Taylors stove - oven won't light

[Ursula123]

I am just refitting the galley of a yacht I recently acquired, The whole gas needed changing, oven knackered, new lines and pipes, no cylinder locker or drain just cylinders rattling around in a locker.
So decided to buy a second hand Taylors paraffin stove, managed to rig it up in the garage to give it a trial run to see how easy it was to light. I managed using a blow torch to light the two top burners. However couldn't get the oven burner to light. is it supposed to be different it doesn't have the familiar cover with holes in it just a single flame. I couldn't find any reference to it in the instructions. Is it supposed to be like this or is something missing?
By the time I finished the garage was full of smoke and I stank of fumes with sore eyes. Needless to say I am not a convert yet!

 

[Malabarista]

sorry i can't help but if you find out will you let me know?

 

[Kelpie]

Does the oven burner actually look different to the hob ones? They should be identical and look like this: http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTIwMFgxNjAw/z/nrsAAOSwNyFWgqiq/$_1.JPG

The technique you are using for lighting the hob should also work for the oven.

Paraffin stoves have several advantages over the alternatives but as ever, nothing is perfect and they have their downsides too!

 

[BabaYaga]

I managed using a blow torch to light the two top burners. However couldn't get the oven burner to light. is it supposed to be different it doesn't have the familiar cover with holes in it just a single flame. I couldn't find any reference to it in the instructions. Is it supposed to be like this or is something missing?
By the time I finished the garage was full of smoke and I stank of fumes with sore eyes. Needless to say I am not a convert yet!

I don't know the Taylors, but think it is highly unlikely that the oven burner should be anything different than the top burners.
If you need a new one, you can get it from here:
http://www.toplicht.de/en/shop/neu/neuigkeiten/petroleum-regulierbrenner-hanse-n1
but also from base.camp in the UK:
http://www.base-camp.co.uk/exploded views/Optimus/207 burner.htm
they also have spare parts
It is a bit unclear in what way the oven burner didn't light, but I do not think you should even try if the cap is missing.
Regarding pre-heating with a blow torch: Be careful, too much heat can create pinholes. Using ethanol is better, in my experience.

 

[Kukri]

Oven burner on my Taylors 030

Top burner of same.

Clearly, your Taylors is unsafe and requires safe disposal; I will be happy to undertake it free of charge, as a public service...

I think the blowtorch idea is a bit silly, as you have to stand over the stove, pointing a blowtorch at it, when you might be doing something useful. Fill the meths cup with meths, put the kettle on, get on with another job and apply a match just as the meths burns out...

 

[Ursula123]

Thanks for that, it looks like I lost one of the covers in transit,

 

[Ursula123]

Thanks for that, looks like I lost one of the holed covers, was a bit hairy trying to light it huge flame!!
Thanks for your help

 

[Kelpie]

Agree completely with the ethanol suggestions.
I light my Optimus (different stove, but uses the exact same burners) using Alcool a Brulee which I brought back from France. Better in every way than meths. However meths is easier to get hold of in the UK. I have an old syringe that I use to squirt about 10ml onto the base of the burner, works very well.

Another tip: centeal heating oil is much cheaper than hardware shop paraffin, and appears to work just as well.

 

[Kukri]

Thanks for that, looks like I lost one of the holed covers, was a bit hairy trying to light it huge flame!!
Thanks for your help

The inner cover is Taylors part number CTK 1045 and the outer cover with the holes is CTK 1040 but before you pay Taylors' prices for them just rob what you need from a gash Primus stove with "silent burner"!

 

[billybiltong]

I have used these guys before for spares:-
https://www.sea-sure.co.uk/categories/yacht/taylors/paraffin-cookers

 

[Ursula123]

Have found the missing burner cap, tried using meths, much easier than blow torch. Thanks for your kind disposal suggestion but I'll think I'll battle on!

 

[masterofnone]

I have a taylors 030.i find the main problem, is the burners getting blocked. The blowlamp lighting method works for me.luckily it came with loads of spares.

 

[RivalRedwing]

Base camp can be a v useful source of spares

http://www.base-camp.co.uk/

 

[Mister E]

I have a taylors 030.i find the main problem, is the burners getting blocked. The blowlamp lighting method works for me.luckily it came with loads of spares.

I remember the days when just about every camping shop sole Prickers for unblocking the jets.

A pencil blowlamp would be useful to heat the vaporiser tubes instead of waiting for the meths. At least if you got them glowing you could be certain of no flareups.

 

[pvb]

Why oh why do so many people persist with these dangerous relics?

 

[Kelpie]

Why oh why do so many people persist with these dangerous relics?

Hmmm, let me count the ways.
- self contained unit replaces a gas 'system' with its own bottle locker, piping, gas alarms, etc.
- considerably more powerful burners than gas cookers tend to have
- the best possible fuel density meaning you can carry months worth of fuel in a few containers
- you always know exactly how much fuel you have aboard and can top up partially emptied containers
- fuel is incredibly cheap (if you use central heating oil)

As to safety, I guess there is the risk of a flare up setting your curtains on fire, or even of burning liquid spilling out of the cooker. Quite scary. But this is something that would happen whilst you were stood at the galley and in a position to deal with it. The danger of gas is that it springs a leak and causes an explosion whilst you sleep. Preventable with an adequate alarm, of course, but then both types of fuel are safe if used correctly.

I'm not a dyed in the wool paraffin addict by any means. First boat had paraffin, so that's what I was used to. Second boat had a gas hob and grill and yes it is more convenient in use. However when I went to upgrade to a new cooker with oven I was offered a paraffin cooker and decided to go with it, as it would be a straightforward DIY install and meant I could remove the antiquated gas system and get half a locker back again.

 

[pvb]

Hmmm, let me count the ways.
- self contained unit replaces a gas 'system' with its own bottle locker, piping, gas alarms, etc.
- considerably more powerful burners than gas cookers tend to have
- the best possible fuel density meaning you can carry months worth of fuel in a few containers
- you always know exactly how much fuel you have aboard and can top up partially emptied containers
- fuel is incredibly cheap (if you use central heating oil)

As to safety, I guess there is the risk of a flare up setting your curtains on fire, or even of burning liquid spilling out of the cooker. Quite scary. But this is something that would happen whilst you were stood at the galley and in a position to deal with it. The danger of gas is that it springs a leak and causes an explosion whilst you sleep. Preventable with an adequate alarm, of course, but then both types of fuel are safe if used correctly.

I'm not a dyed in the wool paraffin addict by any means. First boat had paraffin, so that's what I was used to. Second boat had a gas hob and grill and yes it is more convenient in use. However when I went to upgrade to a new cooker with oven I was offered a paraffin cooker and decided to go with it, as it would be a straightforward DIY install and meant I could remove the antiquated gas system and get half a locker back again.

Hmmm, most of those are incorrect!

It's not exactly self-contained, as you still need safe storage space for cans of kerosene and meths.

Taylors cookers have burners which use 0.24 litres of kerosene an hour. This is equivalent to about 2.2kW. Many gas cookers have a 3kW burner, so are actually more powerful than the Taylors burner.

Fuel density of butane/propane is about 46000 kJ/kg, kerosene is about 43000 kJ/kg, so a lower figure.

Most people with LPG carry a spare cylinder. When the cylinder in use runs out, simply swap for the spare and get a new cylinder as a spare. They always know they've got a full spare cylinder.

Yes, kerosene is cheap, it needs to be bearing in mind the disadvantages.

You're right to highlight the dangers of fire when using kerosene cookers. I'd also suggest that the virtually invisible flame of burning meths is dangerous, especially with spills.

You're wrong to say that gas is dangerous. Proper installations don't just "spring a leak" and cause "an explosion while you sleep". In any case, many people turn the gas off at the bottle when they're not using it.

 

[BabaYaga]

Why oh why do so many people persist with these dangerous relics?

I agree with Kelpie that paraffin (and also gas) is safe if used correctly, but is it really true that 'so many people' continue using paraffin? My impression is that we are more of an 'endangered species' as the market for new marine stoves is now almost entirely taken over by gas and meths/etanol, like Origo. (With the exception being Taylors, but how many new units do they sell?).
I do not think that paraffin's share of the market has fallen because it is dangerous, but because it requires a bit more attention, practice and knowledge from the user. And I see no harm in maintaining this as a niche technology, for those willing to use it.
But there has to be a critical mass of users or the technology will die out because of lack of spare parts (for instance, new burners were unobtainable for several years, until the new Hanse no 1 came out a couple of years ago).
So I think we paraffin users should stick together and not let us be discouraged by opinions as the one above

 

[Kelpie]

Hmmm, most of those are incorrect!

It's not exactly self-contained, as you still need safe storage space for cans of kerosene and meths.

Well by that definition very few things are self contained. What I meant was that the stove itself has no hoses or pipes connecting it to anything else (this is the case for the Optimus at any rate) which makes installation much easier, and removes some potential points of failure. It is also helpful for maintenance and even cleaning as you can lift the whole thing out and take it home.
Maybe I am insufficiently cautious but storage of paraffin = a 5l plastic container chucked in the cockpit locker beside the 25l one full of diesel. Neither is going to form explosive vapours like gas or petrol will.
A litre of ethanol sits next to the other spirits in the galley

Taylors cookers have burners which use 0.24 litres of kerosene an hour. This is equivalent to about 2.2kW. Many gas cookers have a 3kW burner, so are actually more powerful than the Taylors burner.

I guess this will very from stove to stove, I certainly noticed a big jump in performance when I ditched my gas hob. And you don't get the performance tailoff as the gas bottle runs out. Gas might win in total time taken though when you factor in preheating.

Fuel density of butane/propane is about 46000 kJ/kg, kerosene is about 43000 kJ/kg, so a lower figure.

And the weight of a steel gas cylinder vs a plastic 5l bottle?

Most people with LPG carry a spare cylinder. When the cylinder in use runs out, simply swap for the spare and get a new cylinder as a spare. They always know they've got a full spare cylinder.

Which is exactly how I tried to run my gas system when I had it. Some people prefer to be able to stock up with a year's worth of fuel at a time. Perhaps it depends on the type of sailing you do, and where you go.

You're right to highlight the dangers of fire when using kerosene cookers. I'd also suggest that the virtually invisible flame of burning meths is dangerous, especially with spills.

Yes I've been told that an ethanol flame is invisible in direct sunlight. But I live in Scotland

 

[mattonthesea]

I like this debate! In the process of moving from Taylors to a gas hob at the moment. Main reason: it takes longer to light the thing than it does to boil a cup of tea!

Keeping the Taylors heater though

Not sure what the going rate is for a second hand stove with all the trimmings is - any suggestions?