The Seafarer 700 and NASA clipper sounders saga

yanay

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I have both sounders installed yet none is functional. The seafarer 700 dial displays interference - lights all over the dial - at most times. Rarely it would display a steady depth reading - both on the dial and in digits - yet I could not replicate or figure out in what scenarios this magic happens. The interference is certainly affected by electric devices. When the 12v lighter socket is on, it interferes in those rare ocassions there's a reading, so does the 12v-220v 375 Victron inverter.

IMG_7782.jpegIMG_7780.jpegIMG_7779.jpegI tried installing 3 ferrite rings on a twisted wire, both positive and negative looped several times in the same rings, and separately. No change. Tried running the 12v line directly from the house battery, directly from that bank's bus bars, also directly from the starter battery. No change. Rigged 4 9V PP3 batteries in series but the amperage was insufficient to power it internally. Also covered the section of the coax run from where it exits the bilge with aluminum foil. No change. Purchasing and supplying it internally with a small 12V 4.5 amps battery is the one thing I did not try yet. One more clue is that when I remove the coax from the unit, there's nothing but a single orange light, when it's back in - lights all over.

The NASA unit screen was sun damaged and the digits are hardly visible. The buttons are also not functional. However when it is turned on, rapid clicks are heard from the head unit, not from the transducer below the hull in the water though. Last time the boat was put back in the water after haul out, there was a drip leak from the NASA transducer mount. I laid a 6-7 mm layer of underwater epoxy around it under the hull and the leak stopped. However it was still providing a reading a year ago. The seafarer intermittent interference began seemingly with no reason, about two years ago.

These two units are installed about 25 cm from each other, both on port. On the hull below there's only a single protrusion yet I can't be sure to which of the sounders it belongs, the two are installed too close. One is in hull the other through hull. The aft transducer is the NASA and seems to be in hull, but was leaking? So I may have covered with epoxy the protruding through hull transducer and it still stopped the leak? Strange.

The boat was left in the water for a year. When I returned to it recently I installed a repeater for the NASA but both read OUT, regardless, after 5 seconds of displaying U with a line above it and "0.6", indicating the keel offset.

I know the transducers are interchange so I run the Seafarer coax to the NASA unit. Had to remove the seafarer coax male plug from its original line since it is not compatible with the NASA socket and installed a compatible plug, no soldering, it's an open plug. The NASA unit is still reading OUT when connected to the Seafarer transducer.

I'm tied to a dock in about 2 meters depth, soft muddy bottom, tall seagrass.

Prior, when installing the NASA repeater I had to extend the original NASA coax to the master unit for which I used a disused Navtex line with embedded male and female plugs but the NASA never displayed anything but OUT.
I read the Seafarer coax shield braid is used to carry the return signal, not just shield, and the NASA unit does not. However I'm not sure how this plays in the mix.

By now I'm not sure which of the transducers, head units, cables, plugs is bad. I do have a gut feeling I can solve this with the gear I have and reluctant to purchase a new NASA. But I might have to. Any insights are highly appreciated. Thanks and sorry for the length.
 
The seafarer I seem to remember, would show a muddy bottom by the width of the lights showing ? I suspect that seagrass could also give readings back to the unit. Are you able to go and anchor in deeper water with no seagrass and then test various options ?
 
Shallow depth, soft bottom and seagrass can throw depth sounders all over the place or not even register .. as you have.

I agree with Boathook - find a better deeper area to test .. preferably hard bottom ...

OK ... Nasa unit 'through hull' ... common errors of install :

1. Tranducer face touches hull ... needs to be raised slightly and the 'oil' or whatever you use in tube should provide the connecting medium.
2. Oil or whatever not enough to maintain full connection
3. Corroded socket on display .. plug on lead ...
4. Broken cable .. either surrounding shield or centre wire

Seafarer ....

same #3 .. #4 ...

TBH - I've had a number of Seafarer units - still have one in workshop now .. but never had good results in shallow water ... needed to get into deeper water so I could then actually alter gain to filter out the 'bounced repeat' BLIPS ..
 
@Refueler @Boathook thanks. yes the bottom could be it however how come the rare clean readings on the same bottom? I will move to anchor at 5-6 meters in a week or two and see.
Plugs and ports were cleaned on both units backs and cables.
Broken cables - multimeter shows infinite resistance with probes on any unit cables’ center core and shield at the unit side plug
 
Broken cables - multimeter shows infinite resistance with probes on any unit cables’ center core and shield at the unit side plug
That is correct. You will not see any continuity on a piezo transducer. When voltage is applied it produces mechanical movement and in reverse a mechanical movement produces voltage. This enables it to transmit and receive the echo sounder signals.
Nasa transducers are cheap compared to many others so it might be worth getting a spare to try out. You can dangle it over the side to see if you get a reading. You can also point it at right angles to a hard flat surface such as a window and you will get a signal back. Multiply the distance by about 5 to correct for relative speed of sound in air and water and you will have a good test.
Can you get the cap off the internal transducer and check that there is oil or water in the tube? If you get it out do the above test on a pane of glass or flat sheet of metal.
 
@andsarkit So multimeter tests would not verify anything about the condition of the Piezo or the cables?
I can easily pull the transducer up but cannot fully remove it since there’s a cap / white plastic cover on top of the tube the transducer sits in. I can see the thread on the transducer but it is not threaded to anything. I can spin it freely inside the bottom mounting tube. I can see some oil coming out on the sides as I pull the transducer, but not from the empty tiny hole at the top cover.
The top cap is threaded to the bottom tube and removable? Strange installation but it worked reliably for years.
 
The standard NASA tube cap is a push on .. not threaded.

The transducer has a threaded 'leg' with a nut - the nut I always put OUTSIDE the top cap ... it sets the height of the transducer in the tube .. ie it stops it touching the hull.
 
Transducers work on the same frequency so will interfere if you run both at the same time - as I found out.

New transducer only £50 approx inc postage and new Clipper only £150 - or Target £110 - both including transducers - so new one worth while for peace of mind and spare - which I have.

Instructions say can work on the right size dry cell battery - like the Seafarer does but different voltage - so clear of any electronic interference in the electrical system - but check instructions before connecting as yours might be different
 
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The standard NASA tube cap is a push on .. not threaded.

The transducer has a threaded 'leg' with a nut - the nut I always put OUTSIDE the top cap ... it sets the height of the transducer in the tube .. ie it stops it touching the hull.
The Seafarer transducer has two nuts on the stem so it can be firmly fixed in position.
 
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