having 6 allows me to keep going for 3 days of overcast conditions without firing up a genny. .
Click to expand...

So your typical cycle in fair weather is only down to about 75% and you get ~ 1300 cycles?
Or say 1000 75% cycles and ~100 40% cycles?
 
TQA said:
My Trojans get cycled daily all year round. I get 3 to 4 years out of them.

I have 6 x T 105s and could get by on two but having 6 allows me to keep going for 3 days of overcast conditions without firing up a genny. .
Click to expand...

I hope I going to get more then that with mine , otherwise I be pounds out of pocket
 
TQA said:
I am on my fourth set each have lasted 3 to 4 years. I rarely get them to 100% 85% would be typical. Deep discharge several times when it gets overcast for days.
Click to expand...

Not easy getting back to really 100%, I have float on the regulator set to the same as absorption at 14.9V, often back to full on a sunny day but takes ages for the last little bit to trickle in. There was a paper published a while ago but unfortunately unavailable on the web which argued that 15.3V is better, guessing that having absorption a bit higher than the datasheet is less harmful than not getting back to 100% more often. Even so, 3 to 4 years living at partial state of charge is good going! That would quickly kill a lesser battery.
 
The cheapos that came with the boat eight years ago are still ok as is the starter battery which I replaced when I bought the boat. Waiting for them to go down but no sign at the moment. Admittedly, we're on shore power most of the time.
 
My Rolls batteries 95ah and 135ah gave up after 9 years with two of those spent on an Atlantic circuit. Replaced with Trojan 12v. You pays your money ...
 
dom said:
Just replaced house batts. I need about 450Ah for summer and 600Ah in winter averaging 40+ discharges cycles p.a. (capacity based on an average 50% DD)

Simple cost/benefit analysis:
1. El Cheapo 12V: £0.80/Ah = £360. Good for circa 120 cycles (as many caravaning mags attest)

2. Varta, or similar 12V: £1..05/Ah = £470: 200 cycles to 50% DD.
https://www.varta-automotive.com/en-gb/products/varta-professional-dual-purpose

3: Trojan T-105 6V: £1.30 Ah (@12V): around 1,100 cycles at 50% DD, and 850 cycles at 70% DD.
http://www.windandsun.co.uk/media/172100/Trojan-T105-datasheet.pdf​

Trojan's like a proper charging regime, need to be watered, and they are a tad bulky and too tall for some battery compartments. Aside from that, the cost benefit analysis seems a no-brainer: 6-10 times the life for a premium of 25-60%.

The exception being lightly used boats, or boats returning to a marina most nights. I'm guessing that the relatively niche nature of the likes of Trojan suggests that most UK boats fit into this category.

Or am I missing something?
Click to expand...

You're not missing anything. I would say that's about right.

My Trojans are now 10 years old and still going strong and showing no sign of starting to give up.
 
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