trailer sailer electrics

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Clint

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I have a 20 foot trailer sailer, with no electrics, and I am thinking of adding some electrical equipment ie: 1-2 cabin lights, a NASA Clipper Duet System, and 2 auxiliary outlets. I am thinking of running everything off a leisure battery, with a solar panel for charging. Would it be possible to run it all of a leisure battery, would I need a ground plate. I know I need to work out the power consumption of the lights and electronics to get the power consumption, but I don't think it's going to be more than 40 watts, or 80 watts with a small cool box.

The only motor I have on board is a 4HP outboard.

Clint
 
I'm sure you could. Depending, as you say, on the amount you use them and the size of your solar panel. We have one 110Ah leisure battery and it does more than that (and still cranks the engine). At least, no matter how flat yours gets, you'll never be stuck and unable to start your engine. It might be worth investing in a battery condition monitor if in doubt. Can you buy a charging loop for you outboard?
 
I'm not sure about the outboard, all l know is it's a fairly new Tohatsu, l have only had the boat about a week, and it's undergoing refurbishing at the moment, so l figured while everything is ripped out, it would be a good time to get any wiring done. If l could get a charging loop for the outboard, l don't think l'd want to run it for hours to charge the battery. Although it would be interesting to see how much charge the OB could generate with an hour or 2 of motoring. I did thing about installing a Nasa BM 1 as well.
 
Hi there,
I did what you are thinking about, using the experience of kitting out a van. I'm running leds in the cabin, the mast lights, a gps/fish finder, vhf radio and have a cig lighter and volt meter on the switch panel I made. Also have a mains circuit with just a double socket in which the mains charger sits. I've yet to put in the solar panel, though the wiring is in. I'm waiting for replacement batteries as I managed to knacker the 2 x 6V batteries (150AH) over the winter. I let them discharge and they froze. Luckily they were given to me by my brother - if I had to buy the batteries I'd probably go for something in the 110 - 140Ah range as mentioned by Avocet. I opted for a 30W solar panel as it's the biggest that would fit where I wanted, should be ample though :)
Don't think you need a ground plate.
Here's a picture of the panel in case it's of interest, and that's made me remember I cut the hole for the 3 switches the wrong way round! :D
lyf7.jpg
 
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Lights 10 watts each, Clipper only a watt or two max, sockets depends what you are going to use them for, but unless you are running a laptop say 20 watts each, likely maximum load 50 watts. That's around 4 amp hours, so a 60 AH battery would last around around 10 hours before the voltage drops to a critical (i.e damaging) level. In practice you wouldnt be drawing the full whack all the time every evening, so you could probably expect 15 hours or more before things start going dim.

You could reduce the lighting load by using LEDs which will draw around 2 watts each, sosubstantially increasing the life of a single charge in the battery.

A 35 watt solar panel would on average take around 3 hours to recharge an hours drain of 50 watts, or if you only use the lights around one and half hours per hour of use. So you might need to be a little careful, and the extra cost of LED bulbs would be worthwhile, making it more likely the Solar panel would keep up with the . A more powerful panel would of course improve the recharge time. A 35 watt panel would certainly keep up with even regular weekending.

If you plan to run a laptop, they can be quite power hungry and a more powerful panel would almost certainly be needed. A bigger capacity battery would take longer to discharge, but would need a more powerful panel to charge it in a reasonable time.

the calculation is easy: Watts divide by Volts = Amps. Amps x hours = Amp hours (the measure of battery capacity), but lead acid are effectively 'flat' at around 50% discharge, at which point the voltage will have dropped to around 11 volts, which is considered 'flat', and unless charged immediately is likely to be damaged, and unable to hold the full rated capacity. Use a 'Leisure' type battery, which maintains a better voltage as it discharges, and is more resistant to deep discharge cycles than an ordinary 'car battery' which is designed to give a short burst of power at very high amperage for engine starting. They do not like long slow deep discharge cycles, and will fail earlier.

Make sure everything is protected by fuses. A lead acid battery is capable of starting a fire in seconds if short circuited. ground plates are not needed unless you have an MF radio fitted.
 
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You would have no problem powering a few electronics from a battery and solar panel but I would forget any ideas of running a cool box. They are power hungry and, on a 20 footer, you won't be wanting a large enough solar panel to keep up.

You don't need a ground plate.
 
I do wish people would re size images to a sensible size before posting them. The page is now almost unreadable having to keep scrolling sideways to read the text.

The image posted is 3264 pixels wide, I doubt many of us have monitors that wide.

To answer the OP I run a depth finder (fish finder) GPS and VHF radio all from a single 12V battery kept topped up just by a solar panel.

It lasts a whole season without having to take the battery home for charging and with no charge from an engine etc.
 
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ProDave said:
I do wish people would re size images to a sensible size before posting them. The page is now almost unreadable having to keep scrolling sideways to read the text.

The image posted is 3264 pixels wide, I doubt many of us have monitors that wide.

To answer the OP I run a depth finder (fish finder) GPS and VHF radio all from a single 12V battery kept topped up just by a solar panel.

It lasts a whole season without having to take the battery home for charging and with no charge from an engine etc.
Click to expand...
Sorry! :o
 
For my trailer sailer and over 34 years ofd ownership I have stuck with a small battery and solar power. As it lives on a swing mooring half the year. Using LED Pand S and stern lights and LED cabin light and VHF radio I can easily get away witha 5w solar panel. (plenty of sun here). Suggest 10w in UK. I have a simple switch board with a single fuse at the battery terminal for all outlets and solar connection. Switch board has a switch for cabin light a switch for nav lights and 2 banana sockets for solar panel. The panel is bungeed to the boom sail cover and removed for sailing.
For a trailer sailer you do not want wiring in the mast when you remove the mast often.
Outboard charging is OK if you use the o/b a lot. I have just pulled boat home after a full season without using the motor once. Just ballast under the cockpit.
Fit wiring tubing or conduit as wiring does not last for ever even tinned copper wire. Keep it all simple.
As said don't even dream of using a peltier cool box. Use ice in an insulated box.
Battery size is up to you but mine is NiCad wet cell demonstrating about 8 AH on test and has always been adequate. I think 110 AH lead acid just too heavy for TS.
good luck olewill
 
Thanks once again, some very good ideas you've given me, and I shall let you all know the outcome, once I have put it all together. I think I might also get the biggest panel I can fit onto her, you can never have too much power. Just one question on the VHF, for all the trailer sailers on here, is your VHF fixed or hand held, and if fixed, how have you attached the aerial, are they fold down or whip?
 
Clint said:
Thanks once again, some very good ideas you've given me, and I shall let you all know the outcome, once I have put it all together. I think I might also get the biggest panel I can fit onto her, you can never have too much power. Just one question on the VHF, for all the trailer sailers on here, is your VHF fixed or hand held, and if fixed, how have you attached the aerial, are they fold down or whip?
Click to expand...
Fixed, Mast head Metz Whip.with plug under cabin top that can be undone and removed through deck gland.

Re battery monitor.
I wouldnt bother with expense if you are going to fit a solar panel go for a regulator with a built in monitor. Have a look at the Marlec site.

http://www.marlec.co.uk/online-shop/
 
Just another thought. Our first trailer sailer was a little Leisure 17 and we only ever day-sailed. I just used to take the battery home with me each time and charge it in the garage. I had quick-release battery terminals that could be connected and disconnected without using a spanner. On that boat, we also used a hand-held VHF because putting the mast up and taking it down every time we sailed was enough of a chore without connecting a cable as well.
 
I did a similar thing on my Leisure 17 using a 55ahr battery and 5w solar panel. We had a cabin light, vhf, tricolour, NASA clipper duet and handheld gps. Sailed most weekends and never had to charge the battery. I didn't have a battery state monitor but checked the battery voltage on arrival at the boat (sometimes) with a portable meter.
 
i run a similar system but i also carry a couple of 12v batteries from a battery drill incase of emergencies i use them at work all week so they are always charged up in the van while we drive just pop them in the bag for the boat these work the vhf and gps plus the mast head tri colour which is nasa led
 
re VHF on trailer sailer. I use a standard cheap fixed 25w VHF. I built an antenna into the stern rail The vertical pole is the ground plane and a stainless steel rod 4mm is the radiator. It works well for my needs. certainly a lot better rnage than a HH.
100_6759scaled.jpg (83.8 KB)

You can see the antenna on the right. The black long one on the left was a 27mhz antenna now gone. You might also notice my 2 stage mast crutch which works well. Extended up for initial lowering then disconnect the mast base slide mast forward. Then lower for towing into the bottom support. Also the high mount is good for our bridges. Top part slides in and is removed for towing.
Also the stern rail with 2 gaps one for fitting o/b engine when needed and the other side for climbing from water onto boat.

The antenna is 17 inches of SS rod. I flattened the end sufficiently to drill a small hole for a ss screw nut and crimped lug onto the coax inner. The outer has a similar lug onto the top of the support tube. there are bits of plastic tube for insulation epoxied in and painted. (the white part) VSWR is good and no probs in 3 seasons so far. good luck olewill
 
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On my 19ft trailer sailer, I have a NASA BM1 battery monitor for my 110Ah battery. I run LED cabin lights, mast head white/tricolor, GPS, GPS repeater, NASA duet and sometimes yeoman plotter. I also charge loads of gadgets (I use an ipad to record my track and I have kids with ipods etc). My battery lasts about 4 days before I am thinking about shore power. I have just bought a pair of 30W panels because I want to be self sufficient for electricity.

To echo other replies: forget a fridge- I have an ice box.
I have both fixed and hand held VHF (I started with a hand-held but was concerned about range, so fitted a fixed unit). The fixed unit has a stubby flexible masthead aerial. The mast-head lights and VHF antenna take less than 2 minutes to attach, so I dont find it a problem (and I trail many times a season).
 
I rewired my Trailer Yacht last year.
26 ft and no fridge, 85 Ah battery is Ok but surprising how it all adds up. LED lights. Accept nothing else!

Lesson 1 - use tinned wire! The main reason for rewiring was that the original wiring was not tinned and although the boat is dry inside, salt atmosphere had done its work.
Lesson 2 - have a good plan to start with. Consider carefully just where you will locate battery and switchboard and how you will route cables.
(Done properly, plastic "top hat" conduit can be really good.)

Lesson 3
allow for easy expansion of electrics.

I have 7 fused circuits with room for more:
1 Anchor light
2 running lights
3 Stbd cabin lights plus fixed VHF plus AM/FM radio
4 port cabin lights plus handheld VHF charge plus GPS plus fishfinder.
5 Cig lighter sockets. (three of them around the boat with big cables and fuse)
6 Water pumps - domestic.
7 Reserved for tiller pilot.
I also have fitted a volt meter with a push button check the battery.As the boat is mostly on the trailer in the back yard with 5 w solar panel attached i dont think i need anything more sophisticated.

My honda has a charging circuit but i wouldn't count on it except as a trickle charge bonus.

I figure i am Ok for 3 days or so which realistically covers most of my sailing.

have fun.
 
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