Swing mooring newbie looking for answers.

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Chiliblue

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All you seasoned swingers out there could you answer some questions?

Mooring Buoys. I don't intend to use the ring at the top of those buoys with a metal rod that goes through the centre. So should I still use one or can I use a round buoy/fender with a plastic/rubber eye at the bottom to hold up the chain? My concern (I might be over thinking this) is the plastic/rubber eye shackled to the chain, is that going to be a problem?

Size, the main function of the mooring buoy is to mark the mooring and to hold up the chain. So how big should I be looking at 40cm dia - 50cm dia - even bigger?

As for the pickup buoy I am thinking big is easier to hook when things are a little frantic?

Chain vs Rope, this I have read a lot on, chain is obviously more robust but will slowly eat my bow fitting. I am going to go with nylon 3 strand sheathed in pipe where it passes through at the bow. One main line and one backup. Does that seem reasonable?

Tom
 
Generally depends on local conditions blah blah... have a look at what everyone else is doing. Also, how much are you actually allowed to change in the setup?

My preferred setup would be: chain riser part of the way, with a swivel, then rope above that to the buoy. Pickup would just be a strop with a spliced eye.
The buoy only has to support the weight of the riser. Lots of people use chain all the way but I've found that this left a big rusty mess all over my foredeck. Some people also like the buoys with a ring on top and a swivel inside, others dislike this as it hides the weakest part of the whole setup.
 
One thing you haven't mentioned, which is vital on a swing mooring, is the swivel. It needs to be close to the top of the riser so you can inspect it regularly and to keep it out of the mud/sand.
You can use a plain buoy to hold up the riser, size is entirely dependent on the length/weight of the riser. Possible problems with fitting the strops below the buoy are the strops chafing the buoy and the strops getting tangled around the buoy when the mooring is not in use.
The pickup buoy is better small in my view. If you are struggling to hang onto a mooring you don't want to have to wrestle a big pickup buoy through a small gap at the bow.
I always use rope strops but octoplait which I have found last much better than 3 strand. Mine are about 30 - 35mm diameter. Yes, 2 strops separately shackled to the riser/buoy.
 
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It's probably best to look around and see what others do in your area. These things seem to change from one place to another but, in any event, your local harbour master/river authority will probably stipulate what they expect to be done. The size of the mooring buoy largely depends on what it needs to hold up. If you are in shallow water it needn't be as big as if you are in deep water.

Use rope if you want but chain is unlikely to damage your bow fitting if it is done properly.

As for the pick up buoy; big is not necessarily better. On my boat a big pick up buoy would be a real nuisance as it would be a bit of a chinese puzzle to get it through the pulpit and round the furling gear. Personally, I prefer the pick up buoys with a metal hoop rather then the all moulded buoys.....they are easier to get at with a boat hook. If you pick up your buoy by the line rather than the buoy itself it doesn't really matter what the buoy is.
 
I find having a chain pennant with a loop, with a rope strop (with hose for anti-chafe) shackled to it gives me most flexibility - if it is forecast rough then the chain gets used, but for normal mooring the rope strop suffices. I am howvere lucky to have enough room between the moorings to get away with a longer than normal pennant which is a result of this setup.

On pickup buoy, i recently returned to my mooring after a few days away to find no pickup buoy which made life rather interesting- what had happened is that the thin line had wrapped itself around the pennant and the chain had pulled it under - it must be just on the margin of having enough flotation to support the 10mm chain part of the pennant. Lesson learnt - make sure it has not wrapped when I leave.
 
I've been using a swinging mooring for 9 years now. I won't comment on the mooring itself as I use a boatyard mooring. For the strops I use two three-strand polyester ropes - polyester doesn't stretch as much as nylon, but lasts longer under UV. I have a 23-foot boat and use 18mm rope - it may not be as good as octoplait, but I bought it cheap at a boat show. 18mm might be overkill, but it has lasted. I have some reinforced flexible tubing that I use for chafe protection. You need to be a bit careful with the tubing - some will go brittle from UV, but mine has lasted for years and is still flexible. The tubing I have is transparent, with lattice reinforcing within the tube wall. I use a standard pick-up buoy, which has proved fine - although I like the idea of using a flag buoy so you don't need a boathook.

I singlehand, and picking up the mooring is dead easy. I usually leave the inflatable tied to the mooring, with the mooring strops and pickup buoy in the inflatable - stops the strops going too green.
 
Anyone with an interest in swinging moorings should get hold of a copy of the book "Towards Zero Failures in Swinging Moorings" by Jim Izzard, as he has done a fantastic job in compiling a record of best practice from various harbour authorities and mooring contractors in the West Country. ( zerofailmooring@yahoo.co.uk )

I think there's also a mooring association on the west coast of Scotland that has some excellent ideas on what works well.
 
As for the pickup buoy I am thinking big is easier to hook when things are a little frantic?
Click to expand...

Never try and hook the handle on a pickup buoy - you have a length of rope attaching it to the main riser which is much longer and easier to pick up ,pull on deck and put over the bow roller rather than fishing for a narrow handle
 
Rigger Mortice said:
It's probably best to look around and see what others do in your area. These things seem to change from one place to another but, in any event, your local harbour master/river authority will probably stipulate what they expect to be done. The size of the mooring buoy largely depends on what it needs to hold up. If you are in shallow water it needn't be as big as if you are in deep water.

Use rope if you want but chain is unlikely to damage your bow fitting if it is done properly.

As for the pick up buoy; big is not necessarily better. On my boat a big pick up buoy would be a real nuisance as it would be a bit of a chinese puzzle to get it through the pulpit and round the furling gear. Personally, I prefer the pick up buoys with a metal hoop rather then the all moulded buoys.....they are easier to get at with a boat hook. If you pick up your buoy by the line rather than the buoy itself it doesn't really matter what the buoy is.
Click to expand...

Lots of people do not realise that the grab handle on the bouy is for getting hold of it once you have hooked it with the boat hook. You hook the boat hook under the line not through the hand grab on the bouy;pull up the buoy;,get hold of it and then I always loop it around a cleat so as to prevent any forward motion in the boat.I then thread it over the bow roller and pull in the mooring strop.I use a pick up bouy line thick enough long enough and strong enough to hold the boat. This is particularly useful if its blowing a strong wind where I would take as much of the bouy line over the side whilst there is slack in it and fasten it of which then gives me time to thread the rest of it outboard and in through the bow roller and secure it to my samson post.I can then if necessary use my anchor windlass to wind in the strop.
I have developed this to a fine art single handed with ten tons of boat.
 
Be very careful about sheathing the strop in pipe. Whilst Steve says he has had no problem, how do you know when you fit it which type will harden and crack. The cracks usually occur over the bow roller or gunwhale and the sharp edges of the pipe cut the strop they are meant to be protecting.


Mitsybrokenmooring2.jpg



RoseAnnbrokenmooring3.jpg



The end of the pipe can cut the strop as well


chafedline.jpg
 
ffiill said:
Lots of people do not realise that the grab handle on the bouy is for getting hold of it once you have hooked it with the boat hook. You hook the boat hook under the line not through the hand grab on the bouy;pull up the buoy;,get hold of it and then I always loop it around a cleat so as to prevent any forward motion in the boat.I then thread it over the bow roller and pull in the mooring strop.I use a pick up bouy line thick enough long enough and strong enough to hold the boat. This is particularly useful if its blowing a strong wind where I would take as much of the bouy line over the side whilst there is slack in it and fasten it of which then gives me time to thread the rest of it outboard and in through the bow roller and secure it to my samson post.I can then if necessary use my anchor windlass to wind in the strop.
I have developed this to a fine art single handed with ten tons of boat.
Click to expand...

Much more eloquently put than my post 11 trying to describe the same technique except my line is spliced to chain which I bring over the bow roller and tie off.Would worry me to death leaving the boat on just warp and certainly as post 12 by Lakesailor with no drop nose pin to stop it jumping out.
 
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I use chain, but the distance between boats meant that she was tugging rather hard on the short chain, so I fitted a rubberry snubber thing which I prefer.
If feeling wealthy, s/s chain on the foredeck makes a lot less mess.
If you must use pipe and rope, as Lakesailor points out you are wise to change the pipe every year. Personally I am paranoid about chafe and only use chain. The bow rollers are over 50 years old and have had a chain mooring strop on since 1986, no sign of any degradation due to the chain yet.

We have three boat hooks, the shortest of which is used exclusively for picking up the mooring - it's not much use for anything else but is perfect for wielding in a confined space.

If you leave the dinghy on the mooring, that is an extra pick-up buoy to aim for. You can even leave the pick up buoy in the dinghy for your grateful 1st mate to lift out without getting wet and slimy hands. (We have a lower freeboard than most modern boats so picking up a buoy from the water or) Extra brownie points are to be had by going forward to do the (manly) job of hauling in the chain over the bow roller, complete with seaweed. :)
 
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ffiill said:
Lots of people do not realise that the grab handle on the buoy is for getting hold of it once you have hooked it with the boat hook. You hook the boat hook under the line not through the hand grab on the buoy;pull up the buoy;,get hold of it and then I always loop it around a cleat so as to prevent any forward motion in the boat.
Click to expand...

Ironically I had the same thought just before I successfully managed to hook the pickup buoy through the handle.

Lots of helpful ideas. Pick up buoy in the tender! I like that too. All this too-ing and fro-ing to the boat out on the mooring has been an education I have been sailing for years but its amazing how simple logic takes a back seat. It was only on the second day that I worked out if I attached the tender to the pickup buoy I could walk that around to the stern (The first time I climbed down to it from the bow only then realised I didn't have an outboard or oars with me) Thanks for the advice, keep it coming.

I am not too concerned about the pipe cutting the line, as I will have my hands on it regularly I will just replace as needed. At the moment it has a length of that woven reinforced clear stuff that was lying around from the refit.

In reality I will probably use rope until I get over myself and end up using rope and chain. After all the bow roller is designed with chain in mind (might have to use stainless though)
 
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Chiliblue said:
All you seasoned swingers out there could you answer some questions?

Mooring Buoys. I don't intend to use the ring at the top of those buoys with a metal rod that goes through the centre. So should I still use one or can I use a round buoy/fender with a plastic/rubber eye at the bottom to hold up the chain? My concern (I might be over thinking this) is the plastic/rubber eye shackled to the chain, is that going to be a problem?
Click to expand...

The best solution are the foam filled pill shaped buoys which have a thick tube through the centre so the mooring chain riser can pass right through. You shackle your boat lines direct to the riser. Thats what used at most commercial moorings I have had - if my memory wakes up I will tell you the make of them.

Chiliblue said:
Size, the main function of the mooring buoy is to mark the mooring and to hold up the chain. So how big should I be looking at 40cm dia - 50cm dia - even bigger?
Click to expand...

The buoy manufacturer will telkl you what weight of chain the buoy will support

Chiliblue said:
As for the pickup buoy I am thinking big is easier to hook when things are a little frantic?
Click to expand...

Not necessarily. Often you find yourself hooking onto the rope attached to the pick up

Chiliblue said:
Chain vs Rope, this I have read a lot on, chain is obviously more robust but will slowly eat my bow fitting. I am going to go with nylon 3 strand sheathed in pipe where it passes through at the bow. One main line and one backup. Does that seem reasonable?

Tom
Click to expand...

Yes but not three strand. If your swivel is anything other than free, your 3 strand can be unwound as the boat circles its mooring buoy. Use multiplait. And use two of them.
 
stevebrassett said:
I've been using a swinging mooring for 9 years now. I won't comment on the mooring itself as I use a boatyard mooring. For the strops I use two three-strand polyester ropes - polyester doesn't stretch as much as nylon, but lasts longer under UV. I have a 23-foot boat and use 18mm rope - it may not be as good as octoplait, but I bought it cheap at a boat show. 18mm might be overkill, but it has lasted. I have some reinforced flexible tubing that I use for chafe protection. You need to be a bit careful with the tubing - some will go brittle from UV, but mine has lasted for years and is still flexible. The tubing I have is transparent, with lattice reinforcing within the tube wall. I use a standard pick-up buoy, which has proved fine - although I like the idea of using a flag buoy so you don't need a boathook.

I singlehand, and picking up the mooring is dead easy. I usually leave the inflatable tied to the mooring, with the mooring strops and pickup buoy in the inflatable - stops the strops going too green.
Click to expand...

Yep, +1

If you tie the dinghy to the mooring buoy and target the painter with your bow you should have enough time to go and collect the strop out of the dinghy.
 
Bosun Higgs said:
The best solution are the foam filled pill shaped buoys which have a thick tube through the centre so the mooring chain riser can pass right through. You shackle your boat lines direct to the riser. Thats what used at most commercial moorings I have had - if my memory wakes up I will tell you the make of them.



.....

Yes but not three strand. If your swivel is anything other than free, your 3 strand can be unwound as the boat circles its mooring buoy. Use multiplait. And use two of them.
Click to expand...

Shackling your strop to the riser, you usually need a swivel.

If your three strand gets wound up or unwound, it's giving you notice to sort the swivel before the chain gets wound up.

Two strops is little better than one. One than is big and reliable is better than two that will fail in turn.
If you use the biggest three strand that is feasible, thee is no space for a second one.
All the parts of your mooring must be beyond reproach and inspected often enough.
Back-ups and redundancy are usually just pretending.

If you do use the rod through a mooring buoy, you need to inspect the bottom of it regularly, you can do that by capsizing the buoy by lifting the riser with a small tackle from the bow. Some buoys also need a more serious locknut on the rod!
I found a swivel in the strop on top the buoy to work very well.

There are many ways to do the job, the detail is what makes a proper job.
And different things work for different boats or different places.
 
lw395 said:
Shackling your strop to the riser, you usually need a swivel.

If your three strand gets wound up or unwound, it's giving you notice to sort the swivel before the chain gets wound up.

Two strops is little better than one. One than is big and reliable is better than two that will fail in turn.
If you use the biggest three strand that is feasible, thee is no space for a second one.
All the parts of your mooring must be beyond reproach and inspected often enough.
Back-ups and redundancy are usually just pretending.
Click to expand...

I have room for 2, With the primary anchor off the bow I have 2 bow rollers free and chunky cleats to lead them too or I could go round the windlass. Size of strop size is really only limited by how I tie them off, a sliced loop then I can go really thick, if I cleat them off I can probably go to 20mm easily.

There is plenty of opinion at the sailing club... some straight to the riser, others bar buoy with a swivel on top and strops to that... then the chain/rope strop debate.
 
The best mooring I've ever seen was a friend of mine's in Scotland. He has a fish farm buoy which is about 5' long and 2' wide sausage shape and stands upright in the water. At 3am in a dark, dark Loch Fyne he just drove into it and I reached over and pulled the rope off the top. The rope was dry, the buoy did no damage to the boat (it's soft!) and I didn't have to muck about in the dark when all I wanted to do was sleep :D
 
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